Are The Youngsters Being Frozen Out?

[Saaaaaaaammmmmm]

So the news of Tanner heading out on loan again today really frustrated me, all this talk of bringing through our own homegrown players and I feel they're once again being frozen out.

I'm thinking back to last pre-season when Fosu was the standout player both in Thailand and back at home, yet since playing 45 minutes against Espanyol over a year ago he hasn't even made the first team bench. Liam Kelly was the player we were all getting excited about this time round after impressing in friendlies and all of a sudden he's now probably 7th choice midfielder (I'm thinking he's behind Swift, Williams, Evans, Quinn, Van Den Berg, and now Wieser) and he's not even played a minute this season.

Tanner definitely changed the game when he came on against Bournemouth, didn't get a chance in the cup, not featured even on the bench in the league and all of a sudden he hasn't progressed beyond where he was last season, on loan in the bottom tier.

Players like Tshibola and Obita (or going as far back to the likes of Sigurdsson, Karacan, Pearce, McCarthy and Robson-Kanu), who have been Academy success stories, have had success because they were given the chance to play Championship football. Would Tshibola have been sold for £5.5 Million if he had spent last season back out on loan at Hartlepool before he was given a chance to impress? Look at Marcus Rashford, he scored goals because he was given a chance, people are very quick to forget that after his Premier League debut against Arsenal he went five games without a goal of which Utd just won one, yet Van Gaal stuck with him and he grabbed the winner against City and a few weeks later was playing at the Euros. When was the last time we bought a teenager in to start 5 straight matches?

I wonder how people like Josh Barrett are feeling, breaking into the first team (in the matchday squad for the last 5 games of last season) and now suddenly nowhere near. Same applies to Rob Dickie, debuting on the final day and now watching on as a makeshift centre-half fumbles around in his position conceding 6 goals in 2 games. As for Aaron Kuhl, Jack Stacey, Niall Keown, Andrija Novakovich, these players were making their debuts in early 2014/15, two years later and they've gone effectively backwards and barely get a mention these days as potential first teamers.

After all the celebration against Preston around Eamonn Dolan's legacy, it seemed a shame that we only ever had one of his players on the pitch. In fact with Pierce Sweeney and Jake Taylor starting for Exeter on opening day there were more Reading Academy graduates playing for Exeter City than Reading during the season openers.

I get that we have to accept Stam sees them in training and makes a decision, but given we take so much pride in our Academy, I'm worried that it'll become irrelevant if there's no pathway from U23 to First Team. Players will not develop to their full potential if they are not given the chance to reach it by playing for Reading. Our youngsters will improve if we give them a chance to realise they can perform at Championship level, not if they watch on from the sidelines as players like Williams, Gunter, Kermorgant and the outgoing Cox, Robson-Kanu and Loan Players continue to under-perform but feature week-in week-out because they have 'experience'. I'd say it's more like experience of consistently losing over the last three years (Kermorgant could be excused but is he adding anything to a team that pre-injury Samuel wouldn't have?).

I was hopeful when Stam and Tevreden spoke about their determination to keep up the Cat 1 Academy and bring through our own players, but I'd rather see them deliver on the pitch, and the first few matchday squads have done nothing to excite me. I'm not sure if anyone else shares my frustrations?

[Ian Royal]

It's a fair point that all the talk from the club of relying on the academy products appears to have been nothing but PR as we sell one, loan another and ignore most the rest in favour of signing endless numbers of midfielders or wingers. At least Watson is continuing to be included in the squad, although I can't help but wonder if that's simply through zero alternatives.

[9165]

I was thinking the same thoughts recently, especially with the news we have signed yet another (foreign) midfielder. The last 2 results could maybe persuade Stam that his buys may not be as good as he thought and he may turn to the likes of Cooper, Samuel when not injured and maybe others but it is starting to feel like he has little faith in the youth. We will see.

[Royal Rother]

Yep.

Looks like Stam and Tevreden were speaking bollocks.

Oh well, I suppose Ledge will get some good expenses out of it.

[Lower West]

Youngsters were given a fair run out in preseason. Majority need more experience in lower leagues before being thrown into Championship football. The step up is simply too big.

[Saaaaaaaammmmmm]

It's a fair point that all the talk from the club of relying on the academy products appears to have been nothing but PR as we sell one, loan another and ignore most the rest in favour of signing endless numbers of midfielders or wingers. At least Watson is continuing to be included in the squad, although I can't help but wonder if that's simply through zero alternatives.

See Watson is the one shining example and that's simply because he has been given a chance which only emphasises my point.

He was nowhere near the first team picture (even Long was ahead of him for the U21s) up until he was included on the bench against Leeds, however we persisted with McCleary at right-back and lost both matches conceding 5 goals before Gunter returned to the squad. Having seen him in pre-season and playing so impressively against Preston and Plymouth what were we gaining from leaving him out of the picture until now?

And despite his brilliant performances, Gunter and Obita (consistent starters throughout three dire seasons) slotted straight back into their usual full-back positions and we let in 6 goals inside a week. It's worrying

[CountryRoyal]

Add to that all of the talk of "wanting to bring in experienced championship players".

Swift is the only one that remotely fits that criteria and he only had one season at Brentford.

