Dolan: 'Academy is a success'...but Gooding's unconvinced

[papereyes]

One word - DoLOLan.

That's three.

DoLOLan.

'greed

[Thou Voice]

The HNA? Team board gibberish award is an annual award which is given to Royalee every year by his "peers". This is despite heavy pressure from Spacecruiser (bleatings on the french and arsenal) and RTFCDrummer (being educationally subnormal)

OI!

I'd have expected SDR and Thou Voice to be well ahead of me in the stakes for that award.

OI!

What have I done apart from being fairly well behaved since Steve decided to stay and I was absolutely delighted as I am a superiour U-Turn king then yourself?

[Royalee]

As long as Ian Royal continues to disagree with me, I have no reason to question myself as his opinions are always the polar opposite to anything intelligent.

[Roger the Rabbit]

One word - DoLOLan.

Anyone remember what happened to the last head of our much derided academy ?

[Royalee]

Dolan's doing a good job - our players are representing their countries at youth level and are looking good. However, you can only take players so far if they are not going to be given any first team experience and better coaching by the top management. We've been at the top of academy leagues and beaten Chelsea, Arsenal and so forth at various age groups, but if the likes of McGhee hadn't given the likes of Williams and Taylor first team opportunities then they'd never have amounted to anything.

Coppelol

[brendywendy]

RoyaLOLee

[Royalee]

RoyaLOLee

An excellent contribution as usual brendy.

[Roger the Rabbit]

Not sure how we can give the young players better coaching, most (all ?) of the ones with first team potential train with the first team squad under the first team coaches (when not out on loan playing first team games !)

Adie Williams got his start under Porterfield, not McGhee although he became a regular under McGhee.

[Royalee]

Not sure how we can give the young players better coaching, most (all ?) of the ones with first team potential train with the first team squad under the first team coaches (when not out on loan playing first team games !)

Adie Williams got his start under Porterfield, not McGhee although he became a regular under McGhee.

When a player is given first team chances, it becomes easier for the management to see his strengths and weaknesses, which means they can then work on them a lot more in training was what I meant. A player is never going to reach their full potential unless introduced to first team action and placed in an environment where they have to sink or swim.

[brendywendy]

RoyaLOLee

An excellent contribution as usual brendy.

just responding to your incredibly eloquent and intelligent "CoppeLOL" mr lee

having seen the reserves play a fair bit over the last few years i would think that copps has got it about right, and that none of them were good enough to step up at the time.
now we are back in the championship they will have more opportunities and hopefully be able to see them push on and claim their places
i do have high hopes for pearce and karacan, and would early love to see them play
to suggest they didnt last season purely because of some inability of coppells to see and play a youngster is daft
he has done so many times during his career.

i would have thought all of that was implicit in my "RoyaLOLee"
but you insisted i spell it out

[Roger the Rabbit]

Not sure how we can give the young players better coaching, most (all ?) of the ones with first team potential train with the first team squad under the first team coaches (when not out on loan playing first team games !)

Adie Williams got his start under Porterfield, not McGhee although he became a regular under McGhee.

When a player is given first team chances, it becomes easier for the management to see his strengths and weaknesses, which means they can then work on them a lot more in training was what I meant. A player is never going to reach their full potential unless introduced to first team action and placed in an environment where they have to sink or swim.

An eternal conundrum ! If a young player isn't 100% ready do you select him ahead of an older, more experienced and possibly better player to 'see how it goes' ? If it works then the manager looks good, if it doesn't then the risk is high. You might get away with it in Div 1 but at Premiership level ?
Would playing James Henry in the last dozen games have improved the team in the short term ? Would it have set him back if he'd played and not performed ? Should Alex Pearce have been selected ahead of Ivar, Duberry, Sonko or Bikey and if so how we he have coped with Robbie Keane (given that he struggled against him in the cup).
The only answers can be found in hindsight and I don't think anyone can say that sticking Pearce, Henry or Karacan in the team would have produced anything positive, neither can we say it would have flopped. I would say that this season there can be no excuse for not playing the young players more - unless they are simply not good enough, but that is a reason, not an excuse. Henry won't be marked by Evra or Cole, Pearce won;t be battling Torres or Drohgba and Karacan won;t be competing with Gerrard or Lampard so it's probably make or break for them all this year.

