CONFIMRED - The final countdown

[Mid Sussex Royal]

Sadly, I think it’ll end in liquidation.

Again, why? Let's reject £30m and then let the club be liquidated so I get fcuk all.

The most likely explanation is he likes the gaming mindset, and he'd rather liquidation rather than "lose" in negotiations. But even then, he and many others lose out big time in a liquidation scenario.

He’s done it to two other clubs and I could see him just writing off his losses. As much as that doesn’t make sense he’s not a rational man. I’d also imagine the demonstrations have hurt his pride/feelings and I could see him doing it out of pure spite. Obviously, I hope I am wrong, but I don’t see a happy ending.

Agree with this, the culture in China/SE Asia is different to here....its similar to Chansiri at Sheffield

[WestYorksRoyal]

Again, why? Let's reject £30m and then let the club be liquidated so I get fcuk all.

The most likely explanation is he likes the gaming mindset, and he'd rather liquidation rather than "lose" in negotiations. But even then, he and many others lose out big time in a liquidation scenario.

He’s done it to two other clubs and I could see him just writing off his losses. As much as that doesn’t make sense he’s not a rational man. I’d also imagine the demonstrations have hurt his pride/feelings and I could see him doing it out of pure spite. Obviously, I hope I am wrong, but I don’t see a happy ending.

Agree with this, the culture in China/SE Asia is different to here....its similar to Chansiri at Sheffield

Everyone talks about the culture, saving face, not being shamed etc.,. This is a man who has acted with no shame. He clearly doesn't give a shit about his reputation, and if he does he should pay his staff.

[Franchise FC]

Anybody else starting to get seriously concerned that Dai's not going this season?

If there are 4 parties interested in buying Reading, there will be 4 sets of du diligence, 4 sets of negotiations.

The owner will be playing these offers against one another, its an auction of sorts.

Depending on who the winner is, it could be a number of weeks until they meet the Fit n Propa test, due to the number of parties involved and their source of funds, especially if they live abroad.

I would expect were a deal to be done before Xmas that if its a foreign consortium we might see fit n propa passed by late Feb?

If it was Mike Ashley for real, it might be quicker, given his source of wealth is very public and very well known.

Tbh i dont think Mike Ashley would see us as a venture he'd be interested in, he's more interest in buying assets with no other buyers interested, and picking them up for close to zero so that there is almost no down side risk. If he's having to compete with 3 other buyers he isn't getting it for next to nothing and it represents significant risk.

I've never been involved in any deal where due diligence was performed BEFORE becoming the preferred bidder
DD is extremely expensive and to do it 'on spec' is ridiculously unlikely
Besides, it would mean opening up the books for more than one entity at a time. More likely now than it used to be because of the use of technology but still pretty unlikely

Maybe some of the other Nobbers that remain in the industry can update my experience if this isn't the case

[Greatwesternline]

Anybody else starting to get seriously concerned that Dai's not going this season?

If there are 4 parties interested in buying Reading, there will be 4 sets of du diligence, 4 sets of negotiations.

The owner will be playing these offers against one another, its an auction of sorts.

Depending on who the winner is, it could be a number of weeks until they meet the Fit n Propa test, due to the number of parties involved and their source of funds, especially if they live abroad.

I would expect were a deal to be done before Xmas that if its a foreign consortium we might see fit n propa passed by late Feb?

If it was Mike Ashley for real, it might be quicker, given his source of wealth is very public and very well known.

Tbh i dont think Mike Ashley would see us as a venture he'd be interested in, he's more interest in buying assets with no other buyers interested, and picking them up for close to zero so that there is almost no down side risk. If he's having to compete with 3 other buyers he isn't getting it for next to nothing and it represents significant risk.

I've never been involved in any deal where due diligence was performed BEFORE becoming the preferred bidder
DD is extremely expensive and to do it 'on spec' is ridiculously unlikely
Besides, it would mean opening up the books for more than one entity at a time. More likely now than it used to be because of the use of technology but still pretty unlikely

Maybe some of the other Nobbers that remain in the industry can update my experience if this isn't the case

Yeh i got carried aware when adding up all the delays. But i do think Dai is in no rush and would be happy to let as many people as possible take as long as possible to make bids, to drum up demand.

