Financial jackpot

[Uncle Andy]

For the sake of comparison, what did we get for winning the Championship last season?

Promotion!

[shaka's shorts]

The UEFA Cup is not necessarily a big windfall until after the group stages. I met the Commercial Director of Rangers who told me they lost money on the UEFA Cup with very low TV money from C5, half empty stadiums and lots of travelling costs etc. Although, I suspect the Mad stad would be full even for a qualifying match with a Lithuanian team!

Once you get through to the quarters then it is very lucrative as you negotiate your own TV deal rather than the Champions League model where you share the pot at this stage.

[anR]

The UEFA Cup is not necessarily a big windfall until after the group stages. I met the Commercial Director of Rangers who told me they lost money on the UEFA Cup with very low TV money from C5, half empty stadiums and lots of travelling costs etc. Although, I suspect the Mad stad would be full even for a qualifying match with a Lithuanian team!

Once you get through to the quarters then it is very lucrative as you negotiate your own TV deal rather than the Champions League model where you share the pot at this stage.

Which brings the conundrum of do we put out reserve teams for it and risk not progressing, or risk following a weak second season a la West Ham this season after a brief Uefa Cup run, or even Leeds' financial ruin after budgetting to win the Champions League?

Although saying all this I do know we won't even qualify for it. I still have a bet on a top ten place, so knowing my awful luck we'll finish 11th!

[Seal]

I'm sure I read somewhere that they are changing how the prize money is distributed in Uefa Cup next season, so clubs will receive more money at an earlier stage of the season, making it more profitable to be in.

However, it pales in insignificance when compared to the Premiership prize money next season...

Premiership winners: 2005/6 - £9,740,000; 2007/8 - £50,000,000.

Premiership losers: 2005/6 - £487,000; 2007/8 - £26,800,000.

[RG30]

I'm sure I read somewhere that they are changing how the prize money is distributed in Uefa Cup next season, so clubs will receive more money at an earlier stage of the season, making it more profitable to be in.

However, it pales in insignificance when compared to the Premiership prize money next season...

Premiership winners: 2005/6 - £9,740,000; 2007/8 - £50,000,000.

Premiership losers: 2005/6 - £487,000; 2007/8 - £26,800,000.

That is correct about the UEFA Cup. The prize money for me wouldn't be the concern, it's the way the Cup operates with a premliminary qualifying round, followed by a Group stage involving 4 games before the Champions League 3rd placed sides are bought in, it's a long drawn out process.

Whilst I completely understand SC's stance on the cup, I would hope we field our best 11 for the remainder of the season (Sidwell exclueded, obvious reasons) as the higher we finish, the better financially and we have a responsibility to other teams in the league and we the fans want to win games, see the team give it 110% and finish where we deserve to be to reflect our true 38 game season, and not finish lower because we took our foot of the gas in the final 1/3 of the season.

[Tinrib]

Birmingham £19.4m
Portsmouth £18.0m
West Brom £16.9m
Sunderland £16.1m

How's that? Birmingham got £1.4m for getting relegated?

More TV appearances, probably.

More than likely correct..

In the 2002/03 Season TV revenue ranged from between £31m (ManU) to £13m (Sunderland)

When I get an opportunity I'll work out what we've earned through TV & Media rigts this season.

Ok - a bit later than I'd hoped, but total income via the Prem league this season will be..

£14m (From an equal split between all clubs from 50% of the total prize pool)
£5.84m assuming we finish 9th. (represents 25% of the total pot)
£507k per live game (Not sure how many we've had live this season?) but I'll guess at 6 = £3.04m (again represents 25% of the total pot assuming Sky are correct in saying that there are a total of 138 live games this season)

So around £22.8m in total..

[brendywendy]

The UEFA Cup is not necessarily a big windfall until after the group stages. I met the Commercial Director of Rangers who told me they lost money on the UEFA Cup with very low TV money from C5, half empty stadiums and lots of travelling costs etc. Although, I suspect the Mad stad would be full even for a qualifying match with a Lithuanian team!

Once you get through to the quarters then it is very lucrative as you negotiate your own TV deal rather than the Champions League model where you share the pot at this stage.

