How Long Will BM Last at this rate?????

[Extended-Phenotype]

It's all just a trifle confusing. The 4-5-1 didn't seem to work without a creative midfielder. Ok, Guthrie hasn't been outstanding but even his haters have to admit he is more of a passer than legs, jem or akpan and the stats show he passes more frequently and more accurately than most. And I don't think he has played badly, or worse than anyone else.

So if he is more suitable for a formation and he hasn't played badly enough (or his replacements haven't played better enough) to warrant his exclusion (from the team let alone squad) it would be good to hear the reason, otherwise it leaves us questioning Brian's ability to select the right team.

Perhaps that is not important? But I'd say just as its important to have your players behind you, its important to have the fans behind you.

Perhaps its wrong to jump to the conclusion that Brian's ability to select the right players is flawed? To be honest, this season has thrown up enough examples to make this assumption valid (Pearce, Feds, Gorkss, Legs, Pog, McCleary issues)..

Otherwise, perhaps its an off-field issue? In which case you'd hope the manager could do his job and fix the issue before it impacts on the team. Sadly, his selection kept us in 4-4-2 for too long at the start of the season, has given us a 4-5-1 with no creativity in the middle during a crunch game and left us open for shredding away in a 4-4-2.

So it has had an impact. In which case the fans have a right to know what is behind some of these decisions, and its more than understandable if frustration is shown.

At the end of the day, everyone on here wants the same thing, and that is Reading to do well.

Ps. If it was just a problem with Guthrie and not Brian, I'd have at least thought our 4-5-1 against wigan could have featured McCleary or HRK wide with McAnuff offering something in the middle. Why are we changing things that seem to work?

[andrew1957]

On the "be careful what you wish for" front - sacking McCarthy has worked realy well for Wolves....not.

That is why I want Brian to stay even if we go down. He might have made errors this season but if we get the wrong manager in we could be looking at League 1.

[Ian Royal]

On the "be careful what you wish for" front - sacking McCarthy has worked realy well for Wolves....not.

That is why I want Brian to stay even if we go down. He might have made errors this season but if we get the wrong manager in we could be looking at League 1.

I haven't bothered to fact check this, but I think teams that have developed a culture of losing by being in relegation fights for several seasons in a row often sink without a trace once they finally succumb and hit that first relegation. Certainly off the top of my head the likes of Coventry and Saints seemed to battle endlessly against relegation and failed to threaten the upper reaches of the Championship for a long time. Wolves seem to be an extention of that.


And if that is the case, I'd say it's a lesson to us that it's better go down after just one or two shit seasons than hang in for three or four.

Ultimately, you can't hang on to a manager in fear that you'll appoint someone shit as his replacement. You have to have faith in your recruitment policy and not let fear of the unknown control you into settling for the mediocrity you know.

[Pepe the Horseman]

On the "be careful what you wish for" front - sacking McCarthy has worked realy well for Wolves....not.

That is why I want Brian to stay even if we go down. He might have made errors this season but if we get the wrong manager in we could be looking at League 1.

Yawn. I'm certainly not rooting for McD to be sacked, but the "don't sack the manager because someone else once sacked their manager and didn't do very well" argument is frankly bollocks.

[Maguire]

And if that is the case, I'd say it's a lesson to us that it's better go down after just one or two shit seasons than hang in for three or four

Yep, I also think we should get out of the Premier League as quickly as possible. What would we want all that money for anyway?

[Ian Royal]

And if that is the case, I'd say it's a lesson to us that it's better go down after just one or two shit seasons than hang in for three or four

Yep, I also think we should get out of the Premier League as quickly as possible. What would we want all that money for anyway?

Money for an extra two seasons doesn't help a lot of all it means is a higher chance of playing in League One in four years time, compared to less money and relegation now meaning a higher chance of playing PL football again in four years time.

Funnily enough, I think it's reasonable to suggest that teams that develop a culture of losing continue to lose even against lesser opposition.

Relegation to League One didn't exactly hurt Norwich a few seasons ago. They came back into the Championship much stronger than they had been in the couple of seasons prior to going down and they ended up in the PL a couple of seasons after their relegation.

[Royalclapper]

Hull seem to be giving it a good go again after they dropped out of the Prem not too long back, ironically Wolves turned their noses up at getting Steve Bruce!

One thing is for sure, the teams that have come up and gone on to do well generally play a better brand of football when compared with our laughable stodgy fairground side-show stuff.

[themadstad]

It's hard to say for me. Anton seems to trust him a lot, and that's unsurprising considering how things have gone.

We didn't improve the quality of this team significantly, if at all tbh, in either of the two windows we could have done. Whether that is solely down to Brian or not isn't fully known.

I saw a stat that showed us 20th for possession and pass success too, this illustrates just how poor we are, Championship team in the Premier League and it's why we aren't staying up. We should have done better with our transfers and if Anton supported Brian in any case then Brian hasn't helped himself.

So let's look for a moment, we go down, poor start, everyone says we'll be ok, including Anton but then fail to get much better? How do we look at changing our style of play? Tried it before and it was a challenge. The transfers and way we play needs looking at if we are to get back here again because let's face it we aren't going to stay up.

