Perspective

[weybridgewanderer]

we can't beat the teams above us (haven't yet beaten a top 6 team)

That doesn't mean we are also beating the teams below us often enough far too many draws

I know you don't say things WILL happen but as per your other thread, you ARE optimistic (nothing like offering a hedged point of view, you can't be wrong)

So, let's see. We haven't beaten a top six team. OK. That's 9 games D5 L4 8-13

So in the other 20 Games? W10 D7 L3 35-18 = 37 Points, a smidgeon short of very good indeed!


Looks OK to me. We have 14 such games to come, worth 26 points, taking us to 68 plus we have Norwich, Leeds, Forest

That ought to put us on 70 points. We need just one extra win to be on 73 and in with a good shout of the POs

So you think we will make the plays ( i appreciate you are not saying we actually will but you think we will)

I don't think we will make the play offs ( I am not saying we actually will not, just that I think we will not)

You consider yourself optimistic, I consider myself realistic

lets see

[leww_rfc]

____________________P__PTS
1. Newcastle_______28..59
2. WBA___________29..56
3. Nottm Forest____29..55
4. Cardiff City_____28..45
5. Swansea City____28..45
6. Leicester City___27..42
7. Sheffield Utd____29..42
8. Blackpool_______29..40
9. Barnsley________28..39
10. Middlesbrough___29..38
11. Bristol City______28..37
12. Watford________28..35
13. Preston________28..35
14. QPR__________28..34
15. Coventry City___29..34
16. Crystal Palace__28..33
17. Doncaster_____27..33
18. Derby County___29..33
19. Scunthorpe_____28..33
20. Sheffield Wed___29..31
21. Ipswich Town___28..30
22. Reading_______28..29
23. Plymouth______27..24
24. Peterborough___29..21

Still can't get over this ... The table 6th February 2010, i'm still confident as anything really is possible

[Snowball]

we can't beat the teams above us (haven't yet beaten a top 6 team)

That doesn't mean we are also beating the teams below us often enough far too many draws

I know you don't say things WILL happen but as per your other thread, you ARE optimistic (nothing like offering a hedged point of view, you can't be wrong)

So, let's see. We haven't beaten a top six team. OK. That's 9 games D5 L4 8-13

So in the other 20 Games? W10 D7 L3 35-18 = 37 Points, a smidgeon short of very good indeed!


Looks OK to me. We have 14 such games to come, worth 26 points, taking us to 68 plus we have Norwich, Leeds, Forest

That ought to put us on 70 points. We need just one extra win to be on 73 and in with a good shout of the POs

So you think we will make the plays ( i appreciate you are not saying we actually will but you think we will)

I don't think we will make the play offs ( I am not saying we actually will not, just that I think we will not)

You consider yourself optimistic, I consider myself realistic

lets see

Actually, based on that post I am saying 70 points, and that we'd need to find an extra 3 from somewhere "to have a shout"... that's hardly saying we will, is it?

[Cookie]

We had little right to expect anything from Cardiff, and a home draw v QPR was likely.

What matters is the block of games, and from the 7 games, we needed 11 points.

That hasn't changed. It's just got harder. Now we need ten points from 5 games

A 2-2 Cardiff
H 0-1 QPR

A Norwich
A Sheffield
H Watford
H Millwall
A Palace

So now we HAVE to win those two home games (and hurt two rivals), we have to win at Sheffield or Palace (or maybe both). That would be 13 points from 7 games. If we could do that and get something at Norwich, we'd be on 2+ ppg for this block of games.

I believe if we can avoid defeat at Norwich, we'll get at least 10 points from those 5 games, 11 from 7. Maybe more.

I'm not sure whether you were there Snowball, but I saw two quite different teams on Friday.
The green hoops are a team ready for the Premier League, the blue hoops are a team not yet ready for the Premier League.

[weybridgewanderer]

Actually, based on that post I am saying 70 points, and that we'd need to find an extra 3 from somewhere "to have a shout"... that's hardly saying we will, is it?

So what do you think snowball? do you thionk we'll make the play offs or do you think we will miss out

onme thread you say you are optimistic

this thread you say 70+1 other win but you then say "in with a shout is hardly making it"

Come on, you prepared to nail your colours to the mast, or are you happy getting splinters on your arse off the fence you are sitting on?

I think we will miss out, what do you think?

[Snowball]

Actually, based on that post I am saying 70 points, and that we'd need to find an extra 3 from somewhere "to have a shout"... that's hardly saying we will, is it?

So what do you think snowball? do you thionk we'll make the play offs or do you think we will miss out

onme thread you say you are optimistic

this thread you say 70+1 other win but you then say "in with a shout is hardly making it"

Come on, you prepared to nail your colours to the mast, or are you happy getting splinters on your arse off the fence you are sitting on?

