Fielding "weakened" teams in the FA Cup

[Y25]

Arsenull would have beaten us anyway

[Southbank Old Boy]

Bikey fits into our system perfectly, it's just at the moment the manager thinks Doobs and Ivar are the right selection

The rest dont get in the side at the moment either because our manager feels other players are better

You can dress it up anyway you like saying so and so might be good enough or such and such has played in the league but that TEAM was sent out on to a glorified training session in the the worlds most famous cup competition

I'm pissed off and embarassed by the way my club has approached the cup and trying to excuse by saying it wasn't such a bad team doesnt cut any ice

[SpaceCruiser]

Bikey fits into our system perfectly, it's just at the moment the manager thinks Doobs and Ivar are the right selection

Erm, you are wrong. Bikey got suspended and then injured. While he was out, Duberry and Ingimarsson have done well (i.e. we haven't lost with them in the team since the Cardiff away league game), so why should Coppell change things?

[Victor Meldrew]

Just out of interest does anybody else think that Coppell will now play weakened teams in some of our league games?
He certainly did against Southampton and look what happened-2 points dropped.

You don't seem to have a clue why he did that. Two games in three days.

Two games in 3 days eh?
What about the hundreds of other players that played twice in three days?
Fine if we had won the game but just in case you didn't notice we only drew and 2 points dropped could mean the difference between promotion and not.

BTW listening to Jimmy Armfield the other day on the radio and he reminded us that one year they played on the Saturday,then again on Christmas Day AND Boxing Day and then again on the Saturday and on New Year's Day so 5 games in about 10 days and of course there were no subs and pitches were energy-sapping or bone hard unlike the carpets that most play on today.
Also Liverpool famously used just 14 players in one of their all-conquering seasons.
One other point-the two players in question didn't get a rest as they had to sit and freeze for an hour before coming on and I think Harper hadn't got into the pace of the game when he let McGoldrick through unchallenged to score.
Tell players they are tired and need a rest and they will feel tired.

[Southbank Old Boy]

Bikey fits into our system perfectly, it's just at the moment the manager thinks Doobs and Ivar are the right selection

Erm, you are wrong. Bikey got suspended and then injured. While he was out, Duberry and Ingimarsson have done well (i.e. we haven't lost with them in the team since the Cardiff away league game), so why should Coppell change things?

So how am I wrong? Is Bikey really playing?

Bikey is available but Coppell is staying with the pair that are performing. It has nothing to do with him not fitting into our system as SCIAG was suggesting it's a just a decision that Coppell is making, presumably because he thinks that either the two in the team have done nothing to warrent dropping or that he doesn't see Bikey as better

[SpaceCruiser]

Two games in 3 days eh?
What about the hundreds of other players that played twice in three days?
Fine if we had won the game but just in case you didn't notice we only drew and 2 points dropped could mean the difference between promotion and not.

We're still second though.

BTW listening to Jimmy Armfield the other day on the radio and he reminded us that one year they played on the Saturday,then again on Christmas Day AND Boxing Day and then again on the Saturday and on New Year's Day so 5 games in about 10 days and of course there were no subs and pitches were energy-sapping or bone hard unlike the carpets that most play on today.
Also Liverpool famously used just 14 players in one of their all-conquering seasons.
One other point-the two players in question didn't get a rest as they had to sit and freeze for an hour before coming on and I think Harper hadn't got into the pace of the game when he let McGoldrick through unchallenged to score.
Tell players they are tired and need a rest and they will feel tired.

You don't seem to realise that football is a bit more different these days.

So how am I wrong? Is Bikey really playing?

Bikey is available but Coppell is staying with the pair that are performing. It has nothing to do with him not fitting into our system as SCIAG was suggesting it's a just a decision that Coppell is making, presumably because he thinks that either the two in the team have done nothing to warrent dropping or that he doesn't see Bikey as better

Ah, so I was basically agreeing with you, I just didn't see what post you were replying to.

