We will survive this won't we?

[Clyde1998]

Even before that we rarely featured in tier 4.

I think I'm right in saying we've spent considerably more seasons in tier 2 than 4. I think it's something like

Tier 1 - 3
Tier 2 - twenty or thirty
Tier 3 - many lots
Tier 4 - about 7/8.

So by any measure we're an upper L1 club at least and definitely a big fish in L2. Albeit that doesn’t mean we can't be shit and find ourselves outside the league.

It's 3; 29; 57 and 8 respectively (twenty-five seasons were in the Third Division South). Our average finishing position since being a league club has been 50th (equivalent to 6th in League One); since 2000, it's been 31st (11th in the Championship).

For anyone over 30, you'd've grown up with us typically being a third tier club with the occasional season in the division higher or lower.

Yeah it’s definitely a generational thing with viewing how big the club is. For me being 51 and being taken to my first game in the late 70’s we’re not a big club, I’ve always viewed as as a Division 3 size club even with the move to the Mad Stad and always felt we were punching above our weight in the Championship let alone Prem.
But for my kids who are 26 and 24 it’s completely different. We were in Champ when I started taking them so this is their first experience of us below the top 2 divisions.

This is my first experience of the third tier as well, but I feel we're a lower Championship club on average - which means we'll have periods challenging towards the top end of the Championship (with the potential of the odd season in the Prem) and periods when we drop into League One.

Many clubs have caught us up (at least in stadium terms) since we were last in the third tier (Cardiff, Swansea, Hull, Brighton, Brentford, Blackpool, etc.). Bigger sides we were ahead of in the 2000s - Nottm Forest, Leeds, Southampton, Coventry, Wolves etc. - have returned to a more natural position in the pyramid (generally as financial issues have been resolved). I think those factors, especially the latter one, will make it harder for us to be regularly in and around the play-offs like we were in the mid-to-late 2000s and early 2010s.

[WestYorksRoyal]

I agree that a lot of clubs have developed since the SJM era. More than 20 clubs would view themselves as a PL club and there's not space for them all. It's the same with the Championship; there must be around 50 clubs who "belong" in the top 2 tiers, of which we're one. We're probably towards the bottom of the.

All things being equal and every club living responsibly within their means, we'd be looking at top L1 / lower Championship. But this isn't the case. There are too many badly run clubs. If we turn things around, we'd be joining the likes of Portsmouth, Bolton and Derby in the Championship and moving above a batch of new crisis clubs. Perhaps QPR, Cardiff, Stoke, Bristol City?

As sad as our demise is, it's an opportunity for others - look at Plymouth building something. And if we turn the corner, other clubs will create the opportunity for us. So Championship is achievable, though PL a stretch.

The club we don't want to be is Bradford. Dropped to L1 with financial issues in 2003 and have never made it back, with a lot of that time in L2, where they still get over 15k at home games. They haven't been in crisis for over a decade but have never rebuilt properly.

[YorkshireRoyal99]

I have always viewed us as a Championship club because I haven't really known us be any different. Although understandably some clubs have had stints in League One that I think we are similar in stature to i.e. Cardiff, Bristol City, Swansea, Hull. Some of those clubs have spent (considerably) longer in the PL than ourselves, but in terms of fanbase and infrastructure I think we are about that level in my opinion.

When you look at where 3 of those 4 clubs currently sit, they are in the top half of the Championship and Swansea have been competing in the top half of the Championship for the last couple of seasons as well. That's where I think we "should" be competing really, we should be anywhere between 8th-16th in the Champ personally.

[Stranded]

We are historically a top end L1 club that over the past 25 years has, through careful investment, grown to be a solid Championship side - one capable of competing to get in the top flight.

We are now seeing what happens with poor ownership and we will soon be the latest basketcase to hit L2 or lower.

It shouldn't be the end of the world - many clubs have been here before, many will walk this path in the future. As mentioned, clubs like Brighton, Luton, Portsmouth, Bolton etc.. have sunk lower than we currently are and are rebuilding because their overall infrastructure gives them an advantage over the clubs were L1 or L2 is the natural level.

