Fielding "weakened" teams in the FA Cup

[Ian Royal]

[Dirk Gently]

It's all about what the club want from the game.

A lower league team may well want the cup run to generate some income
A team not competing for promotion/title may well want a cup run to generate some interest
Some teams may want to blood youngsters/reserves

What's the problem ?

Fair enough - but some of those things are incompatible with expecting supporters to pay out good money to support a team chosen with those aims in mind.

Do you know what the selection policy is going to be for the cup games ? - YES
Do you still buy a ticket ? - NO

It's entirely your choice so you can hardly complain. - AGREED, BUT THE AIMS OF THE SELECTION THAT I'D LIKE TO SEE MY TEAM PLAYING ARE QUITE DIFFERENT FROM THE ACTUAL ONES. I'M SURE I'M NOT ALONE IN WISHING THAT WINNING EVERY CUP GAME, AND GETTING AS FAR AS POSSIBLE IN THE COMPETITION, WAS AN IMPORTANT AIM TO THE CLUB

If there was little warning of the impending team changes, I'd agree that the supporters deserve more, but at least the club are up front about what they are about to do.

[Franchise FC]

:lol:

Is this a random chuckle ? or is it aimed at a particular comment ?

[Hoop Blah]

Just because the romancing is slowly being killed off doesn't make it right and doesn't mean we, or some two-bit journo, shouldn't voice an opinion on it being wrong. It cetainly doesn't mean that what we're doing is not fielding a weakened side which amazingly seems to be some people's point of view on here.

As for the cost etc for watching the cup team, I agree with you Franchise that we know what we're going to get. Oddly, I guess considering my stance on this, I'm one who loves to see the youngsters get a chance in the first team and I quite enjoy the cup games because of it.

I would still rather we treated the cups, and especially the FA Cup, with the respect they deserve and field pretty much our strongest team available give ourselves the best chance of progressing.

[Sun Tzu]

Don't you think the manager also has a wider responsibility to acheive the best results in all competitions ?

If Coppell believes that the way to do this is select different sides then that is surely proper management ?

To state that in every game the manager must select a team based on a rigid rule seems to remove the point of management.

Coppell has used the cup to move the club forward with no noticeable negative effect on the results. If he'd been picking the youth side and losing every game against lower opposition there may be an argument but anyone watching almost any of our cup games will have seen a team playing decent football, giving 100%, staging fight backs, scoring goals and pushing teams of much higher ability very close on a regular basis. Based simply on the way the team has conducted itself on the pitch how have we 'devalued' the competition ?

[Ian Royal]

:lol:

Is this a random chuckle ? or is it aimed at a particular comment ?

Specifically aimed at yours just over the page.

[Franchise FC]

:lol:

Is this a random chuckle ? or is it aimed at a particular comment ?

Specifically aimed at yours just over the page.

Pleased it made you smile.

Have fun in Welsh Wales tomorrow - I'll be helping with the homework that's been left till the last minute - AGAIN.

[Ian Royal]

Don't you think the manager also has a wider responsibility to acheive the best results in all competitions ?

If Coppell believes that the way to do this is select different sides then that is surely proper management ?

To state that in every game the manager must select a team based on a rigid rule seems to remove the point of management.

Coppell has used the cup to move the club forward with no noticeable negative effect on the results. If he'd been picking the youth side and losing every game against lower opposition there may be an argument but anyone watching almost any of our cup games will have seen a team playing decent football, giving 100%, staging fight backs, scoring goals and pushing teams of much higher ability very close on a regular basis. Based simply on the way the team has conducted itself on the pitch how have we 'devalued' the competition ?

We haven't. As I'm sure you will agree with me.

In fact we've actually produced some fantastic matches in the cup and had a player named as player of the round in the FA Cup. But lets ignore that all shall we.

Franchise - I shall be trying out my new Reading World subscription which has been given to me for Xmas. Exciting stuff!

