Apologies here please:-

[Gordons Cumming]

For all the vitriol, abuse and doubts cast upon the head of our team manager, his staff and players, the detractors can sign up here for the sack cloth, hair shirts and ashes they deserve!

So how many games in a row do Reading have to lose before you allow any criticism? Some of the criticism (Coppell out, drop the whole team etc.) has been unwarranted and over the top, but the fact that Reading have now won 2 out of 11 games, as opposed to 0 out of 9, doesn't mean anyone who dared to criticise some aspects of the club's performance should have to apologise.

Criticism can occur anytime, unwarranted attacks from knee jerk extremists are corrosive and destructive, we are better off points wise losing some (even many) and winning some, rather than drawing many, and feeling good about ourselves and getting relegated. Unwarranted criticism can hound managers out of clubs and destroy fragile confidence for no good reason!

Totally agree.

[howser]

No apologies needed, when critisism was made it was to do with, very limited transfer activity in august and january, deserved, losing 8 on the trot and not making defensive changes, deserved, so why apologies ?

[earleyroyal]

For all the vitriol, abuse and doubts cast upon the head of our team manager, his staff and players, the detractors can sign up here for the sack cloth, hair shirts and ashes they deserve!

So how many games in a row do Reading have to lose before you allow any criticism? Some of the criticism (Coppell out, drop the whole team etc.) has been unwarranted and over the top, but the fact that Reading have now won 2 out of 11 games, as opposed to 0 out of 9, doesn't mean anyone who dared to criticise some aspects of the club's performance should have to apologise.

Criticism can occur anytime, unwarranted attacks from knee jerk extremists are corrosive and destructive, we are better off points wise losing some (even many) and winning some, rather than drawing many, and feeling good about ourselves and getting relegated. Unwarranted criticism can hound managers out of clubs and destroy fragile confidence for no good reason!

I'm sorry, criticism on a messageboard has no effect on a football club. As for being better off points wise winning some and losing some, that's irrelevant, the criticism you were talking about came when the club was losing some and losing some more. Most of the criticism from the supposed STGs was warranted, or at least a fair, considered opinion. If there had been abuse and criticism at games, that would've had a negative effect, but the support was decent throughout. To suggest that people need to apologise because they had criticised the club for some of its decisions/actions, after the club had lost 8 games in a row, is wrong in my view. Just as losing 8 games didn't mean everything was wrong and that Reading were going to lose the next 10, winning 2 games doesn't mean everything is fine and Reading will win the next 9.

I think that Coppell was too loyal to certain players, the fact that 3/4 of the defence was changed followed by two clean sheets suggests this, as does the fact that once the 'radical changes' finally occurred, Reading won again.

That said I agree with you that there are some idiots on here who think that Coppell should be sacked, the club wants to get relegated etc. etc. and those people should admit they're wrong if the club does stay up.

[g]

coppell has never been short to admit his errors, so criticisms for the most part are justified. we wouldn't have been in this relegation battle, which mostly everyone had predicted at the start of the season, is because of the management. coppell has admitted this, though the rest of the nonsense the management spout is utter rubbish which is why most fans are annoyed at the club. next arsenal, spend big, 40m 'warchest', unlimited funds, squad is happy, increase the squad to go for europe, etc and all the opposite is what comes to be.

[Millsy]

So how many games in a row do Reading have to lose before you allow any criticism? Some of the criticism (Coppell out, drop the whole team etc.) has been unwarranted and over the top, but the fact that Reading have now won 2 out of 11 games, as opposed to 0 out of 9, doesn't mean anyone who dared to criticise some aspects of the club's performance should have to apologise.

Criticism can occur anytime, unwarranted attacks from knee jerk extremists are corrosive and destructive, we are better off points wise losing some (even many) and winning some, rather than drawing many, and feeling good about ourselves and getting relegated. Unwarranted criticism can hound managers out of clubs and destroy fragile confidence for no good reason!

Totally agree.

So do I.

Disgraceful behaviour by a large proportion of 'fans' here and beyond that no doubt filtered through ontot the pitch. Absolutely pathetic.

However, I'm holding off my massive "I told you so" gloating thread for a few games yet though: don't want to create too much of a "them and us" situation here. Last thing we want is an understandable defeat and these numpties start harping on back at us. We all love the club and the important thing is we continue to achieve what a mere handful of us always said we would. Cos we aint acieved it yet!

But we will.

YOU RRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRs!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Millsy]

I'm sorry, criticism on a messageboard has no effect on a football club.

Totally disagree for reasons discussed before.

This is the most popular RFC forum and *the* active discussion area for all things RFC and any player/staff who cares about the club who doesn't frequent this site needs their head seeing to or they need to climb out of the cardboard box they've been living in for the last 15 years!

