Jason Roberts...Do you sometimes find him annoying?!

[melonhead]

Sometimes it's a bit naive to take people's evidence at face value without some self evaluation of it to dig under the agenda it may be being used to support.

Stats can be made to 'prove' almost anything if you pick the right ones.

ive already said, him saying so is enough proof for me, in an internet discussion.
beyond that, look yourself. im already convinced, so i dont need to.


tbf its one small part of 1 point in the list of actions asked for by roberts et al,and my discussion of them, so im not sure its even massively important.
not to me at least.

[melonhead]

I know no-one on this site and simply tell the truth! I like about ten other contributors who say it as it is - and a few others who have hearts in the right place, but no clue! I have never wished to do other than talk about the team that I support, sometimes complimentary, sometimes worried! I never realised there were a set of people who live to hurl abuse across the net against true RFC fans but I have found it out! I would rather support Ideal for attacking difficult issues than one of the serial failures on this site who have nothing to say - whilst attacking those who do eloquently speak!

ive not checked all the stats, but simply by judging from your posts on this thread, you are probably the most abusive poster on here

I have consistently attacked people who were themselves attackers. It is true that I have been less than complimentary to some who have hurled cr*p at decent contributors but not, directly, at me. I would love to see this site as simply RFC fans networking amongst themselves and some sledging can be humorous but, having read many people before I even signed up to the site, I have made my points but been completely happy to defend them with the same amount of abuse that I saw before I even joined. There are quite a few, both knowledgable and eloquent contributors on this site and I have noticed that, all are abused - mostly by people who never post a sensible reply themselves. Why attack the people who bring out valid issues, valid discussions and obviously care for their club? You tell me!

personally i think its fine to laugh ridicule and insult people on the internet, and am happy to give and take in that manner

i do have to say, generally if you say something daft, people will insult you.
if you say something sensible, theyll agree, and discuss things in a sensible way.
and if the majority of people read something you say, and tell you its daft, the probability says its probably a bit daft

[melonhead]

Sometimes it's a bit naive to take people's evidence at face value without some self evaluation of it to dig under the agenda it may be being used to support.

Stats can be made to 'prove' almost anything if you pick the right ones.

to be fair to mr carlisle, he holds quite a high up position in the PFA
has a personal and professional interest in the issue, has celarly had to do alot of research on the issue, recently, and over a long time period,and spoke very well on the issue in a non confrontational way

he seemed quite reticent in coming out and saying the game was racist, did everything he could to avoid saying so, but when asked flat out,"would you say there is institutional racism in football that stops black managers getting jobs"
he said, looking at the evidence as i have, id have to say yes, it does seem that way.

he has also come out publicly to criticise roberts' stance regarding the t shirts and KIO, saying its divisive, and he doesnt agree with what theyve done, so its not like hes blindly agreeing with them cos they are black

like i said, thats enough for me, i need no more convincing about his motivation, and i dont think its naive to believe what he has said.
up to you if you think otherwise, im not on some personal crusade to bring you round to my way of thinking

[melonhead]

thats the truth from your point of view- mainly in my opinion, cos you keep saying daft things, and throwiing insults around yourself

[Extended-Phenotype]

TheSiege, if you didn't come across like a complete w&nker all the time maybe people wouldn't insult you. But all this soap-box moralistic self-important crusading, the constant patting of yourself on the back and broken record ranting just makes you sound like a right bumcake.

Your opinions aren't even controversial or unique. You are just boring people to death with "ALL this I AM ME!!! NOBODY CAN EVER CHANGE THAT!!! IF PEOPLE DON'T LIKE THE THINGS I SAY THEY ARE STUPID!! I SPEAK MY MIND!! IF THAT RUSTLES A FEW FEATHER THEN..." shhh. It doesn't. You are just irritating.

[RobRoyal]

^ Spot on.

[Royal Rother]

Sometimes it's a bit naive to take people's evidence at face value without some self evaluation of it to dig under the agenda it may be being used to support.

