by Tails » 06 Feb 2010 19:44
by URZZZZZZZZ » 06 Feb 2010 19:46
by Row Z Royal » 06 Feb 2010 19:47
by exileinleeds » 06 Feb 2010 19:48
ElliottURZZZZZZZZ Khizanishvilli looked capable. Won't be too dissapointed with him starting Tuesday. Griffin superb again. Chuffed!
That's just showing off![]()
I also thought Zurab looked pretty solid, just hope the handball only warrents a one game ban, rather than three.
by Franchise FC » 06 Feb 2010 19:49
Rev Algenon Stickleback HIan Royal If it's accidental there is an argument it's not even a penalty, let alone a red card.!
it doesn't neeed to be deliberately handled to be handball.
The "deliberate" part concerns the position of the arm - i.e. was his arm in a natural position or had he deliberately positioned his arm? If your arm is out, then even if you are looking in the other direction, it's handball. If your arm is in a natural position and the ball hits it, then even it it prevents a certain goal, it's not handball.
With this one, there didn't look to be anything at all unnatural about his stance, and the ball came straight at him. There would be grounds for saying it's not handball, but he makes so much contact with the ball, dragging it round, that hardly any refs wouldn't give it.
Once given then there's no choice but to give a red card. It was a foul that denied a clear goalscoring opportunity, and therefore a red card. An intention to cheat doesn't come into it.
by 79Royal » 06 Feb 2010 19:51
exileinleedsElliottURZZZZZZZZ Khizanishvilli looked capable. Won't be too dissapointed with him starting Tuesday. Griffin superb again. Chuffed!
That's just showing off![]()
I also thought Zurab looked pretty solid, just hope the handball only warrents a one game ban, rather than three.
I dont fancy his chances of getting a song!
by Platypuss » 06 Feb 2010 19:52
Tails Any sensible referee would clearly award a penalty and at most a yellow. He booked Bertrand which was completely unjustified - not a particularly good ref (for us).
by Plymouth_Royal » 06 Feb 2010 19:53
Ian RoyalPlymouth_RoyalIan Royal If it's accidental there is an argument it's not even a penalty, let alone a red card.
A penalty was always the most likely outcome of course. But that was no way a red card. It's a toss up whether it was even a yellow ffs!
I agree a red card was harsh but even accidents should be a pen. If a guy falls over and the ball hits his arm stopping the ball going in, accidental and a pen. In Mills' case, he panicked, his arms were out the ball came off him and hit his arm. Definite pen but no way a red.
How come you see accidental handballs not given as fks / pens reasonably regularly then?
by Rev Algenon Stickleback H » 06 Feb 2010 19:57
Franchise FCRev Algenon Stickleback HIan Royal If it's accidental there is an argument it's not even a penalty, let alone a red card.!
it doesn't neeed to be deliberately handled to be handball.
The "deliberate" part concerns the position of the arm - i.e. was his arm in a natural position or had he deliberately positioned his arm? If your arm is out, then even if you are looking in the other direction, it's handball. If your arm is in a natural position and the ball hits it, then even it it prevents a certain goal, it's not handball.
With this one, there didn't look to be anything at all unnatural about his stance, and the ball came straight at him. There would be grounds for saying it's not handball, but he makes so much contact with the ball, dragging it round, that hardly any refs wouldn't give it.
Once given then there's no choice but to give a red card. It was a foul that denied a clear goalscoring opportunity, and therefore a red card. An intention to cheat doesn't come into it.
Extract from law 12 :
handles the ball deliberately (except for the goalkeeper within his own
penalty area)
Therefore the ball must be handled deliberately
Sticking your arm out with the intention of making yourself a bigger target is deliberate
by rabidbee » 06 Feb 2010 20:04
Rev Algenon Stickleback H You could stand in the wall at a free kick and turn your back, and stick your arms in the air, and it hits your arms, it'd be "deliberate" in the context of a penalty decision - even if there's no way you'd have been deliberately trying to handle the ball.
by Franchise FC » 06 Feb 2010 20:05
rabidbeeRev Algenon Stickleback H You could stand in the wall at a free kick and turn your back, and stick your arms in the air, and it hits your arms, it'd be "deliberate" in the context of a penalty decision - even if there's no way you'd have been deliberately trying to handle the ball.
Except, as you've already sad, you _are_ deliberately trying to handle the ball - you want the ball to hit your arm rather than pass over your head, or why would you put your arms there?
by Tails » 06 Feb 2010 20:05
PlatypussTails Any sensible referee would clearly award a penalty and at most a yellow. He booked Bertrand which was completely unjustified - not a particularly good ref (for us).
Once he's given the handball it has to be a red as the shot was on target. Jeez.
by Rev Algenon Stickleback H » 06 Feb 2010 20:09
TailsPlatypussTails Any sensible referee would clearly award a penalty and at most a yellow. He booked Bertrand which was completely unjustified - not a particularly good ref (for us).
Once he's given the handball it has to be a red as the shot was on target. Jeez.
Maybe so, but you fail to register that I was NOT talking about the letter of the law....if the letter of the law is as you say it is. Jeez. Common sense me ol' mucker.
by Arch » 06 Feb 2010 20:10
by Platypuss » 06 Feb 2010 20:11
TailsPlatypussTails Any sensible referee would clearly award a penalty and at most a yellow. He booked Bertrand which was completely unjustified - not a particularly good ref (for us).
Once he's given the handball it has to be a red as the shot was on target. Jeez.
Maybe so, but you fail to register that I was NOT talking about the letter of the law....if the letter of the law is as you say it is. Jeez. Common sense me ol' mucker.
by ZacNaloen » 06 Feb 2010 20:13
by RoyalBlue » 06 Feb 2010 20:17
Rev Algenon Stickleback HIan Royal If it's accidental there is an argument it's not even a penalty, let alone a red card.!
it doesn't neeed to be deliberately handled to be handball.
The "deliberate" part concerns the position of the arm - i.e. was his arm in a natural position or had he deliberately positioned his arm? If your arm is out, then even if you are looking in the other direction, it's handball. If your arm is in a natural position and the ball hits it, then even it it prevents a certain goal, it's not handball.
With this one, there didn't look to be anything at all unnatural about his stance, and the ball came straight at him. There would be grounds for saying it's not handball, but he makes so much contact with the ball, dragging it round, that hardly any refs wouldn't give it.
Once given then there's no choice but to give a red card. It was a foul that denied a clear goalscoring opportunity, and therefore a red card. An intention to cheat doesn't come into it.
by Matt de K » 06 Feb 2010 20:18
by tomrfcurz » 06 Feb 2010 20:20
by Ian Royal » 06 Feb 2010 20:20
Matt de K It looked to me that he went to block it - realised that he might catch it on his arm - pulled it back in - just as it came off his chest to strike his arm. Harsh red card. Yellow maybe. It was completely unintentional. Sky commentators said he made his way up to them after the final whistle to ask if it was a penalty or not.
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