An admission/apology re BR

[Ian Royal]

This right man at the wrong time stuff is a cop out. The club would surely have known at the start that Rodgers wanted to implement a different style of football. I feel almost as cheated by losing Rodgers as I did about Gylfi. Watching this present bunch of scufflers depresses me. A few pints before the match compensates though.

Obviously the club bought into his vision. Which he failed to implement because he tried to do too much too soon. He pissed people off as only he seems able and that led to them deciding he wasn't going to get the benefit of the doubt when things obviously weren't working.

Maybe if we'd kept him and gone down, we'd have bounced back up and been in a better place. Or maybe we'd still have a different manager and have been staving off relegation for two seasons. Or maybe we'd be midtable League One also rans again.

[Royalee]

'Maybe if we'd kept him and gone down...'

We weren't in the relegation zone when he was sacked Ian.

[melonhead]

[melonhead]

we were awful though, playing crap football, getting shit results, with players out of position, spending two million on a average CB, when we clearly needed to spend some of that money on a number of other positions, including full back
saying some wildly daft things in interviews, and losing the faith of muchof the dressing room as a result
this is all involved in management.

he looks like hes learnt those lessons though, and imporved alot. good luck to him.

[Only one Trevor Morley]

He made a lot of mistakes in a short amount of time - the handling of the Tommy Smith saga being a big one - he never really recovered from that. Players also seemed to love him or hate him - which i never think is a good trait for a manager to have.

I have never been as low as the QPR match, a disgrace of a performance.

Ultimately i support AP and Svalds views and in particular his arrogant I have to be in charge persona....

Yes he had been dealt an excellent hand in getting the Swansea role and played that well. No doubt about it . But as other said no plan b and still loves to rest on the cotails of others and thats why I dont particularly like him as an individual.

[The Goat was fed]

It's very simple. He has done well at Swansea because Martinez had played an attractive passing style, so the players were already in place for Rodger's preferred style. The players were not in place at Reading, so he needed more time.

I strongly believe he would have got more time (I think we have the least threatening fan base in the world for this) if he had explicitly said "this will take some time", but instead he went off on one about European Football in XX years and skilful soldiers and "Jose told me this..." etc.

Basically, he failed to manage expectations, which in any line of work, can make you look a right plonker... and he did.

[Ian Royal]

'Maybe if we'd kept him and gone down...'

We weren't in the relegation zone when he was sacked Ian.

Thank you Lee, I can read a league table and I never said we were. However, the League table isn't frozen in mid-December and we were blatantly in the middle of a relegation fight at that point.

You'll notice that sentence started "Maybe" and when in the context of the rest of the paragraph dealt with possibilities, not certainties.

[Rev Algenon Stickleback H]

he took the rebuilding too far too fast and left us seriously in danger of relegation though
some of his decisions were clearly mental, and he had started to lose the dressing room because of that.

"losing the dressing room" is one of those cliches that gets banded about every time a team is struggling, without the slightest bit of evidence to suggest it's true.

On the other hand, the difference in determination levels where McDermott took over was pretty marked. The Plymouth disaster apart, it did look like the players wanted to play for McDermott more than Rodgers.


Mick Gooding was speaking after the game yesterday and was saying that sometimes you go to a club, and for whatever reason, it's just not the right fit, and you know it's not going to work out. You can go somewhere else and know straight away you'll be at home. He was speaking about that as a playing experience, but the same must be true as a manager. We all (well nearly all) rate Coppell, but he wasn't as successful everywhere he went.

[melonhead]

there is some evidence about starting to lose the dressing room though

[The Goat was fed]

Out of interest, who do we think liked Rodgers and disliked Rodgers within the team?

I reckon McAnuff liked him. He played his best football under Rodgers, I remember thinking for a long time that he was the only good player we had when we looked like we were going to get relegated.

Noel Hunt wouldn't have liked him methinks. Not sure why.

[sandman]

Don't think Matt Mills was his biggest fan, neither was Longy for that matter and I'm sure after what he was exposed to at West Brom Cummings went off him pretty quickly. Didn't Matejovsky (aka the greatest player of all time who's too smart for the other players and is in no way totally out of his depth, honest) throw a bit of a wobbly at him? Don't think Ivar was particularly enamoured either. Maybe Kebe but it's hard to know what Jimmy's thinking most of the time

Darren O'Dear obviously thought a lot of him judging by the interview after his loan deal ended. Jobi, as you mentioned great mate, Rasiak and Churchy probably liked him because they were starting games under him.

[Ian Royal]

Matt Mills wouldn't have liked him for long.

On the basis of who got picked and who didn't, you'd hedge towards Long being in the dislike and Church in the like camp.

[melonhead]

sig was probably a bit peeved when dropped too
although he didnt really start to show he was the best player we had till after brendan went

[sandman]

Probably because Brendan knew how good he was but didn't realise his best position and that he needed to build the team around Gylfi. Instead he persisted with Matejovsky in a variant of the position that Brian had the sense to move Gylfi to.

[Hoop Blah]

I don't think Matt Mills was totally a Rodgers signing as it happens. We'd been linked with him and watching him for quite a while so I think it might've been something that was almost signed and sealed before he came in.

It was also mooted that we'd made a move for Griffin in the summer window but Stoke (or Griffin) wouldn't agree to it at the time which is why Rodgers got Cummings in (a long term purchase to fit in with his long term plan).