[Royalee]

RoyaLOLee

An excellent contribution as usual brendy.

just responding to your incredibly eloquent and intelligent "CoppeLOL" mr lee

having seen the reserves play a fair bit over the last few years i would think that copps has got it about right, and that none of them were good enough to step up at the time.
now we are back in the championship they will have more opportunities and hopefully be able to see them push on and claim their places
i do have high hopes for pearce and karacan, and would early love to see them play
to suggest they didnt last season purely because of some inability of coppells to see and play a youngster is daft
he has done so many times during his career.

i would have thought all of that was implicit in my "RoyaLOLee"
but you insisted i spell it out

Name some youngsters he's given a chance throughout his career. I seem to remember he had the likes of Gareth Southgate in his youth systems and didn't play him whilst at the helm at Palace.

As for reserve team football, I've seen established first team players have useless games there and still be picked the following week - it's uncompetitive. However, Pearce has regularly captained the reserves in recent seasons and shown more than enough when the likes of Duberry and Sonko have looked poor in comparison to him. I'd say he's more than ready to partner Bikey at centre back in the Championship, although I expect Coppell will stick with his favourites.

[Hoop Blah]

Having a glimpse at Pearce, Karacan and Henry in a few cup games, and even a sub appearance here and there, would've been a lot more positive in both the short term and long term than playing the likes of Sodje and Halls who had absolutely no future at the club.

Anyone of them may have just proved to be a better option than the senior players (we used 10 or 11 on the right wing didn't we?) in the side. It would've at least made the senior players look over their shoulders a bit.

[Roger the Rabbit]

I'd say he's more than ready to partner Bikey at centre back in the Championship, although I expect Coppell will stick with his favourites.

Potentially a good pairing, although fraught with risk. I think Bikey needs an organiser alongside him, and to put that responsibility on the head of an inexperienced youngster seems unfair. Bikey alongside Ivar with Pearce on the bench more realistic ?

[Royalee]

Not sure how we can give the young players better coaching, most (all ?) of the ones with first team potential train with the first team squad under the first team coaches (when not out on loan playing first team games !)

Adie Williams got his start under Porterfield, not McGhee although he became a regular under McGhee.

When a player is given first team chances, it becomes easier for the management to see his strengths and weaknesses, which means they can then work on them a lot more in training was what I meant. A player is never going to reach their full potential unless introduced to first team action and placed in an environment where they have to sink or swim.

An eternal conundrum ! If a young player isn't 100% ready do you select him ahead of an older, more experienced and possibly better player to 'see how it goes' ? If it works then the manager looks good, if it doesn't then the risk is high. You might get away with it in Div 1 but at Premiership level ?
Would playing James Henry in the last dozen games have improved the team in the short term ? Would it have set him back if he'd played and not performed ? Should Alex Pearce have been selected ahead of Ivar, Duberry, Sonko or Bikey and if so how we he have coped with Robbie Keane (given that he struggled against him in the cup).
The only answers can be found in hindsight and I don't think anyone can say that sticking Pearce, Henry or Karacan in the team would have produced anything positive, neither can we say it would have flopped. I would say that this season there can be no excuse for not playing the young players more - unless they are simply not good enough, but that is a reason, not an excuse. Henry won't be marked by Evra or Cole, Pearce won;t be battling Torres or Drohgba and Karacan won;t be competing with Gerrard or Lampard so it's probably make or break for them all this year.

Struggled against Keane in the cup? He only got 45 minutes against him in a weakened team. Of course Sonko and Ingimarsson have never struggled against Robbie Keane - they've practically had him in their back pockets over the last two years.

The risk was LOW last season - we had players who were consistently showing they weren't up to the job getting chance after chance after chance. Coppell could easily have used some of his youngsters in the second half of the season to shake things up, particularly during our eight game losing streak where he failed to learn every week despite his 20 years of managerial 'experience'.