[Baines]

Based simply on the way the team has conducted itself on the pitch how have we 'devalued' the competition ?

By not picking the best team, because we wanted to rest our better players, or prevent suspension of those players, so that they could play in a more important competition for us and/or so that we can try out other players so that Coppell can work out how they would perform/how best to play them in a competition more important to us.

It really needn't be any more complicated than that.

[Hoop Blah]

Don't you think the manager also has a wider responsibility to acheive the best results in all competitions ?

If Coppell believes that the way to do this is select different sides then that is surely proper management ?

To state that in every game the manager must select a team based on a rigid rule seems to remove the point of management.

I agree the manager does have to use the games available to him to keep his squad happy and sharp to ensure he has enough motivated resources at his disposal.

As I think I said earlier though, I think I'd question the mentallity and team ethic of my squad players if they need the odd run out in 'a meaningless cup game' to keep them pulling in the right direction for the good of the club.

Secondly, if these players are good enough to step into the team for either a cup game or to cover for an injured or out of form team mate then they're good enough to be tested/kept fresh/sharp/involved etc by using them in a league game. To be fair to Coppell he's done this to a certain extent with the central midfielders this season, although as argued ealier only at the detriment of performances and possibly results.

It's the wholesale switching of players and purely for the cup games that devalues the competition.

Coppell has used the cup to move the club forward with no noticeable negative effect on the results. If he'd been picking the youth side and losing every game against lower opposition there may be an argument but anyone watching almost any of our cup games will have seen a team playing decent football, giving 100%, staging fight backs, scoring goals and pushing teams of much higher ability very close on a regular basis. Based simply on the way the team has conducted itself on the pitch how have we 'devalued' the competition ?

This goes back to the senseless arguement with IR earlier about losing to the top 4 sides. How do we know that we've not seen a noticable effect on results in the cup by playing the cup side. Those games we've lost against the top 4 might've been our chances of a cup upset like it was for Burnley, Southend, Cov and Barnsley in the last few seasons.

I'd also argue that chopping and changing the team for the cup games may have resulted in moments of confusion during league games because players had changed positions or partnerships etc, but that's another arguement that can't be proven one way or another. Winning is a habit though and perhaps last season when the league side was struggling so badly a cup game for those same players might've kicked started an upturn in form.

If's, buts, and maybe's....

[Ian Royal]

Based simply on the way the team has conducted itself on the pitch how have we 'devalued' the competition ?

By not picking the best team, because we wanted to rest our better players, or prevent suspension of those players, so that they could play in a more important competition for us and/or so that we can try out other players so that Coppell can work out how they would perform/how best to play them in a competition more important to us.

It really needn't be any more complicated than that.

I find you a very strange person with some strange views Baines.

[Franchise FC]

Franchise - I shall be trying out my new Reading World subscription which has been given to me for Xmas. Exciting stuff!

I'll be stuck with Soccer Saturday, with Jeff (bl00dy) Stelling and his 'There's been a goal at ......' nonsense. (I actually think he's a fantastic presenter, but that statement always makes me nervous).

None worse than the one on Boxing Day - 'There's been a goal at the Madjeski' .... don't bl00dy well keep me in suspenders, who by ? Except that on that occassion is was Cardiff so I didn't want to know anyway.

I'm never sure whether looking at the scores coming through is better or worse than waiting to find out the result.

p.s. Paul Merson is without doubt the worst pundit in the world.

[Ian Royal]

Don't you think the manager also has a wider responsibility to acheive the best results in all competitions ?

If Coppell believes that the way to do this is select different sides then that is surely proper management ?

To state that in every game the manager must select a team based on a rigid rule seems to remove the point of management.

I agree the manager does have to use the games available to him to keep his squad happy and sharp to ensure he has enough motivated resources at his disposal.

As I think I said earlier though, I think I'd question the mentallity and team ethic of my squad players if they need the odd run out in 'a meaningless cup game' to keep them pulling in the right direction for the good of the club.