There's no doubt that Rodgers rubbed a few people up the wrong way and, as Dirk said, might not've fitted in quite as well as a few others with the whole Reading family thing. That seems a bit odd to me though so although it seems plausable I don't think I quite go for it. Rodgers knew exactly what the club was like and the club knew exactly what Rodgers was like. Perhaps both parties just fell for the romance of the Reading old boy coming back to his home club and becoming a hero.

It didn't work. Rodgers made mistakes and was probably sold down the river a bit as the club told him one thing (that he had time to rebuild) and then bolted after a sticky start.

For what it's worth I thought we'd played some reasonable stuff by the time Rodgers got sacked. Although we would've been in a relegation battle I didn't think we'd be going down as there were signs that results were going to follow an up turn in performances.

Too much too soon yes, but if he was told he had time to fix things and then he wasn't given the time I can understand why he might've felt somewhat cheated at the time. Whoever took over that squad at that time was up against it though so I think Rodgers' biggest lesson was to pick his jobs better, something that he clearly did with Swansea.

[melonhead]

time to rebuild yes

regardless of what division he took us to, no.

one thing JM will do, is act when required

[rhroyal]

I think his 2nd and 3rd season with us would have been a drastic improvement, but the big worry was going down in the 1st. Would have undermined the work of Pardew and Coppell entirely.

I think he tried to change too much to quickly, but lets not forget that the men above him were equally guilty of that. It was a mistake to let Dillon go when he did; he was a great servant for the club and would have helped Rodgers settle well with some continuity. He'd supported and aided 2 very successful managers. We also shipped out a load of experienced players, rightly or wrongly. All the noises from the club were about the end of an era and change; Rodgers was initially given the licence to carry out his plan.

When it appeared the risk of relegation was too high, the board had to go back on their word. League 1 would have been a disaster, still the right decision in my opinion. They made a lot of mistakes with Rodgers' appointment though which he paid for. So much success built upon continuity and stability; the summer of 2009 was the complete opposite.

Can't overlook Rodgers' mistakes too. Fitness was poor, Mills was a waste of money as he never played him, Pearce had too much pressure being captain an early stage in his career. To name but 3.

But when people say "Rodgers tried to change too much, too quick" I don't entirely agree. The whole club did, and Rodgers bore the brunt when it failed. We went back to plan A at that stage, good decision. Several mistakes before though.

[swansea jack]

I think his 2nd and 3rd season with us would have been a drastic improvement, but the big worry was going down in the 1st. Would have undermined the work of Pardew and Coppell entirely.

I think he tried to change too much to quickly, but lets not forget that the men above him were equally guilty of that. It was a mistake to let Dillon go when he did; he was a great servant for the club and would have helped Rodgers settle well with some continuity. He'd supported and aided 2 very successful managers. We also shipped out a load of experienced players, rightly or wrongly. All the noises from the club were about the end of an era and change; Rodgers was initially given the licence to carry out his plan.

When it appeared the risk of relegation was too high, the board had to go back on their word. League 1 would have been a disaster, still the right decision in my opinion. They made a lot of mistakes with Rodgers' appointment though which he paid for. So much success built upon continuity and stability; the summer of 2009 was the complete opposite.

Can't overlook Rodgers' mistakes too. Fitness was poor, Mills was a waste of money as he never played him, Pearce had too much pressure being captain an early stage in his career. To name but 3.

But when people say "Rodgers tried to change too much, too quick" I don't entirely agree. The whole club did, and Rodgers bore the brunt when it failed. We went back to plan A at that stage, good decision. Several mistakes before though.

Surprised about the fitness issue especially as out boyos are incredibly fit - more of a legacy issue at both clubs? Did the change in play highlight this at RFC?

[rhroyal]

I think his 2nd and 3rd season with us would have been a drastic improvement, but the big worry was going down in the 1st. Would have undermined the work of Pardew and Coppell entirely.

I think he tried to change too much to quickly, but lets not forget that the men above him were equally guilty of that. It was a mistake to let Dillon go when he did; he was a great servant for the club and would have helped Rodgers settle well with some continuity. He'd supported and aided 2 very successful managers. We also shipped out a load of experienced players, rightly or wrongly. All the noises from the club were about the end of an era and change; Rodgers was initially given the licence to carry out his plan.

When it appeared the risk of relegation was too high, the board had to go back on their word. League 1 would have been a disaster, still the right decision in my opinion. They made a lot of mistakes with Rodgers' appointment though which he paid for. So much success built upon continuity and stability; the summer of 2009 was the complete opposite.

Can't overlook Rodgers' mistakes too. Fitness was poor, Mills was a waste of money as he never played him, Pearce had too much pressure being captain an early stage in his career. To name but 3.

But when people say "Rodgers tried to change too much, too quick" I don't entirely agree. The whole club did, and Rodgers bore the brunt when it failed. We went back to plan A at that stage, good decision. Several mistakes before though.

Surprised about the fitness issue especially as out boyos are incredibly fit - more of a legacy issue at both clubs? Did the change in play highlight this at RFC?

Maybe fitness is something he learned from us. We lost a lot of games late on and Shane Long must have put on a stone easily. Rodgers talked about technical training a lot, he overlooked fitness. Also, you're better on the ball than we were which means you don't have to chase around after it so much.

[Ian Royal]

time to rebuild yes

regardless of what division he took us to, no.

one thing JM will do, is act when required

Exactly. JM would have given him time if we were just looking like mid-table mediocrity. We weren't, we were looking relegation fodder.