Long to WBA

[melonhead]

The thing I love about this thread is how silly it makes Wimb and Messiah look on page 1!

does it?

£3million for a player who to that point hadn't scored regularly at Championship level still seems like a good bit of business to me

Fair play he showed he's worth more then that but hindsight is a wonderful thing. By the start of November his value was looking even lower than that.

except almost everyone else on here could see that apart from his goals, he was playing very well, had improved immensely, and was showing real strength/first touch/holding up the ball/etc.

[Hoop Blah]

Not really Wycombe, I'm talking extremes. Like when there's at least one zero missing or added.

People on internet forums will quibble and criticise clubs over a lot less than a missing zero. This forum, and all the other football forums on the internet are proof of that.

Interesting to note that before the invasion of football forums disclosing transfer fees was not an issue and it was done with most transfers. Now every little thing a club does is criticised by certain fans on internet forums - again this forum is evidence of that.

You can hardly blame clubs for wanting to keep some things private.

This was always the case before the internet as well though. Transfers and team selections were always hot topics in pubs, social clubs, football specials and fanzines up and down the country.

I think the difference is that the monies involved have shot up and also the ego's and sensitivities of those at the club.

I'm not sure I'd go as far as to say the majority of transfers are undisclosed, or that the clubs don't give a pretty good indication of the fee to the local media and fans (which is what I'm saying would be a good bit of stakeholder management). I'm not going to trawl the web to prove it either way though, so we'll have to agree to disagree on that part.

For whatever reason they do it I think it's one of the disappointing developments in footballs sanitisation and shift towards 'big business'. I don't like it and I think it would engage the fans more in the club if they still had that bit more information.

[Wycombe Royal]

This was always the case before the internet as well though. Transfers and team selections were always hot topics in pubs, social clubs, football specials and fanzines up and down the country.

However there is one major differene. Those forms of medium had a far smaller "audience" than those today in the age of the internet.......hence why clubs get scrutinsed (and therefore criticised) in far more detail than they ever used to before.

[Svlad Cjelli]

.....
For whatever reason they do it I think it's one of the disappointing developments in footballs sanitisation and shift towards 'big business'. I don't like it and I think it would engage the fans more in the club if they still had that bit more information.

There are two schools of thought on this. Rightly or wrongly, I think the club's view on this is that it would just give people more information to misunderstand and to criticise them with.

[Wimb]

Don't disagree with either of you Brendy or Snowball. However you've both proved my point.

As you both said VERY FEW people could see that coming from Shane, even Premier League/Football League scouts who presumably could have snagged Long at a discount price during some of his struggles in the past didn't pick up on it. You've already basked in your correct call Snowball and credit to you (though such gloating does you little credit and it's noticable you disappeared when the teams' form went south in August....) same to you Brendy for seeing his potential. Still, I think saying 'everyone else could see his potential' is different from the choice a majority would have made if given a £3million bid for him in the summer of 2010.

£3million would have filled almost all of the 'black hole' that summer and to get a fee for a striker, who impressive as he was looking off the ball, HADN'T TO THAT POINT, put up a full season of goalscoring, would have been good business and I'd still say so presented with the same evidence that we had to June 2010.

How many other non goalscoring second tier forwards have ever been bought for that sort of money? That money could have been used to invest in 2 other good players, what if as mentioned we'd bought Gary Hooper for a million? then added Gorkks or Zurab on a permanent deal from the start of the season? maybe a different player would have hit the ground sooner and we'd have finished top two.....

Now had we taken that £3m and then seen him go on and become the player he is now, which is a fact not certain based on how he was played/used/coached at any new club, then you could be sat there kicking yourself that we'd sold a player for £2m+ below what we got for him in the end.

However, as mentioned hindsight is a wonderful thing.

I'm happy to hold my hands up and say we did the right thing not selling him for that (if such a bid was ever received, which I doubt) but to be called foolish when the bulk of the evidence suggests that £3 million would have been a good bit of business for the club is wrong in my opinion.

[melonhead]

.....
For whatever reason they do it I think it's one of the disappointing developments in footballs sanitisation and shift towards 'big business'. I don't like it and I think it would engage the fans more in the club if they still had that bit more information.

There are two schools of thought on this. Rightly or wrongly, I think the club's view on this is that it would just give people more information to misunderstand and to criticise them with.

seems like rightly to me, as i think it s proven by all the extra statements made by the club, star, and JM himself, on teh finances, have done nothing to quell the furore among a certain section of fans, and in fact have inflamed them even further.

[melonhead]

Don't disagree with either of you Brendy or Snowball. However you've both proved my point.

As you both said VERY FEW people could see that coming from Shane, even Premier League/Football League scouts who presumably could have snagged Long at a discount price during some of his struggles in the past didn't pick up on it. You've already basked in your correct call Snowball and credit to you (though such gloating does you little credit and it's noticable you disappeared when the teams' form went south in August....) same to you Brendy for seeing his potential. Still, I think saying 'everyone else could see his potential' is different from the choice a majority would have made if given a £3million bid for him in the summer of 2010.

