WC 2014 - Bits and Bobs

[Ouroboros]

NZ could qualify in Asia instead?

Except then they'd be destroyed by Japan and Australia.

[Flyingkiwi]

NZ could qualify in Asia instead?

Except then they'd be destroyed by Japan and Australia.

Except that the regularly DIDN'T get "destroyed" when playing Australia in the Oceania Confederation (From which Aussie jumped because of the fact that there was no automatic qualification spot) and Asia has 4 spots (This time, filled by Aussie, Japan, Korea and Iran).

[stealthpapes]

No they moved to the Asian confederation a few years back for greater competition, so are now Asian in a footballing sense.

Yes, so if we are not basing it on geography and instead on qualifying region then Oz have played Japan at the WC so that would be Asia Vs Asia

Cool.

But only when they were in Oceania?

[Ouroboros]

NZ could qualify in Asia instead?

Except then they'd be destroyed by Japan and Australia.

Except that the regularly DIDN'T get "destroyed" when playing Australia in the Oceania Confederation (From which Aussie jumped because of the fact that there was no automatic qualification spot) and Asia has 4 spots (This time, filled by Aussie, Japan, Korea and Iran).

And how many times did NZ qualify while Aus were in the OFC zone?

The bottom line they can join a region with automatic spots, but NZ aren't good enough to qualify past the Asian teams. There is no arguing that you deserve an automatic place for managing to beat footballing behemoths New Calendonia and Fiji.

[exileinleeds]

[Flyingkiwi]

And how many times did NZ qualify while Aus were in the OFC zone?

Once.

How many times did Australia??

Oh! And Europe has footballing giants from the Faroe Islands, San Marino and Luxembourg.

[Ouroboros]

Indeed, so NZ were consistently worse than a team that consistently lost in the intercontinental play-off.

Still not seeing how this means New Zealand, sorry, OFC deserve an automatic place.

[Flyingkiwi]

Indeed, so NZ were consistently worse than a team that consistently lost in the intercontinental play-off.

Still not seeing how this means New Zealand, sorry, OFC deserve an automatic place.

Where do you get "consistently worse" from? If NZ topped the OFC and lost in the play-off, that would indicate that they were consistently better, would it not? Consistently better than a team that, since moving to a confederation with automatic qualification, has been at every world cup!

[Ouroboros]

I don't think I'm following you.

Last time Australia qualified through the OFC was 2006. They qualified above NZ, who managed to finish behind Solomon Islands.

2002 final qualifying round: Aus 6-1 NZ (2 legs)

1998 final qualifying round: Aus 5-0 NZ (2 legs)

1994 final qualifying round: Aus 4-0 NZ (2 legs)

Therefore I'm going to stick with my opinion that over the last 20 years Australia have been a consistently better side that NZ,

The only halfway decent side in OFC, Aus, have now left the zone. And it's at this point that you think FIFA should let the remaining detritus have an automatic place in the World Cup?

Yes, the Faroe Islands are in Europe. But you don't qualify from the UEFA zone by beating Faroe Islands alone.

[stealthpapes]

I have a mate, sadly passed, who had two caps for New Zealand.

[Ouroboros]

He must have been a truly useless footballer.

I mean, RIP.

[Flyingkiwi]

I don't think I'm following you.

Last time Australia qualified through the OFC was 2006. They qualified above NZ, who managed to finish behind Solomon Islands.

2002 final qualifying round: Aus 6-1 NZ (2 legs)

1998 final qualifying round: Aus 5-0 NZ (2 legs)

1994 final qualifying round: Aus 4-0 NZ (2 legs)

Therefore I'm going to stick with my opinion that over the last 20 years Australia have been a consistently better side that NZ,

The only halfway decent side in OFC, Aus, have now left the zone. And it's at this point that you think FIFA should let the remaining detritus have an automatic place in the World Cup?

Yes, the Faroe Islands are in Europe. But you don't qualify from the UEFA zone by beating Faroe Islands alone.

But, again, you're missing the point!