Secondly, if these players are good enough to step into the team for either a cup game or to cover for an injured or out of form team mate then they're good enough to be tested/kept fresh/sharp/involved etc by using them in a league game. To be fair to Coppell he's done this to a certain extent with the central midfielders this season, although as argued ealier only at the detriment of performances and possibly results.

It's the wholesale switching of players and purely for the cup games that devalues the competition.

Coppell has used the cup to move the club forward with no noticeable negative effect on the results. If he'd been picking the youth side and losing every game against lower opposition there may be an argument but anyone watching almost any of our cup games will have seen a team playing decent football, giving 100%, staging fight backs, scoring goals and pushing teams of much higher ability very close on a regular basis. Based simply on the way the team has conducted itself on the pitch how have we 'devalued' the competition ?

This goes back to the senseless arguement with IR earlier about losing to the top 4 sides. How do we know that we've not seen a noticable effect on results in the cup by playing the cup side. Those games we've lost against the top 4 might've been our chances of a cup upset like it was for Burnley, Southend, Cov and Barnsley in the last few seasons.

I'd also argue that chopping and changing the team for the cup games may have resulted in moments of confusion during league games because players had changed positions or partnerships etc, but that's another arguement that can't be proven one way or another. Winning is a habit though and perhaps last season when the league side was struggling so badly a cup game for those same players might've kicked started an upturn in form.

If's, buts, and maybe's....

The main problem with that, is that as far as I can tell (and this certainly applies to me) no one arguing we aren't devaluing the cup considers cup games meaningless.

That's something that people on your side of the arguing are attributing to us.

[Hoop Blah]

In fact we've actually produced some fantastic matches in the cup and had a player named as player of the round in the FA Cup. But lets ignore that all shall we.

I'm not sure that Federici picking up player of the round is anything to be overly proud of really. It only happened because we were playing Utd and it was on Telly and, possibly, he was exposed because of the mix matched team infront of him giving him a bit too much to do...

[Jimbo]

For everyone who thinks we shouldn't put out a 'changed' team, you'd all be happy if Doyle played on Saturday?

[Franchise FC]

In fact we've actually produced some fantastic matches in the cup and had a player named as player of the round in the FA Cup. But lets ignore that all shall we.

I'm not sure that Federici picking up player of the round is anything to be overly proud of really. It only happened because we were playing Utd and it was on Telly and, possibly, he was exposed because of the mix matched team infront of him giving him a bit too much to do...

But, the reward for playing him in those games when he wouldn't have played at all otherwise, is that he's been ready for action in the last few weeks. And his goalscoring ability has certainly improved.

[Franchise FC]

For everyone who thinks we shouldn't put out a 'changed' team, you'd all be happy if Doyle played on Saturday?

Definitely not. Don't want him cup-tied - it'll bring the price down !!

[Baines]

For everyone who thinks we shouldn't put out a 'changed' team, you'd all be happy if Doyle played on Saturday?

Of course.

[Hoop Blah]

The main problem with that, is that as far as I can tell (and this certainly applies to me) no one arguing we aren't devaluing the cup considers cup games meaningless.

That's something that people on your side of the arguing are attributing to us.

OK, ignore that bit as it was only in there to emphasis the way the club is treating the games and not as a direct quote of anyone posting on here. How does that present a 'main problem' with the rest of my views though?

From my point of view the rest of the post stands as we're treating the games as less important by fielding weaker teams and I've answered the original points raised byt Sun Tzu with how I think the manager should address them.

[Ian Royal]

For everyone who thinks we shouldn't put out a 'changed' team, you'd all be happy if Doyle played on Saturday?

Of course.

That was such a dumb question. Who would be unhappy that our top scorer was playing.

Personally I think a rest may do him some good and the game is ideal for getting some low risk but good experience for Long, Mooney and or Church and if Lita has the right attitude reintegrating him back into the squad.