Fans' Forum

[Simon's Church]

This has been an unmitigated disaster from start to finish. Good to see Green, Slammed and RL taking the fight to STAR's doorstep

[Royal Lady]

This has been an unmitigated disaster from start to finish. Good to see Green, Slammed and RL taking the fight to STAR's doorstep

I have.

[Simon's Church]

Exactly.

[Royal Lady]

Oh sorry - I thought you were telling us to take our argument there.

[Zaretsky]

You're a fool if you think the majority of contributors to this thread have any interest in being reasonable about this. Leave it alone and it'll go away eventually.

Surely this is as a good a time as any to have a discussion about how fans are collectively represented (or not) to the club - especially with the club coming under new ownership? English football has been hopelessly lacking in 'fan power' and with the apparent intent to expand the supporter base of RFC, this is an opportune moment to ask questions about what this means for the accountability and transparency of the new ownership. Arguably, the close association of STAR to the club limits the its ability to represent fans on more controversial issues and with the kind of depth that some ask for. Yes, this association brings some benefit but while fans' forums are all well and good, let's not confuse 'talking about transfer gossip' with democratic accountability. I'd like to see an organisation with a bit more bite to it (even if that means sacrificing the kind of special, 'official' relationship that STAR has).

[Royal Lady]

Exactly Zaretsky - well put.

[southbank1871]

Well I for one will not be renewing...I wouldn't normally discuss the content of a PM, but I've had no response to my reply since I sent it 3 days ago, and need to vent spleen...

I had a PM on Friday from STAR, effectively telling me that the situation was my fault, apparently I should have known about the history of these events without needing to be told. It was also made clear that the club and Brian personally are "very upset" - again, the implication being that my actions, and my actions alone have upset them, and STAR now have a lot to do to repair the relationship.

Finally I was told that STAR have nothing against me "because you have shown remorse" - again the implication is that all this is my fault.

What I object to is the fact that STAR seem to want to lay all responsibility at my door for this, and take no responsibility whatsoever themselves. As I've said repeatedly, if we'd been told the forum was "between these four walls" I'd have honoured that...

I don't believe for a minute that Brian is genuinely "very upset" - I'm sure he has far more important things to worry about, but I'll be meeting him in a couple of weeks, so I'll ask and apologise if necessary - let's hope STAR are telling the truth or they'll look very silly...

Oh my days.

[Nick Shorey my Lord!]

Well I for one will not be renewing...I wouldn't normally discuss the content of a PM, but I've had no response to my reply since I sent it 3 days ago, and need to vent spleen...

I had a PM on Friday from STAR, effectively telling me that the situation was my fault, apparently I should have known about the history of these events without needing to be told. It was also made clear that the club and Brian personally are "very upset" - again, the implication being that my actions, and my actions alone have upset them, and STAR now have a lot to do to repair the relationship.

Finally I was told that STAR have nothing against me "because you have shown remorse" - again the implication is that all this is my fault.

What I object to is the fact that STAR seem to want to lay all responsibility at my door for this, and take no responsibility whatsoever themselves. As I've said repeatedly, if we'd been told the forum was "between these four walls" I'd have honoured that...

I don't believe for a minute that Brian is genuinely "very upset" - I'm sure he has far more important things to worry about, but I'll be meeting him in a couple of weeks, so I'll ask and apologise if necessary - let's hope STAR are telling the truth or they'll look very silly...

If this is true then just a gigantic



at STAR.

[Fox Talbot]

Exactly Zaretsky - well put.

In order to have more bite we'll need bigger teeth. Especially now RFC is in the PL and needing to pay less attention to fans.

Where will we get these teeth? What will they consist of? What would make RFC listen to us and bend to our whims?

Tricky one, given the club's current success.

[pea]

Exactly Zaretsky - well put.

In order to have more bite we'll need bigger teeth. Especially now RFC is in the PL and needing to pay less attention to fans.

Where will we get these teeth? What will they consist of? What would make RFC listen to us and bend to our whims?

Tricky one, given the club's current success.

Bill Oddie as spokesman?

[Zaretsky]

Exactly Zaretsky - well put.

In order to have more bite we'll need bigger teeth. Especially now RFC is in the PL and needing to pay less attention to fans.

Where will we get these teeth? What will they consist of? What would make RFC listen to us and bend to our whims?

Tricky one, given the club's current success.

True. And TBH, to start with, just a bit more bark would nice! The teeth would take time. You'd need 2 sides to it - a kind of practical service, arguing the case for fans with particular concerns/issues e.g. legal advice, lodging complaints. Then the other side as more of a campaigning set of activities on key issues, including club transparency and where consensus can be reached. This will then offer space for collaboration with other supporters' organisations (from other clubs). Where it can't be reached, you open spaces for discussion and debate. It can be radical without being unreasonable. And you always leave a space at the table of debate for club but you don't let it be the only one that sets the agenda. And you make sure you have a democratic and open constitution.