YOU said that NZ would be slaughtered by Australia and Japan if they moved into the Asia confederation. But that's not all of Asia,is it? And NZ do pretty well well put up against other Asian opponents. Asia has 4 qualification spots. NZ may well struggle against the big guns of Aussie and Japan (And, prepares, South Korea at full strength). But I'm confident they'd hold there own against middle eastern and other south-east asian countries, as they had to to qualify for both 82 and 2010.

You say that an automatic qualification spot for the OFC would be a free ticket for NZ and you don't think it would be valid. OK! Fair enough! You think NZ should have to qualify via a play-off in Asia?? OK. When did they move Uruguay and Mexico to Asia?? Do you think it's fair that the OFC champions have to play "minnows" like this (Both of whom did considerably better than England in this World Cup) whilst FIFA welcomes the likes of Iran, Qater and North Korea with open arms???

[Ouroboros]

Granting spots at the World Cup is a tricky balancing act between encouraging the promotion of the game around the world and ensuring the highest quality tournament. The status quo is questionable in places, but I don't


The fact that NZ shipped 9 goals over two legs against Mexico doesn't actually make me that confident that they would qualify through Asia, if they were to move.

That was my point, not that they should have to play-off against any region in particular.

Having to beat Mexico to qualify for the World Cup, well maybe that's a touch harsh on NZ. But if Mexico hadn't so badly botched their qualification campaign, NZ would have been up against Honduras or Panama. Having to beat the 4th best CONCACAF team to qualify isn't generally that much a cause for complaint.

Arguably NZ would have a better chance of qualifying if they moved into the Asian qualifying - but regardless, the answer cannot be to give OFC an automatic spot.

[Ian Royal]

This time around, NZ were eliminated in the play-offs by Mexico.

Wouldn't it be nice to be in a conference with automatic qualification, like........ ALL THE REST OF THEM!!

get better and earn it then.

[stealthpapes]

That was my point, not that they should have to play-off against any region in particular.

How do they work out the exact structure of this?

[stealthpapes]

So this time they had four play off teams, two of which qualified.

The Asian team got to there from a play off (Jordan beat Uzbekistan) then beaten by Uruguay.
OFC (New Zealand) got beaten by Mexico.

I'm thinking throw in the unlucky loser from Europe to get six or whatever and then do some mini-tournament ... ?

[Flyingkiwi]

This time around, NZ were eliminated in the play-offs by Mexico.

Wouldn't it be nice to be in a conference with automatic qualification, like........ ALL THE REST OF THEM!!

get better and earn it then.

It wouldn't matter if NZ improved so much they were ranked in FIFA top ten, the OFC would still be the poor cousin (Population-wise/money-wise/everything-wise). Why bother having a confederation that isn't treated equally???

[Ian Royal]

This time around, NZ were eliminated in the play-offs by Mexico.

Wouldn't it be nice to be in a conference with automatic qualification, like........ ALL THE REST OF THEM!!

get better and earn it then.

It wouldn't matter if NZ improved so much they were ranked in FIFA top ten, the OFC would still be the poor cousin (Population-wise/money-wise/everything-wise). Why bother having a confederation that isn't treated equally???

I meant the whole confederation.

[stealthpapes]

This time around, NZ were eliminated in the play-offs by Mexico.

Wouldn't it be nice to be in a conference with automatic qualification, like........ ALL THE REST OF THEM!!

get better and earn it then.

It wouldn't matter if NZ improved so much they were ranked in FIFA top ten, the OFC would still be the poor cousin (Population-wise/money-wise/everything-wise). Why bother having a confederation that isn't treated equally???

... because most of the countries are smaller than Slough and Willie Apiata can't play football?

[Ouroboros]

It wouldn't matter if NZ improved so much they were ranked in FIFA top ten, the OFC would still be the poor cousin (Population-wise/money-wise/everything-wise). Why bother having a confederation that isn't treated equally???

Being treated equally doesn't mean getting the same stuff as everyone else; it means being judged by the same standards as everyone else.

Your teams aren't good enough for the World Cup.