Which brings the conundrum of do we put out reserve teams for it and risk not progressing, or risk following a weak second season a la West Ham this season after a brief Uefa Cup run, or even Leeds' financial ruin after budgetting to win the Champions League?

Although saying all this I do know we won't even qualify for it. I still have a bet on a top ten place, so knowing my awful luck we'll finish 11th!

cos that one game at palermo really took it out of WHU didnt it

[Bowman's Quiver]

Birmingham £19.4m
Portsmouth £18.0m
West Brom £16.9m
Sunderland £16.1m

How's that? Birmingham got £1.4m for getting relegated?

More TV appearances, probably.

More than likely correct..

In the 2002/03 Season TV revenue ranged from between £31m (ManU) to £13m (Sunderland)

When I get an opportunity I'll work out what we've earned through TV & Media rigts this season.

Ok - a bit later than I'd hoped, but total income via the Prem league this season will be..

£14m (From an equal split between all clubs from 50% of the total prize pool)
£5.84m assuming we finish 9th. (represents 25% of the total pot)
£507k per live game (Not sure how many we've had live this season?) but I'll guess at 6 = £3.04m (again represents 25% of the total pot assuming Sky are correct in saying that there are a total of 138 live games this season)

So around £22.8m in total..

Games I can recall off the top of my head on sky and there may be more I've forgotten about:

Man City (h)
Man Utd (h)
Arsenal (h)
Chelsea (h)
Spurs (h)
Chelsea (a)
Everton (a)
Villa (h)
Charlton (a)
Newcastle (h)

That's 10 which is another 2 million plus on your calculations.

Call it 25 million for Premiership rights across the board.

Suggest another 2 million is added for the FA cup and league cup runs plus TV rights.

Perhaps 11 million for gate receipts for Premiership games.

That would be 38 million pound income without including hospitality, merchandising, sponsorship, catering and promotions.

I wonder what expenditure is?

[RG30]

£11million on wages I think I saw somewhere recently.

[Rawlie19]

The UEFA Cup is not necessarily a big windfall until after the group stages. I met the Commercial Director of Rangers who told me they lost money on the UEFA Cup with very low TV money from C5, half empty stadiums and lots of travelling costs etc. Although, I suspect the Mad stad would be full even for a qualifying match with a Lithuanian team!

Once you get through to the quarters then it is very lucrative as you negotiate your own TV deal rather than the Champions League model where you share the pot at this stage.

Which brings the conundrum of do we put out reserve teams for it and risk not progressing, or risk following a weak second season a la West Ham this season after a brief Uefa Cup run, or even Leeds' financial ruin after budgetting to win the Champions League?

Although saying all this I do know we won't even qualify for it. I still have a bet on a top ten place, so knowing my awful luck we'll finish 11th!

I think West Ham's position in the table has more to do with them being shit than playing 1 team in Italy early in the season.

[Mr Angry]

Birmingham £19.4m
Portsmouth £18.0m
West Brom £16.9m
Sunderland £16.1m

How's that? Birmingham got £1.4m for getting relegated?

More TV appearances, probably.

More than likely correct..

In the 2002/03 Season TV revenue ranged from between £31m (ManU) to £13m (Sunderland)

When I get an opportunity I'll work out what we've earned through TV & Media rigts this season.

Ok - a bit later than I'd hoped, but total income via the Prem league this season will be..

£14m (From an equal split between all clubs from 50% of the total prize pool)
£5.84m assuming we finish 9th. (represents 25% of the total pot)
£507k per live game (Not sure how many we've had live this season?) but I'll guess at 6 = £3.04m (again represents 25% of the total pot assuming Sky are correct in saying that there are a total of 138 live games this season)

So around £22.8m in total..

Games I can recall off the top of my head on sky and there may be more I've forgotten about:

Man City (h)
Man Utd (h)
Arsenal (h)
Chelsea (h)
Spurs (h)
Chelsea (a)
Everton (a)
Villa (h)
Charlton (a)
Newcastle (h)

That's 10 which is another 2 million plus on your calculations.

Call it 25 million for Premiership rights across the board.

Suggest another 2 million is added for the FA cup and league cup runs plus TV rights.

Perhaps 11 million for gate receipts for Premiership games.

