by 79Royal » 28 Sep 2009 14:15
by strap » 28 Sep 2009 14:19
by Wycombe Royal » 28 Sep 2009 14:20
weybridgewandererWycombe Royal
There have been plenty of articles on the official site about what Rodgers wants to acheive and how he wants to achieve it and that is what he has presented to all the players, including those that have left (remember the article about him presenting it to Doyle??) and those that have joined.
I'll assume by the fact you continue not to tell me what tis great platform is that you are as confused about what he is try to achieve and how he is going about achieving it as he is.
by Barry the bird boggler » 28 Sep 2009 14:21
by strap » 28 Sep 2009 14:23
79Royal Great stats Strap, as always.
Quick question, probably stupid: How come only 83 seasons when we are 138 years old?
World Wars aside, of course. Thanks.
by Barry the bird boggler » 28 Sep 2009 14:35
strap79Royal Great stats Strap, as always.
Quick question, probably stupid: How come only 83 seasons when we are 138 years old?
World Wars aside, of course. Thanks.
We only started playing League football in 1920. No League football was played 1939-1945, starting again in 1946.
1920/20 to 1938/39 is 19 seasons
1946/47 to 2009/10 is 64 seasons, hence we are in our 83 season of League football.
I'm trying to track down our lineups during our Southern League and Western League days, but whilst I can find season summaries for individual players, I haven't as yet come across actual team lineups. So any resources would be gratefully received.
by Wimb » 28 Sep 2009 15:08
strap You raise a number of interestng points Wimb, but at present there are more similarities betweem BR and TB2 than with BR and AP. For example, AP stuck with a system the players knew (4-4-2) and only developed it into another (4-5-1) after a considerable time. With BR we have what seems like a different team playing a different formation every game.
Of the rubbish AP inherited from TB2, was it possible to define a settled core? I don't think it was, so really AP wasn't in much of a different position than BR.
I suppose what we are seeing here is something as dramatic as Jack Mansell when he took over from Roy Bentley in 1969. A long time ago even for me, but I recall he changed the entire squad round in little over 12 months, I think retaining only Denis Allen from the squad he inherited. There were certainly rumbles of discontent then, and indeed some pretty embarassing results, (0-1 to Brentwood FFS!), before it all clicked and they went on an 18 match unbeaten run. However, again, Mansell had a system he stuck with, and bought players he knew could play with that system.
It would be fantastic for something similar to happen this year, but on the evidence to date, the BR Big Book of Football (or whatever it's called), is frankly laughable. He needs to keep things simple, (footballers after all are generally pretty simple souls who like certainty and routine), stop making panic changes to formations, starting lineups and substitutions, and instill in the players on the training ground simple roles and responsibilities that they can understand and have the ability to carry out. The World Class nonsense can wait until they can do the simple things well.
Can't wait for tomorrow night - when it all comes together and we wipe Preston off the park! Why is it that before every game I alsways think "This is the one!" where we'll really pull it all together? Clearly I'm a hopeless case.
by strap » 28 Sep 2009 15:52
Wimb Even more bemusing is how the 4-4-2 Diamond produced the best home display of the season against Cardiff and in the 1st half vs Boro, and then he changes again
by ElmParker » 28 Sep 2009 16:14
strap RFC history suggests that we are most successful with a settled team playing a stable formation. At present we have neither of these things, so history suggests we are in for a rocky ride this season.
by coyrls » 28 Sep 2009 16:16
Wycombe Royal All I said was that he seems to have a clear strategy on how he wants to progress unlike Bullivant and Burns. I was not, and have not, passed any verdict on whether I agree with it or whether it is working, or even whether I have any idea what it is. All I know is that it is "world class".
by Wycombe Royal » 28 Sep 2009 16:25
coyrlsWycombe Royal All I said was that he seems to have a clear strategy on how he wants to progress unlike Bullivant and Burns. I was not, and have not, passed any verdict on whether I agree with it or whether it is working, or even whether I have any idea what it is. All I know is that it is "world class".