I hope the clown gives our younger players a chance this season, along with a few decent additions, but I'm not getting my hopes up.

[Hoop Blah]

I'd say he's more than ready to partner Bikey at centre back in the Championship, although I expect Coppell will stick with his favourites.

Potentially a good pairing, although fraught with risk. I think Bikey needs an organiser alongside him, and to put that responsibility on the head of an inexperienced youngster seems unfair. Bikey alongside Ivar with Pearce on the bench more realistic ?

I would be quite surprised if Coppell didn't play at least one of Ivar or Doobs in every team selection.

Pearce really looks like a long term successor to Ivar and all the things you hear from the club back that up, from his leadership and calmness on the ball to his lack of pace.

[Royalee]

I'd say he's more than ready to partner Bikey at centre back in the Championship, although I expect Coppell will stick with his favourites.

Potentially a good pairing, although fraught with risk. I think Bikey needs an organiser alongside him, and to put that responsibility on the head of an inexperienced youngster seems unfair. Bikey alongside Ivar with Pearce on the bench more realistic ?

Pearce is a leader and has intelligence and reading of the game far beyond his years - you'd know that if you'd ever seen him play. Ingimarsson is not as intelligent a defender as Pearce. Bikey has strength, pace and raw ability, Pearce is a little slower (like Ingimarsson), but tells the defenders EXACTLY where they should be, leads by example, reads the game exceptionally well and is extremely well-organised (a future RFC captain if given a chance, I have no doubt about that at all). To me that sounds the perfect partnership - Bikey's weaknesses are Pearce's strengths and vice-versa. Fraught with danger it is not.

[Roger the Rabbit]

The risk was LOW last season

I don't think you are actually thinking through the risks. I'd agree that the risks to the team were probably low, wouldhaving an inexperienced centre back have cost us any more points or seen us finish lower down the league (in hindsight ?)

Possibly a more important risk is to the player. Would it have benefited Pearce to play in a defence under pressure, with inadequate cover from his midfield ?

I've seen Pearce play plenty of times and his is a fine prospect, agree with your assessment of his intelligence (benefit of a private education !), coolness etc. Future captain ? Agree ! Mature enough to step straight in and not only concentrate on his own game but also manage the rest of the defence ? Tough ask and an un necessary risk.
At least the people who will make the decision know far more about the player and the game than you (or I !)

[Royalee]

The risk was LOW last season

I don't think you are actually thinking through the risks. I'd agree that the risks to the team were probably low, wouldhaving an inexperienced centre back have cost us any more points or seen us finish lower down the league (in hindsight ?)

Possibly a more important risk is to the player. Would it have benefited Pearce to play in a defence under pressure, with inadequate cover from his midfield ?

I've seen Pearce play plenty of times and his is a fine prospect, agree with your assessment of his intelligence (benefit of a private education !), coolness etc. Future captain ? Agree ! Mature enough to step straight in and not only concentrate on his own game but also manage the rest of the defence ? Tough ask and an un necessary risk.
At least the people who will make the decision know far more about the player and the game than you (or I !)

I just believe in giving players a chance - all the best managers do and aren't scared of the 'risk' to the player's future. Confidence comes and goes, class sticks. I didn't see Ferguson and Wenger worrying about the long term damage inclusion did to the likes of Beckham, Butt, Scholes and the Neville brothers or Cole, Clichy, Fabregas and Flamini.

[Roger the Rabbit]

I've seen Wayne Rooney, and Pearce is no Wayne Rooney !

Not really a good comparison to select a bunch of players with honours coming out of their ears who quite clearly 'made it'. What about all the young players who get stuck in forst teams at 17 and are touted as the 'next big thing' and never make it ...

The 'best' managers don't pick players based on their age, they pick the players they need to do a job and they will absolutely consider the 'risk' to the players. At the simplest level they would be in breach of Child Protection rules if they didn't, beyond that they would not be doing their job !!