£3million would have filled almost all of the 'black hole' that summer and to get a fee for a striker, who impressive as he was looking off the ball, HADN'T TO THAT POINT, put up a full season of goalscoring, would have been good business and I'd still say so presented with the same evidence that we had to June 2010.

How many other non goalscoring second tier forwards have ever been bought for that sort of money? That money could have been used to invest in 2 other good players, what if as mentioned we'd bought Gary Hooper for a million? then added Gorkks or Zurab on a permanent deal from the start of the season? maybe a different player would have hit the ground sooner and we'd have finished top two.....

Now had we taken that £3m and then seen him go on and become the player he is now, which is a fact not certain based on how he was played/used/coached at any new club, then you could be sat there kicking yourself that we'd sold a player for £2m+ below what we got for him in the end.

However, as mentioned hindsight is a wonderful thing.

I'm happy to hold my hands up and say we did the right thing not selling him for that (if such a bid was ever received, which I doubt) but to be called foolish when the bulk of the evidence suggests that £3 million would have been a good bit of business for the club is wrong in my opinion.

agreed, wasnt having a go.
i loved teh kid but would have seriously considered a 3 milion bid pre xmas last year

[Harpers So Solid Crew]

How good would it have been if someone had offered £2m for Long last Summer, we might have been able to sell Siggy for more or hold on to him, reality is no one knows how things could have turned out, Church and Siggy could have hit it off again and fired us up.

[Ian Royal]

As a vocal critic of Long's previously, I think it's fair to say that a combination of frustration at several previous false dawns from him and some really rancid performances in the earlier part of his time with us post relegation, made it very hard to see his work rate as an indicator that he'd come good.

When you've been disappointed several times already it's hard to find that belief the next time. In hindsight obviously Long did have the quality, and probably would have stepped up a season earlier, had it not been for his fitness and weight problems (self-inflicted partly IMO). Although again he started the next season playing ok, but simply not scoring. And more than that, not looking like scoring, with numerous poor finishes.

Still, it's all worked out for the best in the end. And that's what's important. Not who was right and who was wrong. Not whether he was good or shit at any one time or how much we could have made from him if we'd sold him earlier or later.

[East End Lady]

I have just driven past long's house - the removal men are there! He really isn't coming back is he?

[melonhead]

[Snowball]

As you both said VERY FEW people could see that coming from Shane, even Premier League/Football League scouts who presumably could have snagged Long at a discount price during some of his struggles in the past didn't pick up on it.

You've already basked in your correct call Snowball and credit to you (though such gloating does you little credit and it's noticeable you disappeared when the teams' form went south in August....) same to you Brendy for seeing his potential. Still, I think saying 'everyone else could see his potential' is different from the choice a majority would have made if given a £3million bid for him in the summer of 2010.

Gloating is the one and only thing better than sex.



A few reasons why I didn't post

1. You are all far too depressing to listen to. Especially the "I told you so, we're doomed! Doomed!" crowd.

2. Pointless to debate until a new side had settled in. Still too early, IMO but we won't be relegated.

3. I've started a degree in Philosophy at Birkbeck.

4. I'm also doing an Open University degree (Yes two degrees at the same time) due to a cock-up.

[Extended-Phenotype]

I can’t believe people are so mind-numbingly senile that they would argue about hindsight.

Of course a f/ing decision to sell something for 3m that became worth 6m was wrong IN HINDSIGHT. Who’s the next target for the told-you-so time travellers, Joanna f/ing Yeates?

Time travels in a linear fashion. Get over it.

[Vision]

I have just driven past long's house - the removal men are there! He really isn't coming back is he?

He was in the dressing room on Tuesday night. Can't believe we didn't chuck him someone elses shirt and play him as a ringer.

Thats the trouble with this club,won't ever take a risk.

[Gordons Cumming]

I have just driven past long's house - the removal men are there! He really isn't coming back is he?

He was in the dressing room on Tuesday night. Can't believe we didn't chuck him someone elses shirt and play him as a ringer.

Thats the trouble with this club,won't ever take a risk.

How do you know he was in the dressing room on Tuesday?

[TFF]

I saw his motor in the players' car park - so he probably was.

[Svlad Cjelli]

It was confirmed on Twitter that he was at the game.

[melonhead]

do other teams ex pl;ayers come back as often as ours?

it doest seem so, but that could easily be cos i just dont notice/give a oxf*rd

[mr_number]

I have just driven past long's house - the removal men are there! He really isn't coming back is he?

He was in the dressing room on Tuesday night. Can't believe we didn't chuck him someone elses shirt and play him as a ringer.

Thats the trouble with this club,won't ever take a risk.

How do you know he was in the dressing room on Tuesday?

Stalking.

[westendgirl]

He was in the dressing room on Tuesday night. Can't believe we didn't chuck him someone elses shirt and play him as a ringer.

Thats the trouble with this club,won't ever take a risk.

How do you know he was in the dressing room on Tuesday?

May be something to do with the photo of him on the OS?