I think that's all any of us know because in fact his strategy is not clear; it consists of a lot of management consultant type sound bites that, as is the way with management consultants, look good on Power Point but in fact provide no useful information.
by weybridgewanderer » 28 Sep 2009 16:45
Wycombe Royal
All I said was that he seems to have a clear strategy on how he wants to progress unlike Bullivant and Burns. I was not, and have not, passed any verdict on whether I agree with it or whether it is working, or even whether I have any idea what it is. All I know is that it is "world class".
by Tails » 28 Sep 2009 16:53
strapWimb Even more bemusing is how the 4-4-2 Diamond produced the best home display of the season against Cardiff and in the 1st half vs Boro, and then he changes again
I missed those games, but was at the Burton game where we were 4-4-2 diamond. Leaving the ground that evening I was really hopeful that that formation might be the answer. The problem with it is that with the likes of Kebe fannying about on the wing, (and this isn't going to become a Kebe is crap rant), the whole diamond shape falls apart. The 2 wider players in teh diamond MUST be able to move effectively across the width of the pitch depending on whether we are attacking or defending. Thise positions need to be filled by intelligent, skilled and above all fit players who can read the play wekk, as to me thay are the key to the system working. I'm afraid Kebe, (or indeed many others I can think of have all the attributes).
In the first half against Burton, Sigurdsson and Henry played the roles as well as any I've seen, but Siggy in particular tired in the second half. Sadly it hasn't really been persevered with.
I do like the look of Sigurdsson, and still feel Henry would have developed far further than he has, had he been given the support and patience that has been heaped on Kebe. Hopefully there's still time for him to come good.
by Maguire » 28 Sep 2009 17:16
strapWimb Even more bemusing is how the 4-4-2 Diamond produced the best home display of the season against Cardiff and in the 1st half vs Boro, and then he changes again
I missed those games, but was at the Burton game where we were 4-4-2 diamond. Leaving the ground that evening I was really hopeful that that formation might be the answer. The problem with it is that with the likes of Kebe fannying about on the wing, (and this isn't going to become a Kebe is crap rant), the whole diamond shape falls apart. The 2 wider players in teh diamond MUST be able to move effectively across the width of the pitch depending on whether we are attacking or defending. Thise positions need to be filled by intelligent, skilled and above all fit players who can read the play wekk, as to me thay are the key to the system working. I'm afraid Kebe, (or indeed many others I can think of have all the attributes).
In the first half against Burton, Sigurdsson and Henry played the roles as well as any I've seen, but Siggy in particular tired in the second half. Sadly it hasn't really been persevered with.
I do like the look of Sigurdsson, and still feel Henry would have developed far further than he has, had he been given the support and patience that has been heaped on Kebe. Hopefully there's still time for him to come good.
by strap » 28 Sep 2009 18:57
Maguire He doesn't play Kebe wide in the 4-4-2 diamond though, he plays him wide in the 4-2-3-1 or whatever you want to call it.
In your instances cited about - Cardiff at home and Posh first half - Kebe didn't play. In fact against Cardiff we suffered through lack of width and only when he brought Kebe on to play wide right did the crosses start to come over.
Seperately, I thought Henry was toss against Burton Albion and at the time people on here said "how would you like to be played out of your natural postion?"
by strap » 28 Sep 2009 19:01
Tails Top posting here ^ (aside from the typos)
by Ryn » 29 Sep 2009 07:59
by Royal With Cheese » 29 Sep 2009 08:19
by Wycombe Royal » 29 Sep 2009 09:20
weybridgewandererWycombe Royal
All I said was that he seems to have a clear strategy on how he wants to progress unlike Bullivant and Burns. I was not, and have not, passed any verdict on whether I agree with it or whether it is working, or even whether I have any idea what it is. All I know is that it is "world class".
So why do you think Bullivant and Burns did not have some sort of strategy they were working against? I suspect they did have a good idea where they were going and what they wanted to achieve
by andrew1957 » 29 Sep 2009 10:50
strap Well we are now 9 games into a 46 game league season, nigh on 20% of the way through the campaign. So I thought I would update the stats on starts to the season. I’ve added a bit more info, including a look at the number of players utilised by the various managers over the years in the first 9 games as well as the total used each season. In an effort to try to remain consistent, I have ignored players who have only made sub apps, and I have also ignored cup games. This way our record pre-1960, (no subs or LC), can be compared against our modern record.
BR has used 24 different players in the starting 9 league games (30 if you then add the 2 LC games). Only Tommy Burns with 26 in 1998/99 beats the League record.
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