VAR

[Sutekh]

They should be voting on whether or not PGMOL should continue to be employed/sent for retraining.

They're damned if they do/damned if thay don't.

A company that specialises in the use of VAR would get the "they're not referees, they don't understand what happens on the pitch" as much as the current referees get the "they can't use the technology, it needs a different set of skills."

If any overturned decisions (offside apart) are always sent back to the onfield referee that statement will be much less relevant as a PGMOL referee will still be making the final decision

Nothing to stop such an organisation employing referees once they get told to p*** off by PGMOL for being 47.

[Franchise FC]

They're damned if they do/damned if thay don't.

A company that specialises in the use of VAR would get the "they're not referees, they don't understand what happens on the pitch" as much as the current referees get the "they can't use the technology, it needs a different set of skills."

If any overturned decisions (offside apart) are always sent back to the onfield referee that statement will be much less relevant as a PGMOL referee will still be making the final decision

Nothing to stop such an organisation employing referees once they get told to p*** off by PGMOL for being 47.

Exactly

[Dirk Gently]

If any overturned decisions (offside apart) are always sent back to the onfield referee that statement will be much less relevant as a PGMOL referee will still be making the final decision

Nothing to stop such an organisation employing referees once they get told to p*** off by PGMOL for being 47.

Exactly

In the fullness of time, yes. But that doesn't help the situation now.

[Franchise FC]

Nothing to stop such an organisation employing referees once they get told to p*** off by PGMOL for being 47.

Exactly

In the fullness of time, yes. But that doesn't help the situation now.

Yes it does, there’s enough ex PGMOL types to fill the gaps, even now
Riley, Clattenburg, Dean, to name a few and I’m no expert on ex refs
Even if all the games are concurrent, you’d need 10
And they’re not

[Brogue]

The Premier League has launched a new X account @PLMatchCentre ahead of the start of the 2024/25 season.

"For the first time, the social media account will provide near-live explainers and updates on operational and officiating matters for every Premier League match.

"The account will post factual explanations of on-pitch refereeing decisions and the involvement of the video assistant referee (VAR) including the role of technology in the decision-making process.

In the absence of live VAR audio being broadcast, as it is not permitted in football, the Premier League Match Centre will be able to relay on social media near-live information from the VAR Hub during a game.

"Premier League Match Centre – based at Stockley Park – is the operational hub of the League that helps with the smooth running of matchday operations of the competition.

"It is linked into all 20 Premier League stadiums, the VAR Hub and broadcast partners around the world."

The new feature aims to give fans more transparency in the VAR decision making process.

[Sutekh]

The Premier League has launched a new X account @PLMatchCentre ahead of the start of the 2024/25 season.

"For the first time, the social media account will provide near-live explainers and updates on operational and officiating matters for every Premier League match.

"The account will post factual explanations of on-pitch refereeing decisions and the involvement of the video assistant referee (VAR) including the role of technology in the decision-making process.

In the absence of live VAR audio being broadcast, as it is not permitted in football, the Premier League Match Centre will be able to relay on social media near-live information from the VAR Hub during a game.

"Premier League Match Centre – based at Stockley Park – is the operational hub of the League that helps with the smooth running of matchday operations of the competition.

"It is linked into all 20 Premier League stadiums, the VAR Hub and broadcast partners around the world."

The new feature aims to give fans more transparency in the VAR decision making process.

Should be very amusing for us all if we get another Spurs v Liverpool farce like last season.

[Sanguine]

The Premier League has launched a new X account @PLMatchCentre ahead of the start of the 2024/25 season.

"For the first time, the social media account will provide near-live explainers and updates on operational and officiating matters for every Premier League match.

"The account will post factual explanations of on-pitch refereeing decisions and the involvement of the video assistant referee (VAR) including the role of technology in the decision-making process.

In the absence of live VAR audio being broadcast, as it is not permitted in football, the Premier League Match Centre will be able to relay on social media near-live information from the VAR Hub during a game.

