How can a team playing so poorly have such good current form

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facaldaqui
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Re: How can a team playing so poorly have such good current form

by facaldaqui » 08 Mar 2012 18:05

Victor Meldrew I said to my brother after the game "Do you remember Birmingham playing like we now do,the fans being unhappy with what they were watching and yet they got promoted (only to get relegated because this doesn't work in the Premier League)?"


But they came something like eighth or ninth in their first season up and only came a cropper in the second season, when they still won the League Cup.

Not that I think we wouldn't improve the team if we went up. For that matter, in my opinion we're a better team now than Birmingham were when they went up.

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Re: How can a team playing so poorly have such good current form

by Hoop Blah » 08 Mar 2012 18:40

Ideal Call me a weirdo, but this is the sort of play I enjoy.
We don't give them any chances, and when we have the ball we don't f^ck around, take no risk, and score the winner when we get the chance.

If this was Italy, the supporters would be spunking themselves with joy!!!!!!!!!!

FFS, we are a T E A M!!!!


Enjoy it but don't actually go though?

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but it's a lot easier to enjoy it when you don't actually have to watch it.

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Re: How can a team playing so poorly have such good current form

by Ian Royal » 08 Mar 2012 19:46

That's the truth!

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Re: How can a team playing so poorly have such good current form

by Great Knolly » 08 Mar 2012 19:59

The 106 team were probably at least the 10th best team in England during the Championship season. We knew we'd compete in the top division even with no additions.

Quite enjoying watching this intelligent side manage games so well , but it is a bit turgid at times. At best we're the 17th best team in the country. If we go up , this time we WILL need to buy players to survive. Zingarevich probably didn't expect to have his ambition challenged so early. If we go up, will he buy big in the summer, or wait and see till January.

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Re: How can a team playing so poorly have such good current form

by Ian Royal » 08 Mar 2012 20:48

Just caught up on the first half of Millwall. TBH, we were a bit carp for the first 20 minutes, but I thought we actually played some tidy football and kept it on the deck fairly well for the rest. Which is a surprise given how terrible the pitch looked. A few passes fell shot (from Roberts mainly I think), some clumsy defending at times and we struggled to really open them up convincingly. I think partly because once they took the lead they sort of went into their shell a bit and tried to play like an away team.

But we looked in control and like the pressure would tell eventually. Which it did.


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Re: How can a team playing so poorly have such good current form

by West Stand Man » 08 Mar 2012 21:28

I haven't the time or, to be honest, the inclination to rad all 6 pages of comment. As a result I may be repeating other peoples views or be totally out of step with many.

To start with, the title is just so wrong. If it read some thing like " How can a team not playing champagne football have ..." I might follow the logic. This team is playing outstanding football which is why it has had a run of 7 wins during which they have cionceded one goal. The tactics have been spot on and have been excellently executed by a very professional bunch of players.

What is has not been, at times, is great to watch if you are not a football fan but rather someone who wants champagne football that doesn't require any understanding of the complexities of the game.

Given the choice between watching neat passing football during a defeat, or the solid technical game that we get right now with a victory, I'll settle for the latter.

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Re: How can a team playing so poorly have such good current form

by Rev Algenon Stickleback H » 08 Mar 2012 21:38

West Stand Man Given the choice between watching neat passing football during a defeat, or the solid technical game that we get right now with a victory, I'll settle for the latter.

I don't think anyone is complaining about us not playing neat passing moves, or any kind of pretty football at all.

It's more about the lack of goalmouth action.

I really don't think we are a negative team. We always play for the win, home or away, and it works more often than not. It's just surprising how few goalscoring chances we create in a match. And the lack of chances tends to make games a bit dull.


I don't even think there's much actual complaining at all. It's just a bit odd.

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Re: How can a team playing so poorly have such good current form

by Hampshire Royal » 09 Mar 2012 09:15

I saw the last two games, and while it's true to say that we don't play like Barcelona, we are extremely good at the way we play. The only time we looked vulnerable at Millwall is after Connolly got injured ultimately leading to Millwall's goal. The change at half-time, leading to Tabb coming on and Karacan playing at RB led to us totally dominating the second half and winning comfortably. I was a bit surprised that the same team wasn't started against Pompey, but can fully understand why Cummings was started.

On a very cold night, the game against Pompey wasn't the most pleasant evening watching football and it has to be said it was pretty dull. Having said that, we won comfortably against a very physical Pompey side. Of course I'd prefer that we played fast attacking football like Barca, and maybe if we had Messi we would. We do, however, have the players we have and with the manager we have we seem to be doing exactly what's right to get promoted this year and that is what's more important to me (and I suspect the vast majority of Reading fans). I remember talking to a Leeds fan about their team in the Sixties and Seventies and saying how dull I thought they were, also talking to a Wimbledon fan where I said much the same thing. Both these people couldn't disagree more with what I said. They said that the football they played was what was needed to gain the success they had, and they talked about it as if their teams were like the modern Barca. Just as a point, it may be worth noting that Barca are ten points behind Real in La Liga, so playing the Barca way is no guarantee of success.

