Cardiff punishment

[SpaceCruiser]

the FAW agreed and went along with the defence that Cardiff players were just reacting and defending themselves from RFC players aggression.

Umm! I'm sure throttling somebody is self-defence!!

[Sarah Star]

^ Exactly.

If Cardiff had no case to answer in the tunnel then neither did we seeing as the FA accepted that we weren't responsible for the "incident"

We were found guilty and fined a sum for it. I don't agree they accepted we weren't responsible as I've not seen anything to suggest that's the case (happy to be proved wrong on that of course).

If the club don't provide evidence I don't see how we can blame either the FA or FAW for that.

As for the Bellamy photo, that was from the on-pitch scuffle which even we accepted we started and the FAW agreed and went along with the defence that Cardiff players were just reacting and defending themselves from RFC players aggression.

The fines reflect the level of involvement I guess. Ours were increased by our poor recent history. I still don't see much to get our knickers in a twist over.

I don't remember anyone accepting that we "started" the on-pitch scuffle and the video evidence I've seen doesn't suggest we did either.

[Hoop Blah]

We were the aggrieved party from the award of the free kick and we accept culpability and responsibility for our part in the scuffle. Perhaps starting it might be the wrong term but I can't remember the initial reactions that sparked things off apart from our players being wound up by the ref awarding a free kick.

You might not think we started it but we pleaded guilty to our involvement.

[Svlad Cjelli]

Their player up on charges SHOULD have been handed a three game suspension, same as OUR player was.
There's pictures of him strangling Griffin, there's no question about evidence, so don't turn it into some sort of who did what debate.

He wasn't charged with any incident ON THE PITCH. Only Leigertwood was charged with anything related to that. So the picture has no relevance.

What I fail to understand is how he was cleared of any incident in the tunnel. the cut above Simon Church's eye should pay testament to the fact that a water bottle was thrown, and it could only have been thrown by a Cardiff player - presumably the one that multiple witnesses eyeballed doing it.

[ZacNaloen]

I suspect they have a grainy video where it's impossible to see what actually happened

[Hoop Blah]

I don't give a shit about this who did what and who started what, that's all kindergarten stuff.

That's pretty much what the rest of your post sounds like to be fair Ideal!

The only relevant fact here is that Cardiff should have received a similar punishment to us.

They did, apart from the fact that ours included invoking a suspended sentence and a bit on top for it not being our first offence. That seems pretty reasonable to me, even if I'd rather we just got away scot free.

Their player up on charges SHOULD have been handed a three game suspension, same as OUR player was.

As Dirk said, they didn't have a player up on charges for punching an opponent. Yes Bellamy grabbed Griffin, but that's not quite as bad and presumably the ref saw it and dealt with it at the time and so wasn't part of the post match charges to be dealt with.

There's pictures of him strangling Griffin, there's no question about evidence, so don't turn it into some sort of who did what debate.

Pictures can capture a split second view and make it look different to the actual reality, but I think Bellamy might be a little lucky the ref didn't take more action against him for his part in the on-field fracas but it's nothing to do with the FAW.

Fact remains: Welsh FA is corrupting the game by allowing Cardiff to get away with anything they want.
Our most important player was out for three (or two, since the one he was ineligeble for anyway) matches. Theirs was NOT.

This gave them an unfair advantage. We should sue them and the Welsh FA if they go up and we don't.

Our most important player lost his discipline and punched an opponent. He and we need to learn from that not whinge about the other side not getting the same treatment for different offences.

I'd agree with Dirk that it would be interesting to know how Bellamy got away with alledgedly throwing a water bottle at Church, but without knowing what evidence Cardiff presented you can't really say the FAW is corrupt. I think over time they do get a few breaks by being governed by a different body and I think it's wrong that they compete in the same league but report to a different FA, but in this case I'm not sure thats been the case.

[SpaceCruiser]

The only relevant fact here is that Cardiff should have received a similar punishment to us.

They did, apart from the fact that ours included invoking a suspended sentence and a bit on top for it not being our first offence. That seems pretty reasonable to me, even if I'd rather we just got away scot free.

See, this is what I disagree with. They were fined only £5,000, whereas we got fined a lot more even without the suspended sentence. I think it was £25,000. With the suspended sentence it got bumped up to £40,000. Care to explain the difference between the fines, without the suspended sentence? Why weren't they fined £25,000? Also, were they given a suspended sentence for the next time they misbehave, like we had the last time we had this thing? I suspect not, so the next time they do something like this again, I suspect they'll be let off with another £5,000.

[Hoop Blah]

Our suspended fine, for the events at Swansea, which you could possibly say are comparable to Cardiffs indiscretions, were the same £5,000 but we got away with a suspended fine whereas Cardiff just had to pay up.