That would be 38 million pound income without including hospitality, merchandising, sponsorship, catering and promotions.

I wonder what expenditure is?

Spurs (a) as well.

[Behindu]

£11million on wages I think I saw somewhere recently.

That would have to be a conservative estimate surely...

Can;t be too many players not on 10k / week which is 500k / year so a squad of 22 would cost you 11 million. And we have more than 22 pros (OK the junior players won;t be on 10k week !). The likes of Doyle, Seol, Lita, Shorey will be on way more than 10k.

Then you add in Coppell, Dillon, Hammond, Downes, Gibbs etc etc etc.

Then there is all the non playing side where IIRC we employ over 100 people

Then add in all the other costs of employing people and the numbers soar !

[Victor Meldrew]

All of that would have been budgeted for.
Presumably we didn't budget for such a high finish so £6million will be bunce plus extra TV Revenue of say £2million for appearing more times live than expected.
With the new higher Sky revenue and not supposedly spending our full transfer budget this season we will either spend a lot on new players or be one of the very few profitable clubs in English football.
Presumably ticket prices will also be reduced?
Oh no I forget,they have been kept at the same level (because with our limited size of ground and demand they can),significantly higher than established clubs like Bolton but not subject to a 14% increase like Man Utd.
For supporting a well-run club such as ours it's a shame we don't have profit sharing for members.

[WTRoyal]

£11million on wages I think I saw somewhere recently.

That would have to be a conservative estimate surely...

Can;t be too many players not on 10k / week which is 500k / year so a squad of 22 would cost you 11 million. And we have more than 22 pros (OK the junior players won;t be on 10k week !). The likes of Doyle, Seol, Lita, Shorey will be on way more than 10k.

Then you add in Coppell, Dillon, Hammond, Downes, Gibbs etc etc etc.

Then there is all the non playing side where IIRC we employ over 100 people

Then add in all the other costs of employing people and the numbers soar !

I have a vague memory of an article on the official site which quoted Mr Madjeski as saying the wage bill alone for RFC was £20 million. I'll have a look and see if I can dig it out.

[Bowman's Quiver]

£11million on wages I think I saw somewhere recently.

That would have to be a conservative estimate surely...

Can;t be too many players not on 10k / week which is 500k / year so a squad of 22 would cost you 11 million. And we have more than 22 pros (OK the junior players won;t be on 10k week !). The likes of Doyle, Seol, Lita, Shorey will be on way more than 10k.

Then you add in Coppell, Dillon, Hammond, Downes, Gibbs etc etc etc.

Then there is all the non playing side where IIRC we employ over 100 people

Then add in all the other costs of employing people and the numbers soar !

Bonus' will have mounted up a fair bit this season as well but I would have thought 18 million would still cover all playing and coaching staff including the costs of running the academy.

Another 7 million should adequately cover all other operating costs including non-playing staff working at the stadium, travelling expenses and policing.

That's 25 million pound accounted for but still leaves anything up to another 20 million pound to play with.

On the other hand I could be way out

Good fun having a guess though....

[Victor Meldrew]

On a similar tack did you see in today's paper what the backroom staff get at Chelsea?
The fitness coach gets £600,000 and the goalkeeping coach gets £400,000.
I know London rates for salaries are higher than elsewhere but.......nice work if you can get it .
Mind you Cech has been the best keeper and they are a very fit side so maybe it's money well spent.
Don't let Mr Mad see those figures or he'll have an immediate coronary.

[Smoking Kills Dancing Doe]

Don't we normally release our accounts this time of year, maybe JM's still telling the tax man he's losing millions each year with the club!!

[Tinrib]

Year Wages/Turnover ratio Employees
2004/5 92.8 335
2003/4 60.4 391
2002/3 69.2 308
2001/2 77.7 319
2000/1 91.7 319


Interesting comparative figures % for wages to turnover for past seasons..

Will be nice to see what they are for this season..

[Forbury Lion]

Steve Coppell was on Sky Sports News the other night talking about the gap between the big clubs and anyone else, He said the financial divide started when they allowed home clubs to keep the gate.

[URZZZZZZZZ]

Finish 8th or above and we can lend West Ham £5.5 mill for their wrong doings