It's pointless talking about how we'll do next year if we do get promoted, but I do think that McDermott is clued up enough to do what's needed to stay there, he's demonstrated enough times that he can make whatever changes are necessary to ensure that the team does whatever's necessary to stay there.

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Re: How can a team playing so poorly have such good current form

by Ian Royal » 09 Mar 2012 11:15

I think you could best describe our team as workmanlike, or plodding. We're exceptionally good at it and very effective, but it's not very asthetically pleasing.

It would be nice if people didn't keep dipping into hyperbole when such a criticism comes up. No one expects "champagne" football, total football, or us to play like Brazil / Barcelona / Spain. But for us to keep the ball a bit better, pass it a bit more creatively and accurately, and rely a little less on low percentage balls to gain territory and panicky hooked/hoofed clearances to no one in particular.


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Re: How can a team playing so poorly have such good current form

by rob the royal » 09 Mar 2012 11:32

Ian Royal It would be nice if people didn't keep dipping into hyperbole when such a criticism comes up. No one expects "champagne" football, total football, or us to play like Brazil / Barcelona / Spain. But for us to keep the ball a bit better, pass it a bit more creatively and accurately, and rely a little less on low percentage balls to gain territory and panicky hooked/hoofed clearances to no one in particular.



Speak for yourself, I'm expecting Kebe to score 5 goals some time soon or I'll be off.

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Re: How can a team playing so poorly have such good current form

by Hoop Blah » 09 Mar 2012 11:35

I don't expect us to play like Barcelona but I was quite envious when I saw how well Peterborough passed the ball around.

Obviously they're not challenging us for promotion, but they're much better to watch! Getting the balance right certainly isn't an easy thing of course.

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Re: How can a team playing so poorly have such good current form

by Terminal Boardom » 09 Mar 2012 11:52

It is, ultimately, a results business. Winning is what it is all about and I admit to being surprised, pleasantly I add, that Reading are doing so well considering the sale of key players.

If the opportunity presents itself, promotion must be the aim. End of. I agree with VM that if Reading went with what they currently have in the Prem then it would be a 1 season stay. To stay up, there would need to be an influx of players which could unbalance and unsettle the current squad. Plus, there would only be 2 transfer windows in order to get the right people in.

Staying in the Championship for another season would not be a disaster as it would allow BMcD the opportunity to gradually change the playing staff in the hope that something similar to the class of 2005/06 could develop, or at least to have a squad that would survive the first season in the Prem.

Exciting times ahead - enjoy the ride :P

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Re: How can a team playing so poorly have such good current form

by Victor Meldrew » 09 Mar 2012 12:19

Hampshire Royal I saw the last two games, and while it's true to say that we don't play like Barcelona, we are extremely good at the way we play. The only time we looked vulnerable at Millwall is after Connolly got injured ultimately leading to Millwall's goal. The change at half-time, leading to Tabb coming on and Karacan playing at RB led to us totally dominating the second half and winning comfortably. I was a bit surprised that the same team wasn't started against Pompey, but can fully understand why Cummings was started.

On a very cold night, the game against Pompey wasn't the most pleasant evening watching football and it has to be said it was pretty dull. Having said that, we won comfortably against a very physical Pompey side. Of course I'd prefer that we played fast attacking football like Barca, and maybe if we had Messi we would. We do, however, have the players we have and with the manager we have we seem to be doing exactly what's right to get promoted this year and that is what's more important to me (and I suspect the vast majority of Reading fans). I remember talking to a Leeds fan about their team in the Sixties and Seventies and saying how dull I thought they were, also talking to a Wimbledon fan where I said much the same thing. Both these people couldn't disagree more with what I said. They said that the football they played was what was needed to gain the success they had, and they talked about it as if their teams were like the modern Barca. Just as a point, it may be worth noting that Barca are ten points behind Real in La Liga, so playing the Barca way is no guarantee of success.

It's pointless talking about how we'll do next year if we do get promoted, but I do think that McDermott is clued up enough to do what's needed to stay there, he's demonstrated enough times that he can make whatever changes are necessary to ensure that the team does whatever's necessary to stay there.


You're getting a bit soft in your old age HR if you thought it was a very cold night. :wink:
After last night maybe we can set our sights just a bit lower and say that we would like to see us play like Bilbao.


