This Looks Nice

[Maguire]

If I've missed one, tell me about it. They are rare beasts.

As I've said before we are not talking about standard stuff like winning a tackle,
feeding the winger or whatever, the stock stuff. We are talking about those few
occasions where a player does something exceptional and takes a NOTICEABLY
large (unacknowledged) part in a goal.

Purely subjective. Who determines what is "exceptional" or "NOTICEABLY large"? This is just invented shit. You gave one to Leigertwood for a bog standard ball into the channel at Ipswich, which ALF chased, got to before his man, held it up, put a cross over, and Hunt finished.

Pearce could make a brilliant tackle in the six-yard box, beat two players,
play a 1-2 with Elwood, beat two more players, feed Kebe, then do a diving
header from the Kebe cross... the keeper at full stretch tips the ball onto a post
and Church taps in. The official stats would "ignore" Pearce

No, they'd give him an assist for having his header turned onto the post.

[Extended-Phenotype]

To be fair, I appreciate what Snowball is trying to do regarding half-assists. I’ve never really been a fan of assists, anyway – like Snowball is hinting at (but perhaps not using the best example), often the assist rewards a player who had the least to do with the goal.

The assist to the assister could have been a mazy run beating 4 players, to which the assister receives the ball and simply lays it off for the scorer. Massive glitch in the reward system there.

Plus, the scorer could have had a lot of work to do to convert a bad pass. I’d say half of all assists are a reflection on the goalscorer rather than the assister.

Think Beckham. How many assists did he get for England? Yet measure that against how many opportunities he got (took ALL the setpieces) and who he was planting them on (goal machine’s like Owen) and he suddenly ain’t so special.

Like Meathead said, it’s the inconsistency in recording the data which makes it worthless, rather than the concept (which I like).

[Snowball]

If you ignore those six poor results (which were DLLWLD) their form is 2.09 ppg.

I'm trying to imagine the furore if I said I'll just take out X games FROM THE MIDDLE of a run
or used sample sizes of 4...

LOL @ furore.

It's an Internet message board not the oxf*rd United Nations.

Wossup? Did you have to look "furore" up in a dictionary?

[Snowball]

[quote="Maguire"]

Purely subjective. Who determines what is "exceptional" or "NOTICEABLY large"?

This is just invented shit.

You gave one to Leigertwood for a bog standard ball into the channel at Ipswich, which ALF chased, got to before his man, held it up, put a cross over, and Hunt finished.

[quote]

It doesn't MATTER whether it's subjective or not!

If someone awards a half-assist he needs to say WHY he awards it
and then people can choose to accept that award or not.

I have SAID why, and it happens that in ONE CASE you disagree.

You say that Elwood's ball was a bog-standard ball into the channels.

I disagree. It wasn't merely banging it up the line, something which would never get a half-assist,
from my memory Elwood won a ball and then made a very long CROSSFIELD diagonal into
"if you like" the channels. The fact is (IMO) it was a fabulous, special pass, worthy of note.

I don't dispute for a second that this is a (my) subjective opinion, but I explained at the time
so all it means is, for those who disagree that Elwood deserves credit, they merely discount
that whackingly large half an assist.


There are others that don't think two of Kebe's byline dribbles, hard-low-crosses which caused OGs are "not assists"
one last season, one this. I disagree. The difference is I've been specific and stated my exact reasons and others
can then agree or disagree.

Like personally I didn't take McAnuff's goal off him and give it to Church, but subjectively I do think it was Church's

But then I think the one Church pinched off Kebe should have gone down to Kebe with Harte the assist (I didn't do that either)

[melonhead]

youve not done it for every goal though, its all a bit pointless


just like this protracted discussion

[redscot]

just like this protracted discussion

If protracted discussions are to be baned, there will not be many discussions on here!

[melonhead]

just like this protracted discussion

If protracted discussions are to be baned, there will not be many discussions on here!

its not protracted discussions that i have a problem with, its pointless ones, where the same points are posted again and again in circular form

[leicsRoyal]

just like this protracted discussion

If protracted discussions are to be baned, there will not be many discussions on here!

its not protracted discussions that i have a problem with, its pointless ones, where the same points are posted again and again in circular form

What was the point?

[melonhead]

stop protracting

[leicsRoyal]

stop protracting

[Snowball]

youve not done it for every goal though, its all a bit pointless


just like this protracted discussion

Jesus, Melon. How many times do I have to tell you that a pass to the assister
is USUALLY stock stuff and not worth mentioning in dispatches?