[Victor Meldrew]

Bikey fits into our system perfectly, it's just at the moment the manager thinks Doobs and Ivar are the right selection

Erm, you are wrong. Bikey got suspended and then injured. While he was out, Duberry and Ingimarsson have done well (i.e. we haven't lost with them in the team since the Cardiff away league game), so why should Coppell change things?

Spacey you could pick a fight in an empty room.
All Southbank was saying was that the manager preferred to play the other two and he made no suggestion that Coppell should change it.
I had forgotten what a numbskull you are-why don't you clear off and annoy people on AE and let people who know something about football carry on debating on here.

[Victor Meldrew]

Spacey oh genius of football tell me how football is different?
They still play games for 90 minutes and then the medical staff make sure they get the best immediate treatment if required after the game.
They play with a ball that is easy to kick and head whether it is raining or is dry.
Nobody limps along on the pitch if they have a semblance of an injury,a sub comes on.
For most away games they relax at a hotel overnight before having a gentle warm-up before a game so there are no 4-5 hour coach journies and for some league games they actually fly there.

The game is faster but the players are fitter and don't forget nobody tackles any more.
No,I won't have this "the game has moved on" business implying that they now do something completely different because IMHO the players have it so much easier than they have ever had it and to play twice in two days (and then have nearly two weeks off) doesn't strike me as desperately hard work.

[Terminal Boardom]

Interesting to see a lot of top flight teams fielding strong teams this weekend - coincidentally these are the teams which seem to be performing well in the league like Liverpool, Chelsea, Villa, etc.

Agreed

[brendywendy]

who cares-the manager takes teh view that at the moment we arent in a position to seriously have a view to winning this competition-and that a few days out at 1/4, semi and final stage isnt worth jeopardising the ultimate goal

i for one am happy to go along with that, i can see the reasoning, and agree in part with all of it
to the extent that im still wanting to pay money to go and watch the game that i know wont contain all our "stars"

[Terminal Boardom]

Spacey oh genius of football tell me how football is different?
They still play games for 90 minutes and then the medical staff make sure they get the best immediate treatment if required after the game.
They play with a ball that is easy to kick and head whether it is raining or is dry.
Nobody limps along on the pitch if they have a semblance of an injury,a sub comes on.
For most away games they relax at a hotel overnight before having a gentle warm-up before a game so there are no 4-5 hour coach journies and for some league games they actually fly there.

The game is faster but the players are fitter and don't forget nobody tackles any more.
No,I won't have this "the game has moved on" business implying that they now do something completely different because IMHO the players have it so much easier than they have ever had it and to play twice in two days (and then have nearly two weeks off) doesn't strike me as desperately hard work.

And the pitches are a million times better now. Anyone remember what the Baseball Ground looked like in the 70s? You would be lucky to see a blade of grass in February. Easter matches in the 70s? I remember us playing Good Friday, Saturday and Easter Monday in 78/9 (Bournemouth away, Pompey home and Sh1te at home).

[Terminal Boardom]

who cares-the manager takes teh view that at the moment we arent in a position to seriously have a view to winning this competition-and that a few days out at 1/4, semi and final stage isnt worth jeopardising the ultimate goal

i for one am happy to go along with that, i can see the reasoning, and agree in part with all of it
to the extent that im still wanting to pay money to go and watch the game that i know wont contain all our "stars"

Would anyone be happy with buying a tcket to a RSC production and being "treated" to the understudies?

[brendywendy]

who cares-the manager takes teh view that at the moment we arent in a position to seriously have a view to winning this competition-and that a few days out at 1/4, semi and final stage isnt worth jeopardising the ultimate goal

i for one am happy to go along with that, i can see the reasoning, and agree in part with all of it
to the extent that im still wanting to pay money to go and watch the game that i know wont contain all our "stars"

Would anyone be happy with buying a tcket to a RSC production and being "treated" to the understudies?

im not talking about the theatre but you are missing a very important point about your analogy that doesnt work on many levels:

at any time, for any reason any theatre production, can, and do offer up understudies, as part of their developement, and to rest the main stars etc.


and when it happens the fans/customers have the same right you do, to walk out, or lump it
i for one relish the opportunity to see how those on the fringes are shaping up, and enjoyed my day on the terraces

[winchester_royal]

I agree with Bendy. Personally I look forward to seeing youngsters like Karacan, Kelly etc in competitive fixtures.