Of course, the twat has to actually sell the club for us to ever really hit bottom.

[Mr Angry]

Agreed; until Dai goes, we wouldn't have hit rock bottom because with him as owner, no matter how low we go, there is always another step lower down the ladder we can go to..............

[WestYorksRoyal]

Agreed; until Dai goes, we wouldn't have hit rock bottom because with him as owner, no matter how low we go, there is always another step lower down the ladder we can go to..............

Lots of rumours in the past week and Bowen's statement. Hopefully it's close. But there's been whispers without progress for ages now; since Bolton at least.

If no journos are reporting exclusivity or progress by the Wycombe game, I will start thinking that it's simply not going to happen this season. In which case get ready for non-League.

[Royal_jimmy]

Just looking at the L2 table, we would be an absolutely massive club at that level. Only Bradford and Notts Co comparable. If we did get good owners who could run the club competently, promotion would be matter of when, not if.

We would be the biggest club in league two for sure. We've not played at that level in my lifetime, since the 80s. But Bradford haven't got out of that league for a long time so it doesn't guarantee we will bounce back. I still fancy us to like Bolton did as that league standard is appalling.

[Mr Angry]

As Stockport, Notts County and Wrexham are already favourites to go up, we could be left playing Swindon!

[tmesis]

Just looking at the L2 table, we would be an absolutely massive club at that level. Only Bradford and Notts Co comparable. If we did get good owners who could run the club competently, promotion would be matter of when, not if.

We would be the biggest club in league two for sure. We've not played at that level in my lifetime, since the 80s. But Bradford haven't got out of that league for a long time so it doesn't guarantee we will bounce back. I still fancy us to like Bolton did as that league standard is appalling.

The standard in this division is appalling, and it's not helping much.

This team, playing at this level of competence, would not be challenging for promotion in League Two.

[karbota]

We are historically a top end L1 club that over the past 25 years has, through careful investment, grown to be a solid Championship side - one capable of competing to get in the top flight.

We are now seeing what happens with poor unaccountable foreign ownership and poor young unproven foreign players will soon be the latest basketcase to hit L2 or lower.

It shouldn't be the end of the world - many clubs have been here before, many will walk this path in the future. As mentioned, clubs like Brighton, Luton, Portsmouth, Bolton etc.. have sunk lower than we currently are and are rebuilding because their overall infrastructure gives them an advantage over the clubs were L1 or L2 is the natural level.

Of course, the twat has to actually sell the club for us to ever really hit bottom.

CFY, ( but sorry not the grammar!).

[Snowflake Royal]

Just looking at the L2 table, we would be an absolutely massive club at that level. Only Bradford and Notts Co comparable. If we did get good owners who could run the club competently, promotion would be matter of when, not if.

We would be the biggest club in league two for sure. We've not played at that level in my lifetime, since the 80s. But Bradford haven't got out of that league for a long time so it doesn't guarantee we will bounce back. I still fancy us to like Bolton did as that league standard is appalling.

The standard in this division is appalling, and it's not helping much.

This team, playing at this level of competence, would not be challenging for promotion in League Two.

Luckily they won't start a season playing this way.

[Lower West]

As Stockport, Notts County and Wrexham are already favourites to go up, we could be left playing Swindon!

All spent time in the National league.

[Stranded]

As Stockport, Notts County and Wrexham are already favourites to go up, we could be left playing Swindon!

All spent time in the National league.

And lower in Stockport's case.

[karbota]

We are historically a top end L1 club that over the past 25 years has, through careful investment, grown to be a solid Championship side - one capable of competing to get in the top flight.

We are now seeing what happens with poor unaccountable foreign ownership and poor young unproven foreign players will soon be the latest basketcase to hit L2 or lower.

It shouldn't be the end of the world - many clubs have been here before, many will walk this path in the future. As mentioned, clubs like Brighton, Luton, Portsmouth, Bolton etc.. have sunk lower than we currently are and are rebuilding because their overall infrastructure gives them an advantage over the clubs were L1 or L2 is the natural level.

Of course, the twat has to actually sell the club for us to ever really hit bottom.

CFY, ( but sorry not the grammar!).

Where!