I think we will miss out, what do you think?

In other places I've been quite specific.

I believe, IF we get 3+ points from Norwich/Sheffield United we will end up on 73/74

If we lose at Norwich and don't win at Sheffield, I think the gap will be too big and we will soon start playing fringe players.

I would feel very different if we had won at Cardiff or drawn with QPR.

That's why I think the next two games could finish us off. A big result at Norwich, win at Sheffield and I will REALLY fancy our chances, but LD and I think it's goodbye.

[Snowball]

I'm not sure whether you were there Snowball, but I saw two quite different teams on Friday.
The green hoops are a team ready for the Premier League, the blue hoops are a team not yet ready for the Premier League.

Oh, absolutely. (And yes I was there, and at Cardiff, and at Hull, and at Doncaster, and at Swansea, and at Watford, and at QPR)

But TBF we were without our star midfielder, our star striker was crocked,
and we played a striker utterly out of form who was invisible apart from one shot.

Our first eleven on its day is a very good side, but we don't have the depth QPR have got

[Hoop Blah]

I wouldn't say that QPR team are ready for the Premier League. Ready to win this league yes, but they'll need some heavy investment to be a Premier League team.

The likes of Hill, Gorkss, Derry, Hulse etc are a long way short of the level required.

[Ian Royal]

I wouldn't say that QPR team are ready for the Premier League. Ready to win this league yes, but they'll need some heavy investment to be a Premier League team.

The likes of Hill, Gorkss, Derry, Hulse etc are a long way short of the level required.

Agree, without a few ins they will struggle. Taraabt carries them in the Championship and he won't be able to do it when he's a small fish in the Premier League.

[Arch]

Random perspective contribution:

A year ago today, Blackpool lost their second home game on the trot and were stuck on 40 points from 29 games. Things didn't improve much in the next two games either (1 point). Shortly later...

Blackpool seem a long way up, but they could yet get dragged into the fray. As an indicator, while they were 14 points ahead of us with the same games played in late January, by the end of Saturday they could be 3 points ahead of us with two more games played. Obviously that would entail them losing tonight and us beating Palace, but it shows how even a team in the top ten could still be in trouble. Their recent form is dire.

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=96826&p=2497777#p24977

I should note that it seems highly unlikely to me that anyone will make the playoffs with the 70 points that worked for Blackpool.

[Snowball]

Random perspective contribution:

A year ago today, Blackpool lost their second home game on the trot and were stuck on 40 points from 29 games. Things didn't improve much in the next two games either (1 point). Shortly later...

Blackpool seem a long way up, but they could yet get dragged into the fray. As an indicator, while they were 14 points ahead of us with the same games played in late January, by the end of Saturday they could be 3 points ahead of us with two more games played. Obviously that would entail them losing tonight and us beating Palace, but it shows how even a team in the top ten could still be in trouble. Their recent form is dire.

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=96826&p=2497777#p24977

I should note that it seems highly unlikely to me that anyone will make the playoffs with the 70 points that worked for Blackpool.

Interesting, thanks, but to add to that, if we win one of our next two (Norwich and Sheffield United away)
we will be on 45 after 31. You say Blackpool were on 41 from 31... so should we match them we'd make 74
points and 74 has a good chance of a PO place.

[Elmer Park]

So far this season I don't think we have ever looked a top six side over any period of matches and have always expected us to finish between eight and twelfth. However we still have a chance of making the play offs but there is little room for many more slip ups and we must start stringing victories together very soon. To do this we are going to need a lot of things to come together and a bit of old fashioned luck too

I think we will need to avoid injuries to Kebe, McAnuff, Leigertwood and Long and probably Federici too and we need them all to find or maintain top form. In particular we could do with Kebe rediscovering his form from this time last year and start scoring goals regularly again. It is a big ask but I think we may also need Manset to come good pretty much immediately because unless he does I think we are going to continue to lose or draw tight matches we might otherwise have won.

Defensively I think what you see is what you get and I think we are pretty much good enough in that area except for the obvious problems Harte has against pace. Think we will just have to live with that for this season at least and hope his direct opponents don't make the most of the opportunities where he can do nothing about it.

We will also need the rub of the green in a few matches to sneak a result or two. If we restrict opponents to one shot on target as we did against QPR we need that shot to go straight at Federici. We are also going to need breaks like Cardiff got last Tuesday to start going our way and certainly not against us.

It seems like a lot of ifs to me and several Clubs in a similar position have made more obviously immediately progressive signings in the last window but if we can get three wins in a row pretty soon who knows where momentum might take us.