Stats can be made to 'prove' almost anything if you pick the right ones.

to be fair to mr carlisle, he holds quite a high up position in the PFA
has a personal and professional interest in the issue, has celarly had to do alot of research on the issue, recently, and over a long time period,and spoke very well on the issue in a non confrontational way

he seemed quite reticent in coming out and saying the game was racist, did everything he could to avoid saying so, but when asked flat out,"would you say there is institutional racism in football that stops black managers getting jobs"
he said, looking at the evidence as i have, id have to say yes, it does seem that way.

he has also come out publicly to criticise roberts' stance regarding the t shirts and KIO, saying its divisive, and he doesnt agree with what theyve done, so its not like hes blindly agreeing with them cos they are black

like i said, thats enough for me, i need no more convincing about his motivation, and i dont think its naive to believe what he has said.
up to you if you think otherwise, im not on some personal crusade to bring you round to my way of thinking

I have the utmost respect for Carlisle. Top man.

[creative_username_1]

I agree with Jason that we should be treating blacks, women, gays, foriegns etc as if they are equal

[Royal Rother]

That's great.

[MouldyRoyal]

I agree with Jason that we should be treating blacks, women, gays, foriegns etc as if they are equal

I nearly bit to this, good fishing.

[sandman]

TheSiege, if you didn't come across like a complete w&nker all the time maybe people wouldn't insult you. But all this soap-box moralistic self-important crusading, the constant patting of yourself on the back and broken record ranting just makes you sound like a right bumcake.

Your opinions aren't even controversial or unique. You are just boring people to death with "ALL this I AM ME!!! NOBODY CAN EVER CHANGE THAT!!! IF PEOPLE DON'T LIKE THE THINGS I SAY THEY ARE STUPID!! I SPEAK MY MIND!! IF THAT RUSTLES A FEW FEATHER THEN..." shhh. It doesn't. You are just irritating.

'greed. The Sieve, as Confucius once said, ''If you ain't got anything intelligent to say then would you please Shut the hell up''.

[The Rouge]

Very eloquent in the press conference - watch it here if fussed - http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/20084848

[Hoop Blah]

Sometimes it's a bit naive to take people's evidence at face value without some self evaluation of it to dig under the agenda it may be being used to support.

Stats can be made to 'prove' almost anything if you pick the right ones.

to be fair to mr carlisle, he holds quite a high up position in the PFA
has a personal and professional interest in the issue, has celarly had to do alot of research on the issue, recently, and over a long time period,and spoke very well on the issue in a non confrontational way

he seemed quite reticent in coming out and saying the game was racist, did everything he could to avoid saying so, but when asked flat out,"would you say there is institutional racism in football that stops black managers getting jobs"
he said, looking at the evidence as i have, id have to say yes, it does seem that way.

he has also come out publicly to criticise roberts' stance regarding the t shirts and KIO, saying its divisive, and he doesnt agree with what theyve done, so its not like hes blindly agreeing with them cos they are black

like i said, thats enough for me, i need no more convincing about his motivation, and i dont think its naive to believe what he has said.
up to you if you think otherwise, im not on some personal crusade to bring you round to my way of thinking

I think Carlisle has been very even handed and a credit to his profession throughout this. That doesn't mean I wouldn't question his 'evidencd' though, especially without having a clue of what that is. I certainly wouldn't be claiming the stats prove it either way if I didn't have a clue whether they did or not, but perhaps that's just my preference for knowing a little about what I say...

The one thing I would criticise Carlisle and the PFA on though is the fact that he, in his role at that PFA, didn't speak to Terry at all during the last year. Perhaps Taylor or someone else had, but I'd have thought Carlisle should've been involved to some extent to try and smooth the waters and look for a less damaging resolution for their members profession.

[Handsome Man]

Very eloquent in the press conference - watch it here if fussed - http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/20084848

Wow.

Very eloquent.

It is just the Terry and Suarez affair isn't it? I don't think you can under-estimate the depth of feeling that it produced. I hadn't realised until I heard the way he talks about the events of "last year".

[The Rouge]

yes, I thought the same as you.

[ZacNaloen]

Yeh a lot of words there said with confidence, but I still haven't heard a valid justification of boycotting Kick it out's week.

In fact with everything he's said, particularly those newspaper columns that came out this week just shows me that his boycott of kick it out wasn't a noble sacrifice. It's petulant friendly fire. He could have sparked the same conversations by airing his opinions via the media exposure football and his radio activities give him.

And I reckon clarke carlisle probably agrees with that.

[Stuboo]

Yeh a lot of words there said with confidence, but I still haven't heard a valid justification of boycotting Kick it out's week.