The bite ultimately comes from proving your worth and your independence. Even if you can't move mountains, having a dissenting voice is worthy in itself.

[Ian Herring]

It seems there are 2 conversations running here, firstly aorund what happened with OP, and what is STAR's actual role (I have read their documentation, and to be fair, am not sure their actions echo their publicised remit).

In order to clear this all up may I suggest a "STAR forum" along the same lines of the fans forum, whereby STAR Board members can answer questions from existing STAR members, as well as those who wish to understand the workings of the organisation fully (be that as prospective members or merely RFC fans, who may or may not want to be members, but have questions)?

It would be far easier to set up than a "Fans Forum" for STAR as they will not have to invite any Reading FC players or management, just be there themselves (obviously we know they are busy people, but I'm sure there must be scheduled meetings for the STAR team, surely one of them could be re-arranged to accompdate this), and open the invitation out to all (obviously numbers permitting etc..)

The rules and regulations as to what can, or can't, be reported subsequently can be distributed beforehand (online or otherwise), we all then can will have the opportunity to understand the workings of the organisation and get answers to the questions posted on here and elsewhere.

I feel this is would be far better way to handle the (mis)understanding of STAR's role than on this forum, or by dropping into the STAR portakabin on a one on one basis, as at least we can then all have the opportunity to discuss at once (subject to the aforementioned regulations obviously).

Just a thought . . . . over to you STAR . . . .

I'm hoping that such a forum will take place in the Star Chamber.

[westendgirl]

Exactly Zaretsky - well put.

In order to have more bite we'll need bigger teeth. Especially now RFC is in the PL and needing to pay less attention to fans.

Where will we get these teeth? What will they consist of? What would make RFC listen to us and bend to our whims?

Tricky one, given the club's current success.

True. And TBH, to start with, just a bit more bark would nice! The teeth would take time. You'd need 2 sides to it - a kind of practical service, arguing the case for fans with particular concerns/issues e.g. legal advice, lodging complaints. Then the other side as more of a campaigning set of activities on key issues, including club transparency and where consensus can be reached. This will then offer space for collaboration with other supporters' organisations (from other clubs). Where it can't be reached, you open spaces for discussion and debate. It can be radical without being unreasonable. And you always leave a space at the table of debate for club but you don't let it be the only one that sets the agenda. And you make sure you have a democratic and open constitution.

The bite ultimately comes from proving your worth and your independence. Even if you can't move mountains, having a dissenting voice is worthy in itself.

Having been involved in STAR I would agree with you wholeheartedly. The trouble is that although there is a lot of noise on here, the number of concerns actually brought to STAR were very few. My experience was that people were happy to sound off on here but that was the extent of the effort they were willing to make.

STAR does have collaboration with other supporters organisations and although many on here would find it hard to understand, STAR is seen by Supporters Direct as a very good example of how a supporters trust at a club without a crisis should be, and think that the relationship with the club is also a good example. The club will not make a fuss of the times that STAR has changed their plans, but there have been numerous occasions when the supporters point of view has been factored in because of STAR's input. Having said that there is no one supporters point of view, after all how many times is there unanimity on here?

I would agree that communication should be better, but that is true for so many other organisations that it should be no surprise and should be the highest priority.

[moo]

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etc[/quote]
3, 2 , 4 ,1 IMO

[Bandini]

starliason just logged on and off again

Maybe STAR will work now

Very good.

[SLAMMED]

3
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etc

3, 2 , 4 ,1 IMO[/quote]

At least they have an equal gender ratio.

[Maguire]

What's even worse, they have an equal gender ratio.

[blindedbythelights]

ease off the comments on the STAR members, it'll only give them an excuse to delete the thread and brush all this under the carpet

[RoyalBlue]

I haven't checked their website for a while - I might go and have a nosey to see who holds what position these days - it's almost always the same people every year - I'm surprised there are no younger fans offering their services to be a board member.

Here you go


Gerry McGreevy - Treasurer

Isn't it funny how people tend to turn from rebels into respectable pillars of society (or at least pillars of STAR) as they grow older.

I can remember the days when Gerry McGreevy used to be one of 'the lads'. I can also remember a song dedicated to him at that time. To the tune of Moon River (IIRC)I believe one section went along the lines of 'You smell of rat stew that your mum fed to you'!

[blindedbythelights]

Just noticed STAR blocked me on twitter a while back when all I did was ask for a RT

do they realise when you block someone on twitter all it does is stop you seeing what people are saying about you