[weybridgewanderer]

So what do you think snowball? do you think we'll make the play offs or do you think we will miss out

on another thread you say you are optimistic

this thread you say 70+1 other win but you then say "in with a shout is hardly making it"

Come on, you prepared to nail your colours to the mast, or are you happy getting splinters on your arse off the fence you are sitting on?

I think we will miss out, what do you think?

[Focher]

One thing Friday night brought into perspective to me was the fact that our best player over the last 2 months, Leigertwood, is a QPR reject. I fully understand why we work to a strict budget and don't have a particular problem with it, but the fact that our best player is their player brings into perspective the ambition between us and the top clubs.

[weybridgewanderer]

Well Snowball? We going to make the play offs? what is your opinion?

[Alan Partridge]

A Norwich
A Sheffield
H Watford
H Millwall
A Palace

Looking at that lot, it's a tough run of games but I think it's a good run of games. Norwich for how well they've done actually haven't been all that good at home. It's away they've been excellent. Pressure off Reading there a bit, missing Leigertwood is obviously a blow but not beyond the realms of possibility in my opinion they might get something there.

Sheffield United isn't the daunting trip it used to be, even then Reading have a terrific record there so again definitely a winnable game.

Watford and Millwall both done well this season but again both winnable games at home and finally Palace who haven't conceeded a goal at home for 5 games or something silly, so that's probably the toughest game of the lot on current form.

I'll give Reading 1 pt at Norwich, 3pts at Sheff Utd, 1pt with Watford, 3pts with Millwall and 0 pts off Palace.

8 points, probably not going to be enough for top 6, but again whilst Reading do have an outside chance of top 6 I don't think they are quite ready yet. I tink there are better more consistant teams in the league that are a year or two further down the line with their development than Reading.

No disgrace this year finishing 8th-9th.

[Jeffers217]

From observation of other teams this season, QPR included, we could easily get into the play offs. What is going to decide that is the team that is put out week by week and the style of football we play. If we keep a centre back partnership of Mills-Pearce, Pearce-Ivar or Mills-Ivar we won't get in there because they play hoof-bloody-ball. Sorry to keep harping on but Zurab is BY FAR the best player we have in that position and complements any of the others extremely well. I imagine the reason he ent playing is because of a long-term view of playing the younger players, no doubt it's to save money on WAGES. Also, without Leigertwood we are pretty week in that centre midfield, evidently we are going to need to sign one who can get forward and offer something different. Playing against Reading is becoming easier as if the other teams block our wingers, we have no plan B

[andrew1957]

No disgrace this year finishing 8th-9th.

In one sense this is true but the reason I have probably become more STG than RTG these days is about the overall ambition of the club. Up until a couple of seasons ago I felt every year that in general we were improving the quality of the squad. Some departures of big name players like Doyle were always inevitable as you cannot expect them to stay in the Championship when they are wanted in the PL. However, we did seem to buy relatively proven players to replace them.

Now we have gone back to buying in young talent - which again is fine BUT I only see us as being considerably weaker next season than this season. Long, Fed, Kebe, McAnuff and possibly Pearce and Mills are all likely to be the target of more ambitious PL or Championship clubs and the club have indicated that their replacements will be unproven youngsters.

So 8-9th this year very easily becomes a relegation fight next season.

So I think this is showing perspective. If we don't go up this season I see an increasing struggle to survive even at this level in the seasons ahead.

[Alan Partridge]

understand your point andrew, folk have said similar things for the last couple of years and the players coming in have stepped up. Lose Sigurdsson it's all over, Long has stepped up. Filled the goals void.

Got the likes of Manset and Morrison to add to the picture, got a host of promising young goalies and i don't think Reading will lose everyone if they don't go up. I think Federici could be replaced, I think Mills could be replaced and maybe one of the wingers could be replaced by not signing anybody. If those players were to go, Reading would sign 1 or 2 players as well, so things would move on and they'll be competitive again next season.

[Hoop Blah]

So I think this is showing perspective. If we don't go up this season I see an increasing struggle to survive even at this level in the seasons ahead.

I don't think we need to go up so much as learn when we need to bring in some extra quality and look to be a little more ambitions in order to move in the right direction.

If not we're treading water. That's not the kind of club good players want to stay at or join because they want to be pushing on and trying to win and better themselves. We'll be able to pick up some promising players, but the better ones will be tempted elsewhere by the likes of 'Boro, Leeds, Cardiff, QPR, Portsmouth, Forest, Ipswhich, Swansea etc etc who I assume currently look like offering better prospects than us (in the eyes of a neutral player).