The extra tweak, the SPECIAL pass, like for example Player A beats two players, threads an exquisite
thru-ball to a player B who doesn't shoot but passes sideways to C for a goal.

C gets the goal
B gets the assist
A gets a half (as I see it)


But MOST OF THE TIME THAT ISN'T RELEVANT


Another case... Harte's super cross gives Kebe a header which is going it.

Kebe-Goal
Harte-Assist

BUT Church touches the ball before it crosses the line (presume the ball was going in anyway)

Church gets a goal almost by accident
Kebe-Goal-demoted to assist
Harte-Assist-demoted to half-assist

or the other case, dribble by Kebe, hard-low cross-shot causes an OG. technically NOT an assist, but I'd almost always award it


Or a player does well, shoots, ball hits a post, comes off the post hits the keeper and it's a keeper's OG. Yet we don't credit the shot?

[Snowball]

youve not done it for every goal though, its all a bit pointless

I've done it for every goal

[leicsRoyal]

I am definitely looking for a half assist on Saturday!

[melonhead]

youve not done it for every goal though, its all a bit pointless


just like this protracted discussion

Jesus, Melon. How many times do I have to tell you that a pass to the assister
is USUALLY stock stuff and not worth mentioning in dispatches?

The extra tweak, the SPECIAL pass, like for example Player A beats two players, threads an exquisite
thru-ball to a player B who doesn't shoot but passes sideways to C for a goal.

C gets the goal
B gets the assist
A gets a half (as I see it)


But MOST OF THE TIME THAT ISN'T RELEVANT


Another case... Harte's super cross gives Kebe a header which is going it.

Kebe-Goal
Harte-Assist

BUT Church touches the ball before it crosses the line (presume the ball was going in anyway)

Church gets a goal almost by accident
Kebe-Goal-demoted to assist
Harte-Assist-demoted to half-assist

or the other case, dribble by Kebe, hard-low cross-shot causes an OG. technically NOT an assist, but I'd almost always award it


Or a player does well, shoots, ball hits a post, comes off the post hits the keeper and it's a keeper's OG. Yet we don't credit the shot?

youve decided whats special based on what?

what if you werent there, couldnt tell on th ehighlights if the half assist was special enough to be included?


actualy i agree totally at any stat which increases kebes god like genius, so carry on

[Snowball]

You've decided whats special based on what?

Common-sense, viewing experience, history, out-of-the-ordinariness. It's not rocket science

What if you werent there, couldnt tell on the highlights if the half assist was special enough to be included?

Then, unless those who were there raved about it, I'd have insufficient data. That's not rocket science either.

[Maguire]

It doesn't MATTER whether it's subjective or not!

Not in the world of opinion perhaps, but it does in the world of science.

If you start making stuff up then they're not really what i would term "statistics", just an array of numbers reflecting your thoughts.

[Snowball]

I am definitely looking for a half assist on Saturday!

Thanks, as I can't go.

[Snowball]

It doesn't MATTER whether it's subjective or not!

Not in the world of opinion perhaps, but it does in the world of science.

If you start making stuff up then they're not really what i would term "statistics", just an array of numbers reflecting your thoughts.

It isn't making anything up. It's a specific statement about an extra contribution.

Those who saw the game or review the game then choose whether or not to accept my interpretation.



I give you Kebe's near-hundred metre break last year. He didn't get the goal, he didn't get the assist,
technically he didn't (wouldn't) get half an assist.

His cross was played by a defender before the RFC player latched on to it.

But to not consider Kebe's contribution as major is plain stupidity

[The Rouge]

It doesn't MATTER whether it's subjective or not!

Not in the world of opinion perhaps, but it does in the world of science.

If you start making stuff up then they're not really what i would term "statistics", just an array of numbers reflecting your thoughts.

It isn't making anything up. It's a specific statement about an extra contribution.

Those who saw the game or review the game then choose whether or not to accept my interpretation.



I give you Kebe's near-hundred metre break last year. He didn't get the goal, he didn't get the assist,
technically he didn't (wouldn't) get half an assist.

His cross was played by a defender before the RFC player latched on to it.

But to not consider Kebe's contribution as major is plain stupidity

I thought it went Kebe to RFC Player(assister) to RFC player (scorer)

[Extended-Phenotype]

RFC Player scored and assisted?

I'm glad my subscription isn't going to waste.