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Re: How can a team playing so poorly have such good current form

by melonhead » 09 Mar 2012 12:31

rob the royal
Ideal Call me a weirdo, but this is the sort of play I enjoy.
We don't give them any chances, and when we have the ball we don't f^ck around, take no risk, and score the winner when we get the chance.

If this was Italy, the supporters would be spunking themselves with joy!!!!!!!!!!

FFS, we are a T E A M!!!!


You'd probably get on well with my mate. When he plays FIFA, if he gets a goal up after 5 minutes he'll happily sit on it and just keep possession as much as possible!



the bitter words of a loser

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Hoop Blah
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Re: How can a team playing so poorly have such good current form

by Hoop Blah » 09 Mar 2012 12:43

Ideal
Victor Meldrew ....this doesn't work in the Premier League..
I don't think this method would work for us because...


I disagree.
And this has been proven over and over by other teams. Ipswich had a good run in the top division playing like this - although this was quite some time ago.
Everton had a good run in the top division playing like this very recently. They had that combative duo in the centre of the pitch, John Ebbrell, Barry Horne, Joe Parkinson alternating for the two central midfield positions. That team's style of play is very similar to ours, and they beat Man U in the cup final playing like that.
Oh yeah and Arsenal won under George graham, playing like this.

I just think people need to get in touch with reality. Look at our squad. Take a real look at what players we have. Is Lionel Messi in our squad? Ronaldo? No?
Then we must play accordingly.


Ideal, that Everton side you talk about was 15-20 years, and George Grahams teams just as old. The game has moved on a lot since then.

We do have to play according to the squad we have, I don't think anyone is disputing that. What I would say is that we've largely got the curren manager has wanted (budgets permitting) and he's working wonders with it (in terms of results) but its just not pretty or usually exciting to watch.

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Re: How can a team playing so poorly have such good current form

by Victor Meldrew » 09 Mar 2012 12:50

Ideal
Victor Meldrew ....this doesn't work in the Premier League..
I don't think this method would work for us because...


I disagree.
And this has been proven over and over by other teams. Ipswich had a good run in the top division playing like this - although this was quite some time ago.
Everton had a good run in the top division playing like this very recently. They had that combative duo in the centre of the pitch, John Ebbrell, Barry Horne, Joe Parkinson alternating for the two central midfield positions. That team's style of play is very similar to ours, and they beat Man U in the cup final playing like that.
Oh yeah and Arsenal won under George graham, playing like this.

I just think people need to get in touch with reality. Look at our squad. Take a real look at what players we have. Is Lionel Messi in our squad? Ronaldo? No?
Then we must play accordingly.


You said "very recently" but the Everton dogs of war are hardly recent and George Graham's Arsenal was some 15 years or so ago.
Look closer to now at teams like Wolves,Blackburn,Bolton and Birmingham and you will see what I am on about-they give the ball away too easily and in the Premier League you get severely punished if the ball is given away so easily.
Nobody is saying that this squad should totally change their way of playing (they probably can't)-what we will have to do is change the squad and then play with more control and not treat the ball like a hot potato.

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Re: How can a team playing so poorly have such good current form

by Maguire » 09 Mar 2012 12:51

Victor Meldrew Nobody is saying that this squad should totally change their way of playing (they probably can't)-what we will have to do is change the squad and then play with more control and not treat the ball like a hot potato.


truth

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Re: How can a team playing so poorly have such good current form

by Terminal Boardom » 09 Mar 2012 13:27

Maguire
Victor Meldrew Nobody is saying that this squad should totally change their way of playing (they probably can't)-what we will have to do is change the squad and then play with more control and not treat the ball like a hot potato.


truth


Thing is, English football has always been high on passion and low on quality. Just occasionally, a team rises above the flotsam and jetsam that is English football. For example, Forest under Clough in the late 70s, Villa and Ipswich in the early 80s and some of the football played by Chelsea (under Ranieri) and Arsenal when they went unbeaten a few years back. It is only in recent years that Barcelona have taken the game to a completely higher level and the gulf now is enormous and freakish.

English football will never compete technically with the continentals because neither the paying public nor media will allow it.

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Re: How can a team playing so poorly have such good current form

by Hoop Blah » 09 Mar 2012 16:11

Maybe TB, but if you compare our lot to most of their peers we're behind the majority for some reason.

I would also say that we've been better at retaining possession recently and we're seeing less and less of the aimless helping the ball down the channels that typified our play not long ago.

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Re: How can a team playing so poorly have such good current form

by The Prisoner » 09 Mar 2012 22:21

Bright eyes,
Burning like fire.
Bright eyes,
How can you close and fail
How can the light that burned so brightly
Suddenly burn so pale?
Bright eyes.

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