Only thing is will Brian be able to manage such a change and do we want it?

[Divvy]

It's hard to say for me. Anton seems to trust him a lot, and that's unsurprising considering how things have gone.

We didn't improve the quality of this team significantly, if at all tbh, in either of the two windows we could have done. Whether that is solely down to Brian or not isn't fully known.

I saw a stat that showed us 20th for possession and pass success too, this illustrates just how poor we are, Championship team in the Premier League and it's why we aren't staying up. We should have done better with our transfers and if Anton supported Brian in any case then he hasn't helped himself.

So we go down, poor start, everyone says we'll be ok, including Anton but then fail to get much better. How do we look at changing our style of play? Tried it before and it was a challenge. The transfers and way we play needs looking at if we are to get back here again because let's face it we aren't going to stay up.

Only thing is will Brian be able to manage such a change and do we want it?

Good post. I don't think Brian has the changes in tactics in him, and his loyalty to certain players also holds him back. A slow start next season could be the end of him if he doesn't offer to go before then.

[Maguire]

And if that is the case, I'd say it's a lesson to us that it's better go down after just one or two shit seasons than hang in for three or four

Yep, I also think we should get out of the Premier League as quickly as possible. What would we want all that money for anyway?

Money for an extra two seasons doesn't help a lot of all it means is a higher chance of playing in League One in four years time

Like Bolton, Hull, Birmingham, Crystal Palace, Leicester, Derby, Ipswich, Blackpool, Middlesbrough etc?

[Ian Royal]

Reading
Average possession: 40%
Average pass completion: 69%

Team // poss // passing
QPR // 45% // 78%
Villa // 44% // 76%
Wigan // 55% // 83%
W Ham // 46% // 74%
Stoke // 43% // 70%
Norwich // 43% // 74%
Saints // 51% // 78%

We're pathetic.

Oh and I can't remember where it was that (I think) Mags argued we weren't the least creative side because we've scored more goals than a couple of teams, when someone else suggested we were.
Team // Shots // Shots on
Reading // 10 // 3
QPR // 13 // 4
Wigan // 13 // 4
Villa // 11 // 3
Saints // 13 // 4
Oh dear, we are the least creative.

[Ouroboros]

More goals tham 7 teams, Ian, not a couple

[southbank1871]

I haven't bothered to fact check this

Doesn't sound like you Ian.

[Ian Royal]

Yep, I also think we should get out of the Premier League as quickly as possible. What would we want all that money for anyway?

Money for an extra two seasons doesn't help a lot of all it means is a higher chance of playing in League One in four years time

Like Bolton, Hull, Birmingham, Crystal Palace, Leicester, Derby, Ipswich, Blackpool, Middlesbrough etc?

The argument I put forward, which you chose to try and take issue with, when I'd said I hadn't fact checked it, was that teams have struggled to stave off relegation for several seasons do worse when eventually relegated than teams who go in their first or second season. So our of your list of clubs, only one is even relevant to the original comment I made. Please understand that I didn't say that going down after one or two seasons of struggle makes you likely to come back quickly, but more quickly than if you hang on for ages.

So of your examples only Bolton comes close to fitting the circumstances I described. And in their first season down, they aren't challenging to come back up. They also finished 7 points clear of relegation the season before they went down, 9 the previous season and 7 the season before that. So it's not that good a fit for the discription anyway.

It seems it's pretty rare for a team to be in relegation fights for lots of seasons running before finally going. Be interesting to see what happens with Wigan when they finally lose out.

So basically, really shit effort Mags.

[Ian Royal]

More goals tham 7 teams, Ian, not a couple

The comment was about us being the least creative of those specific 5 teams, of which we're one and Saints have scored more than us. Which makes it three. So one out.

If you can show more than three teams who create fewer shots than us a match, I'll happily take a correcting on that though.

[Maguire]

More goals tham 7 teams, Ian, not a couple

Bloke's a lost cause

[Maguire]

More goals tham 7 teams, Ian, not a couple

The comment was about us being the least creative of those specific 5 teams, of which we're one and Saints have scored more than us. Which makes it three. So one out.

Nope, the guy said it's hard to imagine a prem team less creative than us.

I pointed out we've scored more goals than seven other teams in said prem.

Please engage your brain.

[Ian Royal]

More goals tham 7 teams, Ian, not a couple

The comment was about us being the least creative of those specific 5 teams, of which we're one and Saints have scored more than us. Which makes it three. So one out.

Nope, the guy said it's hard to imagine a prem team less creative than us.

I pointed out we've scored more goals than seven other teams in said prem.

Please engage your brain.

So find me some examples of teams that create less than us then. Because the ones I listed all create more.

[Maguire]

Create what? I thought goals were what we're trying to create?

Or would you rather have three pops from 25yds than an actual goal?

[Ouroboros]

Ian, if you were counting some carefully-gathered statistics on clear-cut chances then you might, might, have a point.

But you're saying that shots on target/ off target are a better measure of a team's creativity than goals scored. Our good goals to shots ratio itself suggests that we're making better chances than other teams, not fewer.