In fact with everything he's said, particularly those newspaper columns that came out this week just shows me that his boycott of kick it out wasn't a noble sacrifice. It's petulant friendly fire. He could have sparked the same conversations by airing his opinions via the media exposure football and his radio activities give him.

And I reckon clarke carlisle probably agrees with that.

Agrre Zac. At one point Roberts said not wearing the t shirts wasn't a criticism of kick it out then he went on to say they have to do better. Which is it? He is brilliant at giving wooly answers and fobbing peolle off, avoiding criticism which he deserves and staying teflon coated. I like Roberts, but his decision to attack KIO and to not apologise or give a genuine reason forvacting that way has damaged his reputation in my eyes.

[melonhead]

Sometimes it's a bit naive to take people's evidence at face value without some self evaluation of it to dig under the agenda it may be being used to support.

Stats can be made to 'prove' almost anything if you pick the right ones.

to be fair to mr carlisle, he holds quite a high up position in the PFA
has a personal and professional interest in the issue, has celarly had to do alot of research on the issue, recently, and over a long time period,and spoke very well on the issue in a non confrontational way

he seemed quite reticent in coming out and saying the game was racist, did everything he could to avoid saying so, but when asked flat out,"would you say there is institutional racism in football that stops black managers getting jobs"
he said, looking at the evidence as i have, id have to say yes, it does seem that way.

he has also come out publicly to criticise roberts' stance regarding the t shirts and KIO, saying its divisive, and he doesnt agree with what theyve done, so its not like hes blindly agreeing with them cos they are black

like i said, thats enough for me, i need no more convincing about his motivation, and i dont think its naive to believe what he has said.
up to you if you think otherwise, im not on some personal crusade to bring you round to my way of thinking

I have the utmost respect for Carlisle. Top man.

me too

even more so after last night when richard keys gave him a ridiculous grilling on the subject, and ive never heard anyone respond so well- calmly and inteligently- to such a full on, over the top badgering.

[Alexander Litvinenko]

But we live in a soundbite, low-attention span, publicty-driven world, and he's very media-savvy.

A criticism of KIO wouldn't have got any coverage - there's no "angle" for the media to take any interest in it. Instead he's turned this into an issue that's still being discussed.

And, whatever the public side of things, he has completely the right as an individual to decide which organisations he does or doesn't personally endorse.

[melonhead]

Sometimes it's a bit naive to take people's evidence at face value without some self evaluation of it to dig under the agenda it may be being used to support.

Stats can be made to 'prove' almost anything if you pick the right ones.

to be fair to mr carlisle, he holds quite a high up position in the PFA
has a personal and professional interest in the issue, has celarly had to do alot of research on the issue, recently, and over a long time period,and spoke very well on the issue in a non confrontational way

he seemed quite reticent in coming out and saying the game was racist, did everything he could to avoid saying so, but when asked flat out,"would you say there is institutional racism in football that stops black managers getting jobs"
he said, looking at the evidence as i have, id have to say yes, it does seem that way.

he has also come out publicly to criticise roberts' stance regarding the t shirts and KIO, saying its divisive, and he doesnt agree with what theyve done, so its not like hes blindly agreeing with them cos they are black

like i said, thats enough for me, i need no more convincing about his motivation, and i dont think its naive to believe what he has said.
up to you if you think otherwise, im not on some personal crusade to bring you round to my way of thinking

I think Carlisle has been very even handed and a credit to his profession throughout this. That doesn't mean I wouldn't question his 'evidencd' though, especially without having a clue of what that is. I certainly wouldn't be claiming the stats prove it either way if I didn't have a clue whether they did or not, but perhaps that's just my preference for knowing a little about what I say...

The one thing I would criticise Carlisle and the PFA on though is the fact that he, in his role at that PFA, didn't speak to Terry at all during the last year. Perhaps Taylor or someone else had, but I'd have thought Carlisle should've been involved to some extent to try and smooth the waters and look for a less damaging resolution for their members profession.

since it was only one small section, of one of the many points he/they/i was putting, i didnt really think it that important.
if you do, you look it up.

aaaanyway.......



regarding black unions, or black only sections within other unions i note from interviews today, that the police, fire brigade, lawyers/barristers all have them, and they, after much the same consternation initialy, are acknowledged to have been very helpful in bringing about much needed change in those institutions, and resulting in increases in black participation and achievement more closely linked to their % within the population than they were before