"Premier League Match Centre – based at Stockley Park – is the operational hub of the League that helps with the smooth running of matchday operations of the competition.

"It is linked into all 20 Premier League stadiums, the VAR Hub and broadcast partners around the world."

The new feature aims to give fans more transparency in the VAR decision making process.

Have to say, this is excellent. Remains to be seen how 'near-live' it proves to be, and how it deals with contentious calls.

[Snowflake Royal]

Another step designed almost exclusively for the TV viewer rather than attendees.

They really should just get over it and mic up the Ref and Video Assistant Ref, plus show replays for the Ref on the big screens. It might encourage them to be more professional and honest.

Don't have to hear all the background techs. Don't have to hear all the players around the Ref.

[Winston Biscuit]

Modern day football has become much more about 'content creation' in recent years. This is just another part of it.

[Sanguine]

Another step designed almost exclusively for the TV viewer rather than attendees.

They really should just get over it and mic up the Ref and Video Assistant Ref, plus show replays for the Ref on the big screens. It might encourage them to be more professional and honest.

Don't have to hear all the background techs. Don't have to hear all the players around the Ref.

Come on, Ian, you're supposed to be a bit more of a thinker than this.

We've all heard the (mostly professional and competent) VAR comms - this isn't the sort of thing that can be played out live in front of a partisan football crowd.

[Snowflake Royal]

Another step designed almost exclusively for the TV viewer rather than attendees.

They really should just get over it and mic up the Ref and Video Assistant Ref, plus show replays for the Ref on the big screens. It might encourage them to be more professional and honest.

Don't have to hear all the background techs. Don't have to hear all the players around the Ref.

Come on, Ian, you're supposed to be a bit more of a thinker than this.

We've all heard the (mostly professional and competent) VAR comms - this isn't the sort of thing that can be played out live in front of a partisan football crowd.

Of course it can if its handled professionally and objectively.


If they can tweet about it, they can broadcast it.

What are the fans going to do after actually being informed what's going on and why? Riot?

[Sanguine]

I mean, you're 'doing Ian' on this, but I'll retreat if we're going to pretend that a series of tweets would have the same impact on a football match as those same comms being relayed live at the game in front of a crowd invested in the decision.

[Snowflake Royal]

I mean, you're 'doing Ian' on this, but I'll retreat if we're going to pretend that a series of tweets would have the same impact on a football match as those same comms being relayed live at the game in front of a crowd invested in the decision.

I'm seriously concerned what you think about football fans if you think making clear announcements risks some sort of reaction.

These decisions happen without explanation now. That's much more likely to provoke a response. And doesn't.

[Sanguine]

I mean, you're 'doing Ian' on this, but I'll retreat if we're going to pretend that a series of tweets would have the same impact on a football match as those same comms being relayed live at the game in front of a crowd invested in the decision.

I'm seriously concerned what you think about football fans if you think making clear announcements risks some sort of reaction.

Really?

And to be clear, you aren't proposing 'clear announcements', in case you were just nudging the goalposts a little, you were suggesting that the VAR comms be made live in-stadium.

[Snowflake Royal]

I mean, you're 'doing Ian' on this, but I'll retreat if we're going to pretend that a series of tweets would have the same impact on a football match as those same comms being relayed live at the game in front of a crowd invested in the decision.

I'm seriously concerned what you think about football fans if you think making clear announcements risks some sort of reaction.

Really?

And to be clear, you aren't proposing 'clear announcements', in case you were just nudging the goalposts a little, you were suggesting that the VAR comms be made live in-stadium.

Communication between VAR and Ref to be precise, with a clear comment no techs involved. So curated.

Take the example of cricket. You get a broadcast of the steps they're taking, what each shows and what the outcome is. You don’t hear all the chat about rewind, change angle, time stamps etc.