EDIT: Harriot has had 3 and half championship seasons but from the age of 18 or so. Still not exactly what you'd call experienced.

[Stranded]

I would say the plan is to try and get ourselves in a decent position after 10-15 games and then start blooding the right youngsters.

Either that or the faith isn't there in the crop ready to be blooded now.

[AthleticoSpizz]

I would say that Jaap is an inexperienced manager with a treasure trove......and of course a budget to work to, that puts him in a situation that is is something that is akin to a kid in a sweet shop.

Give the guy time ffs......shouldn't have sacked some of his predecessors.......but

[PistolPete]

I'm annoyed too.

I honestly don't understand football sometimes. 98% of fans realise we need a centre back, a striker and full back cover or first team challengers. They realise that Fosu, Kelly and Samuel (amongst others) are ready to be given a fair chance.

They think £500k is too club for Kermogant, that a 6th midfielder is overkill, that ...

It's just so frustrating!!

[CountryRoyal]

I would say the plan is to try and get ourselves in a decent position after 10-15 games and then start blooding the right youngsters.

Either that or the faith isn't there in the crop ready to be blooded now.

Not going so well then is it.

[Royal Rother]

2 tough away games.

[Saaaaaaaammmmmm]

If we were giving youngsters a go and were struggling I imagine the fans would be significantly more patient. It's no surprise fans are quick to air their frustration when we lose games, change nothing, then continue to lose more games.

I'm not an expert, but I imagine our youngsters are more than capable enough footballers to compete at Championship level if given the right gameplan and tactics etc. You'd likely get more mistakes that are usually ironed out upon further experience but they're hardly going to look completely out of their depth, and if they do at the age of 20/21 I wouldn't hold much hope for them going forward and would question why we're offering them contracts in the first place. Shane Griffin turns 22 in a couple of weeks, what is he still doing at the club if we'd rather play left midfielders like Quinn and right backs like Gunter in his place?

A couple of examples of our youngsters competing, have a look at the starting line-ups and subs...

Going to Middlesborough in 2014 who went on to finish 4th and winning 0-1: http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/28906308
Inexperienced Youngsters Starting - Hector, Obita, Edwards, Kuhl, Taylor
Coming On As Subs - Tanner, Cooper
Unused Squad Members - Andersen, Long, Stacey, Fosu

Going to League One Scunthorpe in 2014 and winning 0-1: http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/28847218
Inexperienced Youngsters Starting - Cooper, Kuhl, Tanner
Coming On As Subs - Long, Edwards, Taylor
Unused Squad Members - Griffin, Stacey, Fosu

Both those matches were two years ago, if those players mentioned aren't ready for League football two years after going away and turning decent sides over then our coaching staff are failing them somewhere

[bobby1413]

Same thoughts here.

I keep hearing about our "amazzzzing academy", including tweets from other clubs and pundits commenting "Wow, Reading's academy really is very good". The evidence is clear, with some competition wins, and some good results.

I wonder if the younger players are thinking "FFS RFC, you're taking the piss now, I'm off to another club unless things change". I wouldn't be surprised.

[Stranded]

I would say the plan is to try and get ourselves in a decent position after 10-15 games and then start blooding the right youngsters.

Either that or the faith isn't there in the crop ready to be blooded now.

Not going so well then is it.

I would have taken being on 3 points at this stage given the fixture list.

[Sutekh]

Sort of half agree and half don't. We were told earlier this month that the youngsters without squad numbers, Keown, Tanner, Fosu, Kuhl and Stacey, Jaap was undecided over whether they should be part of the regular first team squad or put out on loan where they would be much more likely to get the regular football they really need at this stage of their careers. Therefore I'm not worried when one - probably all eventually - get farmed out.

Barrett, Dickie, Watson and Kelly are the nearest to the first squad currently and Kelly and Watson have regularly been making the bench. I would have thought that having 4 academy players close to action is reasonable but would agree that I would expect to see a couple at least getting some time regularly on the pitch, even if it's only from the subs bench which does fly in the face of what the club has been saying since before the end of last season.

Perhaps the MK Dons game will see a bit more positive activity on that front.

[Zammo]

Fosu vs Derby away a couple of seasons ago was like and then nothing. Clearly the boy can play....we've all seen it. So why the permanent exclusion?

[One8Seven1*]

If they were deemed ready for this level, they'd be involved. Stam wouldn't be bringing in punts unless he felt we needed new blood. Also it's worth bearing in mind that whilst publically Stam has played down our chances of being top six this season, and in the process reducing the pressure on him and his players, I'm sure it's still something he's striving for.

Kelly and Watson really impressed in the summer and are in and around the first team. Watson seems to be Gunter's competition this season, while we look for another left-back to push Obita and another centre-back.

Watching Tanner drop the L2 was disappointing for me. I would have though his development would have been better served with a L1 loan this season.

I just hope we see Fosu stay around and not get loaned out again. We don't need another winger when we have a talent like him desperate for a chance. Perhaps it's his attitude or application in training that's holding him back?

[floyd__streete]

It is disappointing to say the very least that they are signing people from the Dutch and French second division when they could/should be giving our home grown and much heralded young players a go. Transfer policy seems ad hoc, not really sure there is much of a plan in place tbh.

[bcubed]

I suspect we will only give our youngsters a go when there is no other option
Its the British way