Negativity after minimal signings and a bad run is expected. But the *extent* of the relentless negativity on here has been uncalled for, unfair, out of proportion, infectious and in many cases just plain stupid. And I'm not just talking about the usual suspect windup parasites.

It definitely filters through to the players/team/staff both directly and indirectly via spreading bad feelings amongst supporters.

[Norfolk Royal]

I'm sorry, criticism on a messageboard has no effect on a football club.

Totally disagree for reasons discussed before.

This is the most popular RFC forum and *the* active discussion area for all things RFC and any player/staff who cares about the club who doesn't frequent this site needs their head seeing to or they need to climb out of the cardboard box they've been living in for the last 15 years!

Negativity after minimal signings and a bad run is expected. But the *extent* of the relentless negativity on here has been uncalled for, unfair, out of proportion, infectious and in many cases just plain stupid. And I'm not just talking about the usual suspect windup parasites.

It definitely filters through to the players/team/staff both directly and indirectly via spreading bad feelings amongst supporters.

What proportion of Reading fans read this board, 5 per cent, four per cent, difficult to see how that spreads discontent.

However, that's not to say that thousands of the others might be discontented.

[sucatraps]

I suspect that Earleyroyal and I, would and do agree about a number of issues However I would say that if you pick bits out of my comment in isolation and disagree it is perfectly fair, but also misleading. For example it is a fact that avoiding drawing is a good strategy, winning and losing seems to be shit or bust, but is actually more effective point total wise. I don't agree with everybodys opinions, but I will defend anybody's right to their point of view. My own fear is based on my own personal make up, piss on my chips often enough and I would wash my hands of you, I hope and expect that players and managers are made of sterner stuff!

[Millsy]

I'm sorry, criticism on a messageboard has no effect on a football club.

Totally disagree for reasons discussed before.

This is the most popular RFC forum and *the* active discussion area for all things RFC and any player/staff who cares about the club who doesn't frequent this site needs their head seeing to or they need to climb out of the cardboard box they've been living in for the last 15 years!

Negativity after minimal signings and a bad run is expected. But the *extent* of the relentless negativity on here has been uncalled for, unfair, out of proportion, infectious and in many cases just plain stupid. And I'm not just talking about the usual suspect windup parasites.

It definitely filters through to the players/team/staff both directly and indirectly via spreading bad feelings amongst supporters.

What proportion of Reading fans read this board, 5 per cent, four per cent, difficult to see how that spreads discontent.

However, that's not to say that thousands of the others might be discontented.

I refer to my points above. Firstly I dispute 5% but even so that can easily spread discontent on its own. And it's arguable that the more involved fans would contribute here so it's an important few percent. As the only largescale focus of discussion, views here generally diffuse through the rest of the fans who perhaps don't have the means/will/time to contribute on here themselves. I'm always coming across fans who, although not direct contributors to this online community, express views and talk about rumours etc that clearly originated here.

A good case in point is Pants Day. Originated here, a few random posts and it turned into a massive phenomenon, which arguably singlehandedly changed the fortunes of our club overnight.

But anyway, much more importantly, it's the direct effect on the players/staff that concerns me most. I'd be extremely surprised if over 50% of RFC didn't keep tabs on this board. 100% if you include relatives etc.

[Smoking Kills Dancing Doe]

We should never have been in this position and that's why Coppell deserves all he gets.

He also deserves all the credit in turning this side round in the last few weeks.

Doesn't make up for him turning us from a comfortable mid table side to relegation candidates because of his transfer policies.

We were great today though. The boys owe him and produced for him.

Is he the man to take us forward though? It would seem unless he changes his transfer policy 100% the answer is still no.

[CMRoyal]

We should never have been in this position and that's why Coppell deserves all he gets.

He also deserves all the credit in turning this side round in the last few weeks.

Doesn't make up for him turning us from a comfortable mid table side to relegation candidates because of his transfer policies.

We were great today though. The boys owe him and produced for him.

Is he the man to take us forward though? It would seem unless he changes his transfer policy 100% the answer is still no.

God, I hope he doesn't change it 100% (asuming you are talking about this season?). No more Roseniors or Matejovskys? That would not be a good move.

[RoyalBlue]

Presumably Sucatraps didn't hear SC's post match interview where he welcomed a very much needed and deserved win but stressed there was an awful lot more work to be done before the job was complete.

Fingers crossed that we have now turned the corner and will stay up. If so, those of us who expressed doubt that SC could do that should apologise for lacking faith. However, I don't that apology should extend for ever daring to criticise SC and his management team this season. I'm sure they would be honest enough to admit that they have made a good number of mistakes this season (hopefully lessons learned for next) and that the performances of their team have been pretty dire at times. End of term report might well read, 'Scraped past but with a little more concentration and effort, could do better!'