[WestYorksRoyal]

Seeing some real hatred for Howe online, with nobody really specifying why. This is a man who was CEO over our most successful era, and a time when the club had values we were proud of. I'd be very surprised if he is trying to screw us over. And if he is bringing less than ideal candidates to the table, perhaps he has reasonably concluded that none would be worse than Dai staying?

[morganb]

I wonder if, deep down, Dai still 'enjoys' owning Reading and doesn't want to let us go. Perhaps a part of him hopes he will soon be able to get his riches out of China and everything will be fine again. As people have said it doesn't look to be all about the money if he is willing to gamble on administration rather than take an inferior offer.

[WestYorksRoyal]

Anybody else starting to get seriously concerned that Dai's not going this season?

If there are 4 parties interested in buying Reading, there will be 4 sets of du diligence, 4 sets of negotiations.

The owner will be playing these offers against one another, its an auction of sorts.

Depending on who the winner is, it could be a number of weeks until they meet the Fit n Propa test, due to the number of parties involved and their source of funds, especially if they live abroad.

I would expect were a deal to be done before Xmas that if its a foreign consortium we might see fit n propa passed by late Feb?

If it was Mike Ashley for real, it might be quicker, given his source of wealth is very public and very well known.

Tbh i dont think Mike Ashley would see us as a venture he'd be interested in, he's more interest in buying assets with no other buyers interested, and picking them up for close to zero so that there is almost no down side risk. If he's having to compete with 3 other buyers he isn't getting it for next to nothing and it represents significant risk.

I've never been involved in any deal where due diligence was performed BEFORE becoming the preferred bidder
DD is extremely expensive and to do it 'on spec' is ridiculously unlikely
Besides, it would mean opening up the books for more than one entity at a time. More likely now than it used to be because of the use of technology but still pretty unlikely

Maybe some of the other Nobbers that remain in the industry can update my experience if this isn't the case

Agree entirely. You ask initial questions up front and try to identify red flags. But full blown DD involves a shed load of money to legal and accountancy firms. You would never go down that route without exclusivity.

[tmesis]

But it's not logical. Who in their right mind would reject a bid, put us into administration, lose control of the sale process and in all likelihood receive a lot less?

If none of the bids are up to his asking price, the only logical response would be to fund the club again, get it on firmer footing and then be in a stronger negotiating position. But we know that won't happen.

The worry is that he's just given up on a sale, and we continue the current way for years. Late HMRC payments, payday uncertainty, players leaving on frees. Who knows where that would end.

Sadly, I think it’ll end in liquidation.

Again, why? Let's reject £30m and then let the club be liquidated so I get fcuk all.

The most likely explanation is he likes the gaming mindset, and he'd rather liquidation rather than "lose" in negotiations. But even then, he and many others lose out big time in a liquidation scenario.

It depends how much he's being offered.

If it's less than he thinks he can get for selling the stadium and training ground (+ any other assets?) he probably wouldn't take it.

[maffff]

Seeing some real hatred for Howe online, with nobody really specifying why. This is a man who was CEO over our most successful era, and a time when the club had values we were proud of. I'd be very surprised if he is trying to screw us over. And if he is bringing less than ideal candidates to the table, perhaps he has reasonably concluded that none would be worse than Dai staying?

All will come out in the wash.

[Snowflake Royal]

The club itself made a statement to confirm what was happening therefore I would expect the club to do the same with any significant changes to their statement but this is Reading and they just can't be arsed to speak to the hoi poloi. MB won't even speak to Tim despite numerous requests for a chat (in essence MB just responds with "what am I meant to say about it all"). God I hate club's that think communication vacuums are a good idea.

He's spot on tbf.

[Snowflake Royal]

Administration probably

But it's not logical. Who in their right mind would reject a bid, put us into administration, lose control of the sale process and in all likelihood receive a lot less?

If none of the bids are up to his asking price, the only logical response would be to fund the club again, get it on firmer footing and then be in a stronger negotiating position. But we know that won't happen.

The worry is that he's just given up on a sale, and we continue the current way for years. Late HMRC payments, payday uncertainty, players leaving on frees. Who knows where that would end.

a slow death

No way it carries on for years. He's already got the sponsors paying wages. It's deal or liquidation.

He's also not going to refuse a deal only to put us in Adminstration and have the Administrators accept a worse deal he gets a smaller share of.

