Are The Youngsters Being Frozen Out?

[MR. CYNICAL]

Tshibola is injured again!

[maffff]

Missed their last two games and it showed...

[andrew1957]

Just out of interest does anyone know what happened to Lisandro Semedo. He was signed for two seasons until summer 2017 but seems to have disappeared completely - although still listed as an RFC player on transfer market. He is not in our Under 23 squad list and so I wonder if he has left.

[Saaaaaaaammmmmm]

So our youngsters (not including Cooper and Kelly amongst others but featuring many teenagers) just went and turned over a decent full-strength League One outfit on their own turf.

Pretty good result considering many of this side has never played at professional level before, and let's not forget Bristol Rovers are in the same division as MK Dons who our first team scraped past on penalties.

On the matter of the first team, I think Kermorgant's late winner on Saturday kind of glossed over a fairly alarming day for the club. Cardiff was the first match in which we didn't name an Academy graduate in the starting XI for nearly eight years, the last time being in January 2009 when we lost 0-2 to Swansea in which Andersen and Long were only named as substitutes.

It could have been worse had Obita not made it on with 8 minutes to go, but I can't imagine at this rate it will be too long until our run of fielding a graduate in every match since the Coppell era ends...

[Hoop Blah]

Cardiff was the first match in which we didn't name an Academy graduate in the starting XI for nearly eight years, the last time being in January 2009 when we lost 0-2 to Swansea in which Andersen and Long were only named as substitutes.

It could have been worse had Obita not made it on with 8 minutes to go, but I can't imagine at this rate it will be too long until our run of fielding a graduate in every match since the Coppell era ends...

Not sure where that stat comes from, but I don't think it's quite accurate (http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/20190209) but maybe they've tried to claim Federici as an Academy player.

Nonetheless, it's a pretty good achievement for the club that over the last 10 years the Academy have contributed a great deal to our success and it'll only have been rare games where one of McCarthy, Pearce, Karacan, Robson-Kanu, Church, Obita, Hector or Cooper haven't been involved, not to mention some of the others that have played smaller parts.

I don't think the concern is really valid. We're still producing and including players at a pretty decent rate and if they show themselves to be good enough I'm sure Stam, or the next manager, will continue to give them chances.

[sandman]

Heard tonight that a number of the young players are unhappy with Stam and want out as they don't feel they'll be given a chance under his management.

[Z175]

On the matter of the first team, I think Kermorgant's late winner on Saturday kind of glossed over a fairly alarming day for the club. Cardiff was the first match in which we didn't name an Academy graduate in the starting XI for nearly eight years, the last time being in January 2009 when we lost 0-2 to Swansea in which Andersen and Long were only named as substitutes.

It could have been worse had Obita not made it on with 8 minutes to go, but I can't imagine at this rate it will be too long until our run of fielding a graduate in every match since the Coppell era ends...

I think that statistics don't really tell the full story. I think that if Tshibola and HRK were still at the club they would have been involved. It's hardly lack of commitment to the academy that they have followed other graduates in moving on to what they would consider better things.

If anything, the lack of Tshibola, HRK, Pearce, Karacan, Federici (or stretching the point Sigurdsson) from that team v Cardiff is a tribute to how the academy is rather more successful than the club's first team!

The introduction of Obita is testament to the fact that he has been fairly poor since his debut season. Hence he is still with us. I'm confident that Cooper will remain in our squad for years to come!

[sandman]

On the matter of the first team, I think Kermorgant's late winner on Saturday kind of glossed over a fairly alarming day for the club. Cardiff was the first match in which we didn't name an Academy graduate in the starting XI for nearly eight years, the last time being in January 2009 when we lost 0-2 to Swansea in which Andersen and Long were only named as substitutes.

It could have been worse had Obita not made it on with 8 minutes to go, but I can't imagine at this rate it will be too long until our run of fielding a graduate in every match since the Coppell era ends...

I think that statistics don't really tell the full story. I think that if Tshibola and HRK were still at the club they would have been involved. It's hardly lack of commitment to the academy that they have followed other graduates in moving on to what they would consider better things.

If anything, the lack of Tshibola, HRK, Pearce, Karacan, Federici (or stretching the point Sigurdsson) from that team v Cardiff is a tribute to how the academy is rather more successful than the club's first team!

The introduction of Obita is testament to the fact that he has been fairly poor since his debut season. Hence he is still with us. I'm confident that Cooper will remain in our squad for years to come

Not by what those close to him are saying.

[Ian Royal]

It's amazing how you suddenly seem to be getting inside information about the Academy graduates at the point it becomes negative - according to you anyway. To follow up from all the criticism you've given them over the last few years.

[sandman]

It's amazing how you suddenly seem to be getting inside information about the Academy graduates at the point it becomes negative - according to you anyway. To follow up from all the criticism you've given them over the last few years.

I have seen them play many times in recent years, far more than you have, and have considered them to be the highlight of the last few seasons.

No one is more disappointed than me to see them frozen out.

I would PM the details re Cooper to you but as you're a complete arsehole with no redeeming features I don't feel inclined to share them with you. Then again, I'm sure as HNA's resident know it all you will have the info already.