[sucatraps]

I'd settle for just scraped past, but could do better for now, some folks on here seemed to be of the "win the league or be shot like a dog" school of reasonability. That to me just seems unreasonable. We travel to Anfield next and will do well to come away unembarrassed, it's the nature of this league. To pillory SSC for doing a professional job under difficult circumstances, much of which we know nothing about, but still pontificate over, is just as unreasonable. IMHO

[The whole year inn]

I'd like to apologise on behalf of Alan Partridge, if he doesn't mind.

It's no coincidence that Rosenior and Bikey have come into the side and Reading have kept 2 clean sheets.

Exactly.

The first priority was to stop conceding stupid goals and we are well on the way towards doing that.

Confidence from the back seeps through to the attackers and they will start scoring

[Row Z Royal]

I'm not going to apologise. I pay too much money to not complain when we're crap. Equally, I'm cheered today by an excellent team performance and a vital 3 points.

[Smoking Kills Dancing Doe]

We should never have been in this position and that's why Coppell deserves all he gets.

He also deserves all the credit in turning this side round in the last few weeks.

Doesn't make up for him turning us from a comfortable mid table side to relegation candidates because of his transfer policies.

We were great today though. The boys owe him and produced for him.

Is he the man to take us forward though? It would seem unless he changes his transfer policy 100% the answer is still no.

God, I hope he doesn't change it 100% (asuming you are talking about this season?). No more Roseniors or Matejovskys? That would not be a good move.

Neither player was what we needed. Matejovsky looks a good player, but hasn't added the steel our midfield has missed completely since Sid's departure. Rosenior was signed to replace Little (and people can't say he wasn't cause we swapped him for our only other winger). He's a fine right back, but we've still not replaced Little.

Coppell couldn't make the choices he needed to make this season, like not dropping Murty, relying on squad players to replace 1st teamers, being too scared of upsetting the under performing squad to spend money.

We've gone so far backwards this season and yes that's partly that's down to the success we had last season, but it wasn't over achievement, we were that good. We can't afford to go backwards again this summer.

[sucatraps]

Neither player was what we needed. Matejovsky looks a good player, but hasn't added the steel our midfield has missed completely since Sid's departure. Rosenior was signed to replace Little (and people can't say he wasn't cause we swapped him for our only other winger). He's a fine right back, but we've still not replaced Little.

Coppell couldn't make the choices he needed to make this season, like not dropping Murty, relying on squad players to replace 1st teamers, being too scared of upsetting the under performing squad to spend money.

We've gone so far backwards this season and yes that's partly that's down to the success we had last season, but it wasn't over achievement, we were that good. We can't afford to go backwards again this summer.[/quote]

Let me clear, I'm not disagreeing with you or saying you're wrong, but why are you able to write as though your "opinions" are gilt edged facts, a lot like other posts I read on here that influence other peoples views, without revealing sources, or the voracity of the opinion being tested?

[earleyroyal]

I suspect that Earleyroyal and I, would and do agree about a number of issues However I would say that if you pick bits out of my comment in isolation and disagree it is perfectly fair, but also misleading. For example it is a fact that avoiding drawing is a good strategy, winning and losing seems to be shit or bust, but is actually more effective point total wise. I don't agree with everybodys opinions, but I will defend anybody's right to their point of view. My own fear is based on my own personal make up, piss on my chips often enough and I would wash my hands of you, I hope and expect that players and managers are made of sterner stuff!

I probably do agree with you on most issues, my point was that the only people who should be apologising for their criticisms are people whose criticism was unwarranted and over the top. Where we might disagree is that I think this only applies to a few people (people who started 'Coppell out' threads and so on) whereas your definition of 'unwarranted criticism' is probably more inclusive than mine.

2WW 1WC: fair enough if you believe that these discussions may have an effect on the club, but I would hope that the players and staff would be professional enough to put these things out of their mind before doing their job. It's not as if these boards have been 100% negative recently - there's plenty of positive things being said, and there were in the middle of our losing run.

I'm not sure where the point about winning and losing is relevant to this discussion, the club will obviously aim for the best outcome of every match and the criticism was not that the club was losing, more the manner in which it was - selections etc.

Anyway I like to see the positive side of things, I don't think the squad is quite up to Prem standard in all areas and I think there should have been investment in the January window but I'm just as proud of the team as I was last year. The club should not be immune from criticism; nearly all of the people criticising are just as passionate, loyal and decent as the positive fans.

[sucatraps]

Blimey! HNA in moderately intelligent and thoughtful dialogue with each other, without resorting to crass insults and polarized opinion

[Platypuss]

I thnk that's an excellent post earleyroyal.