[Southbank Old Boy]

I too enjoy seeing how the youngsters are developing but yesterday shows nothing of how these guys would cope in a proper first team and how they would play alongside the true first team because they weren't there

I disagree with the FA Cup being an enovironment where you test out youngsters and give injured players a chance to get a run out. It should be treated as a proper first team fixture like any other game. If the manager thinks he has a youngster ready to be thrown in then fine, throw him in alongside the first team and test him out. With 3 from 5 subs allowed to play every game it leaves plenty of scope to try them out week in week out

[Terminal Boardom]

Everyone is entitled to get up and walk out - or to not even bother buying a ticket when knowing in advance that the first XI have their feet up relaxing somewhere

However, I can not see the real value of wholesale changes to a line up. Those coming in know that they will probably be nowehere near the first XI for the next league match which then questions the levels of motivation within those players. Playing away at OT in the Cup? Motivation not a problem. Away to Cardiff? Different matter altogether. If changes are to be made then make 2 or 3 to see how the youngsters gel with the "existing" stars. I for one would have preferred to have seen Kebe start on the left - especially as there have been many posts stating that this is his preferred side.

[Southbank Old Boy]

who cares-the manager takes teh view that at the moment we arent in a position to seriously have a view to winning this competition-and that a few days out at 1/4, semi and final stage isnt worth jeopardising the ultimate goal

i for one am happy to go along with that, i can see the reasoning, and agree in part with all of it
to the extent that im still wanting to pay money to go and watch the game that i know wont contain all our "stars"

Would anyone be happy with buying a tcket to a RSC production and being "treated" to the understudies?

im not talking about the theatre but you are missing a very important point about your analogy that doesnt work on many levels:

at any time, for any reason any theatre production, can, and do offer up understudies, as part of their developement, and to rest the main stars etc.


and when it happens the fans/customers have the same right you do, to walk out, or lump it
i for one relish the opportunity to see how those on the fringes are shaping up, and enjoyed my day on the terraces

I hate the comparison of football with theatre

The majority of football fans go because they're there to support their team not to watch a specific game like they would a specific play/show, however, how often do theatre companies change whole of the cast?

Anyone going to the game should've known the side we were putting out, I dont really have a problem with it on the day as such. Its the whole policy that gets to me

I support my club and want us to do the best we can at all times. The way we treat the cup isnt doing that and as a supporter of my club (and not just a paying customer watching a one off show) who will be here long after most of the staff and players have left, I want to see us having a go, not meekly turning up and playing the reserves

[Terminal Boardom]

I hate the comparison of football with theatre

The majority of football fans go because they're there to support their team not to watch a specific game like they would a specific play/show, however, how often do theatre companies change whole of the cast?

Agree totally. After all, football should not be regarded as entertainment.

Anyone going to the game should've known the side we were putting out, I dont really have a problem with it on the day as such. Its the whole policy that gets to me

Looking at a bit of club devaluation if you ask me.

I support my club and want us to do the best we can at all times. The way we treat the cup isnt doing that and as a supporter of my club (and not just a paying customer watching a one off show) who will be here long after most of the staff and players have left, I want to see us having a go, not meekly turning up and playing the reserves

Which is why wholesale changes can never make sense. And another thing, it is disrespectful to your opponents by blatantly weakening the starting XI. After all, its not as if we have the embarrassment of riches that Wenger has.

[brendywendy]

i think you may as well get used to the idea that while the club is set up as is, with madejski at the helm, in current club position that we will persue this policy for the forseeable future
maybe if there is more money with a new owner coppell will then think perhaps we are now in a position to have a go
until then give up, or whinge quieter!

[Thames]

Karacan is rubbish though. He's way too lightweight.