[Nameless]

If you had said Kuhl, or Fosu, or Stacey there might have been some logic.
But Cooper isn't currently playing because he got injured in a match he started, So it would seem odd that in a few days he has decided he 'won't get a chance'. To be honest in the games he has played he has not really impressed, which is the other side of the coin. Players don't get given chances, they take chances. And Cooper has not done much to impress Stam yet.
It wou,d be truly strange, and a real black mark against Cooper if he genuinely wants out. Not to say poor timing given the shutting of the window !
There will always be some unhappy players, most of the academy are not going to make it to the first team and it will be tough for the ones who don't to accept that, Sandman may have some insider knowledge but it seems a. Little unlikely. No doubt we will find out in January, until then players would be well advised to not whinge to strangers but listen to the manager and work to do what is required. Those who don't are likely to find that being an unemployed footballer is not much fun....

[andrew1957]

I have no insider knowledge re Cooper and still think he has been somewhat harshly judged by many on here. But it would not surprise me in the least if he is sent out on loan now. Moore is a far more experienced and better player at the moment and so Moore/McShane will be the first choices unless injured and Gravenberch can cover, plus we have the likes of Jules and Keown (if fit) and so it would help Cooper's development to get some games in.

I think he could be very good, but just needs to gain confidence and to get the odd errors out of his game.

[Nameless]

How would you propose getting Cooper out on loan ?

[Saaaaaaaammmmmm]

To be fair to Cooper, he was given a chance this season, two in fact (more than any other youngster) and he was pretty diabolical in both.

Sending Cooper out on loan to League One might do him good, but I think he's a pretty good enough defender as it is (see much of last season including vs Lukaku), his problem is he looks petrified whenever the ball is at his feet, which is a bit of a problem in the Stam system

There were a few mumblings via friends of Academy players that nobody wanted to sign new deals at Reading this summer, I'm not sure what changed their minds but they all ended up signing once Jaap was appointed

[andrew1957]

How would you propose getting Cooper out on loan ?

Fair point - only just realised (when I checked after your comment) that the emergency loan window was no longer in existence.

In that case he has no choice but to stay and work hard in training until NY.

[Royalwaster]

To be fair to Cooper, he was given a chance this season, two in fact (more than any other youngster) and he was pretty diabolical in both.

Sending Cooper out on loan to League One might do him good, but I think he's a pretty good enough defender as it is (see much of last season including vs Lukaku), his problem is he looks petrified whenever the ball is at his feet, which is a bit of a problem in the Stam system

There were a few mumblings via friends of Academy players that nobody wanted to sign new deals at Reading this summer, I'm not sure what changed their minds but they all ended up signing once Jaap was appointed

Totally agree - you can hardly blame Stam for coming in an sorting out what has been a terribly leaky defence for the last 2 seasons ... he did give Cooper a chance over the summer, but don't think he took it and hence why Stam saw the need to sign Moore. Like everyone else I love seeing our academy graduates play and do well ... but at the same time, like everyone else I'd prefer to see a winning Reading team without graduates, than a losing one full of them as we had with Bodgers.

[Maneki Neko]

Heard tonight that a number of the young players are unhappy with Stam and want out as they don't feel they'll be given a chance under his management.

heard from the voice in your own head?

[Maneki Neko]

On the matter of the first team, I think Kermorgant's late winner on Saturday kind of glossed over a fairly alarming day for the club. Cardiff was the first match in which we didn't name an Academy graduate in the starting XI for nearly eight years, the last time being in January 2009 when we lost 0-2 to Swansea in which Andersen and Long were only named as substitutes.

It could have been worse had Obita not made it on with 8 minutes to go, but I can't imagine at this rate it will be too long until our run of fielding a graduate in every match since the Coppell era ends...

I think that statistics don't really tell the full story. I think that if Tshibola and HRK were still at the club they would have been involved. It's hardly lack of commitment to the academy that they have followed other graduates in moving on to what they would consider better things.

If anything, the lack of Tshibola, HRK, Pearce, Karacan, Federici (or stretching the point Sigurdsson) from that team v Cardiff is a tribute to how the academy is rather more successful than the club's first team!

The introduction of Obita is testament to the fact that he has been fairly poor since his debut season. Hence he is still with us. I'm confident that Cooper will remain in our squad for years to come

Not by what those close to him are saying.

ITK!!!!!!!!!1!!!1111!!!

[Maneki Neko]

It's amazing how you suddenly seem to be getting inside information about the Academy graduates at the point it becomes negative - according to you anyway. To follow up from all the criticism you've given them over the last few years.

I have seen them play many times in recent years, far more than you have, and have considered them to be the highlight of the last few seasons.

No one is more disappointed than me to see them frozen out.

I would PM the details re Cooper to you but as you're a complete arsehole with no redeeming features I don't feel inclined to share them with you. Then again, I'm sure as HNA's resident know it all you will have the info already.

says the bloke calling people assholes, and appearing to be the resident know it all

[Maneki Neko]

I have no insider knowledge re Cooper and still think he has been somewhat harshly judged by many on here. But it would not surprise me in the least if he is sent out on loan now. Moore is a far more experienced and better player at the moment and so Moore/McShane will be the first choices unless injured and Gravenberch can cover, plus we have the likes of Jules and Keown (if fit) and so it would help Cooper's development to get some games in.

I think he could be very good, but just needs to gain confidence and to get the odd errors out of his game.

agreed- cooper has it in him to be a very good CB at this level.
he may even have it in him to be a very good ball playing CB.
currently though he gifts the opposition (at least)one gilt edged chance in every single game he plays.

hes young, and hopefully the concentration/focus/consitency/decision making will come, (we couldn't get a better person to coach him than stam tbf) but it wouldn't surprise me if he was unhappy after going from playing every game last year, to not getting much of a look in this year, and it wouldn't surprise me if stam thinks hes too risky to play in many games, cos he pretty much is right now