We were fined £10,000 for our part in the events in and around the tunnel where we pleaded not-guilty. Cardiff pleaded guilty and got £5,000. Perhaps they were fined less because they pleaded guilty or because they didn't have previous or were found guilty of a second incident in the same game.

[Sarah Star]

Also the FAW decided that the charge of failure of Cardiff's players to conduct themselves in an orderly fashion during the match was "not proven", so no fine there.

[fester_royal]

I can't believe this is still an issue. Did anyone really think the outcome would be any less than them getting away with it? Same as they did with administration, same as qpr will with third parties... Simple issue is if you cheat and rub the fa up right you get away with it. FIFA,uefa and the fa are all criminals who just want money not a well run game!


Rant over.... No more beer for me

[facaldaqui]

I don't give a shit about this who did what and who started what, that's all kindergarten stuff.

That's pretty much what the rest of your post sounds like to be fair Ideal!

The only relevant fact here is that Cardiff should have received a similar punishment to us.

They did, apart from the fact that ours included invoking a suspended sentence and a bit on top for it not being our first offence. That seems pretty reasonable to me, even if I'd rather we just got away scot free.

Their player up on charges SHOULD have been handed a three game suspension, same as OUR player was.

As Dirk said, they didn't have a player up on charges for punching an opponent. Yes Bellamy grabbed Griffin, but that's not quite as bad and presumably the ref saw it and dealt with it at the time and so wasn't part of the post match charges to be dealt with.

There's pictures of him strangling Griffin, there's no question about evidence, so don't turn it into some sort of who did what debate.

Pictures can capture a split second view and make it look different to the actual reality, but I think Bellamy might be a little lucky the ref didn't take more action against him for his part in the on-field fracas but it's nothing to do with the FAW.

Fact remains: Welsh FA is corrupting the game by allowing Cardiff to get away with anything they want.
Our most important player was out for three (or two, since the one he was ineligeble for anyway) matches. Theirs was NOT.

This gave them an unfair advantage. We should sue them and the Welsh FA if they go up and we don't.

Our most important player lost his discipline and punched an opponent. He and we need to learn from that not whinge about the other side not getting the same treatment for different offences.

I'd agree with Dirk that it would be interesting to know how Bellamy got away with alledgedly throwing a water bottle at Church, but without knowing what evidence Cardiff presented you can't really say the FAW is corrupt. I think over time they do get a few breaks by being governed by a different body and I think it's wrong that they compete in the same league but report to a different FA, but in this case I'm not sure thats been the case.

Your argument would be more understandable if Cardiff weren't fined such a measly amount compared to us. There's no getting around that. Also I'm dubious about the fact that they submitted their own video evidence. Were Reading convicted on the basis of what the officials reported and Cardiff on what was in the club's video? If so, not fair. One of two things (or both) is responsible for the imbalance in the punishments: Welsh bias or the fact that two different panels judged the same incidents.

[Hoop Blah]

They got fined the same amount that we did for similar events at Swansea. If anything we got off lighter because we got a suspended sentence for that one.

That was a more comparable event because any fine imposed on us resulting from the Cardiff game took into account our previous form vs Swansea.

I can't believe I'm somehow standing up for Cardiff or the FAW!!!

[facaldaqui]

They got fined the same amount that we did for similar events at Swansea. If anything we got off lighter because we got a suspended sentence for that one.

That was a more comparable event because any fine imposed on us resulting from the Cardiff game took into account our previous form vs Swansea.

I can't believe I'm somehow standing up for Cardiff or the FAW!!!

That we should have been fined more on account of our previous record and suspended sentence makes sense, but the disparity is jaw-dropping. To use Brian's words, our fines were "extortionate".

[Svlad Cjelli]

I have been told by someone who certainly knows that we were "treated as leniently as possible" considering the weight of evidence against us and our recent record.

[floyd__streete]

Can someone remind me what 'recent record' we are paying so dearly for exactly? Kevin Girdler's People Like You, perhaps? Or maybe Brian Coddington's red card fit at Stoke twenty years ago?

[Ian Royal]

I have been told by someone who certainly knows that we were "treated as leniently as possible" considering the weight of evidence against us and our recent record.

Is this like when you knew Bellamy would get banned?

[Hoop Blah]

Can someone remind me what 'recent record' we are paying so dearly for exactly? Kevin Girdler's People Like You, perhaps? Or maybe Brian Coddington's red card fit at Stoke twenty years ago?

Coventry and Swansea games in recent seasons under the same charge.

Didn't McAuff/the club also get done after his altercation with the stewards at West Brom, or was that just a simple red card?

[ZacNaloen]

Mcanuff got a red card at west brom for putting his hand round a players neck...

I don't think we got into any further trouble for what happened with the stewards