[tmesis]

But it's not logical. Who in their right mind would reject a bid, put us into administration, lose control of the sale process and in all likelihood receive a lot less?

If none of the bids are up to his asking price, the only logical response would be to fund the club again, get it on firmer footing and then be in a stronger negotiating position. But we know that won't happen.

The worry is that he's just given up on a sale, and we continue the current way for years. Late HMRC payments, payday uncertainty, players leaving on frees. Who knows where that would end.

a slow death

No way it carries on for years. He's already got the sponsors paying wages. It's deal or liquidation.

He's also not going to refuse a deal only to put us in Adminstration and have the Administrators accept a worse deal he gets a smaller share of.

I wonder how much SCL are actually paying, as a % of the total salaries. If it's all then that can't be sustainable for long for them, as a business - and would indicate Dai has completely given up.

Is the money from China all Dai's money, or do club funds go over to China, to be paid back from there?

[rabidbee]

I had assumed that the SCL money was a bridging loan, until he cleared his money from China.

[Stranded]

Seeing some real hatred for Howe online, with nobody really specifying why. This is a man who was CEO over our most successful era, and a time when the club had values we were proud of. I'd be very surprised if he is trying to screw us over. And if he is bringing less than ideal candidates to the table, perhaps he has reasonably concluded that none would be worse than Dai staying?

I'm not going in to the whys and wherefores but the reasoning is there on Twitter if you chose to read it - I'm going to leave it over there until something more concrete comes out.

[Snowflake Royal]

Seeing some real hatred for Howe online, with nobody really specifying why. This is a man who was CEO over our most successful era, and a time when the club had values we were proud of. I'd be very surprised if he is trying to screw us over. And if he is bringing less than ideal candidates to the table, perhaps he has reasonably concluded that none would be worse than Dai staying?

I'm not going in to the whys and wherefores but the reasoning is there on Twitter if you chose to read it - I'm going to leave it over there until something more concrete comes out.

Great so we have to go over to that cesspit if we want to have a clue what he's supposed to have done wrong?

[Stranded]

Seeing some real hatred for Howe online, with nobody really specifying why. This is a man who was CEO over our most successful era, and a time when the club had values we were proud of. I'd be very surprised if he is trying to screw us over. And if he is bringing less than ideal candidates to the table, perhaps he has reasonably concluded that none would be worse than Dai staying?

I'm not going in to the whys and wherefores but the reasoning is there on Twitter if you chose to read it - I'm going to leave it over there until something more concrete comes out.

Great so we have to go over to that cesspit if we want to have a clue what he's supposed to have done wrong?

Oh alright then - the STAR notes from the EFL meeting brings up the fun name of Chris Samuelson being involved - it is alleged that Howe is working with/brough CS in, hence the low level of hate.

[Brogue]

Seeing some real hatred for Howe online, with nobody really specifying why. This is a man who was CEO over our most successful era, and a time when the club had values we were proud of. I'd be very surprised if he is trying to screw us over. And if he is bringing less than ideal candidates to the table, perhaps he has reasonably concluded that none would be worse than Dai staying?

I'm not going in to the whys and wherefores but the reasoning is there on Twitter if you chose to read it - I'm going to leave it over there until something more concrete comes out.

Great so we have to go over to that cesspit if we want to have a clue what he's supposed to have done wrong?

basically it's the Samuelson link, it appears he is the one who has brought him in to broker a deal and invited him for dinner.

[Snowflake Royal]

Yeah, that would be justified tgen.

[Ten Bobsworth]

Seeing some real hatred for Howe online, with nobody really specifying why. This is a man who was CEO over our most successful era, and a time when the club had values we were proud of. I'd be very surprised if he is trying to screw us over. And if he is bringing less than ideal candidates to the table, perhaps he has reasonably concluded that none would be worse than Dai staying?

All will come out in the wash.

There'll be more spinning than washing, I can assure you.

[Ten Bobsworth]

Seeing some real hatred for Howe online, with nobody really specifying why. This is a man who was CEO over our most successful era, and a time when the club had values we were proud of. I'd be very surprised if he is trying to screw us over. And if he is bringing less than ideal candidates to the table, perhaps he has reasonably concluded that none would be worse than Dai staying?

All will come out in the wash.

There'll be more spinning than washing, I can assure you.