VAR: Ref, we're checking for a possible foul.
Ref: Ok, thanks VAR, please confirm incident?
VAR: Possible foul by red 9, on blue 5 before the goal.
Ref: Ok, I saw some shoulder to shoulder but nothing untoward stood out.
VAR: Checking Replays. Slow motion.
VAR: Checking second and third angle.
VAR: Ok Ref, clear contact from right foot of red 9 on blue 5, causing a trip, which is a foul. As you didn't see this, we'll overturn the goal for a foul. Please award defensive freekick.
Ref: Thanks VAR, defensive freekick on edge of six yard box for blue.

Simple. Might encourage them to follow their actual communication protocols rather than that cluster oxf*rd we all heard a while back.

[Brogue]

Ian has spoken, sanguine. We move on, apparently.

[Crusader Royal]

I mean, you're 'doing Ian' on this, but I'll retreat if we're going to pretend that a series of tweets would have the same impact on a football match as those same comms being relayed live at the game in front of a crowd invested in the decision.

The real problem with communicating is most decisions just don’t lend themselves to a short snappy explanation.
Unlike rugby and cricket where decisions can basically be broken down into a sort of flow chart because the laws are written that way football has always been an opinion based game. Obviously offside works well in this decision making form - series of simple questions, get green lights for them all and you have a clear decision. Other offences are much more difficult to decide and communicate.
I’ve said multiple times that the main issue in football is not with referees, it’s with the game’s attitude to the people it entrusts with decision making. If the game would accept that referees are asked to give their opinions in a fair, unbiased way and almost always do that, then we should accept that we may not always agree with that opinion and it may not always be shown to be correct after the event when viewed in a totally different context. I don’t think heaping more and more pressure on referees while managers, players and fans give absolutely nothing back is not healthy and not the way to make the game work.

[Sutekh]

I mean, you're 'doing Ian' on this, but I'll retreat if we're going to pretend that a series of tweets would have the same impact on a football match as those same comms being relayed live at the game in front of a crowd invested in the decision.

The real problem with communicating is most decisions just don’t lend themselves to a short snappy explanation.
Unlike rugby and cricket where decisions can basically be broken down into a sort of flow chart because the laws are written that way football has always been an opinion based game. Obviously offside works well in this decision making form - series of simple questions, get green lights for them all and you have a clear decision. Other offences are much more difficult to decide and communicate.
I’ve said multiple times that the main issue in football is not with referees, it’s with the game’s attitude to the people it entrusts with decision making. If the game would accept that referees are asked to give their opinions in a fair, unbiased way and almost always do that, then we should accept that we may not always agree with that opinion and it may not always be shown to be correct after the event when viewed in a totally different context. I don’t think heaping more and more pressure on referees while managers, players and fans give absolutely nothing back is not healthy and not the way to make the game work.

That's not allowed any more.

[Snowflake Royal]

Ian has spoken, sanguine. We move on, apparently.

Maybe Green can come along and help raise the level of debate.

Weren't you complaining the other day that you just want to say your piece and aren't interested in discussing it or being persuaded otherwise?

I'm happy to talk about my opinion, and open to being persuaded otherwise. The fans can't cope with it (though certainly true for some) doesn't really cut it for me though.

[Crusader Royal]

I'm seriously concerned what you think about football fans if you think making clear announcements risks some sort of reaction.

Really?

And to be clear, you aren't proposing 'clear announcements', in case you were just nudging the goalposts a little, you were suggesting that the VAR comms be made live in-stadium.

Communication between VAR and Ref to be precise, with a clear comment no techs involved. So curated.

Take the example of cricket. You get a broadcast of the steps they're taking, what each shows and what the outcome is. You don’t hear all the chat about rewind, change angle, time stamps etc.

VAR: Ref, we're checking for a possible foul.
Ref: Ok, thanks VAR, please confirm incident?
VAR: Possible foul by red 9, on blue 5 before the goal.
Ref: Ok, I saw some shoulder to shoulder but nothing untoward stood out.
VAR: Checking Replays. Slow motion.
VAR: Checking second and third angle.
VAR: Ok Ref, clear contact from right foot of red 9 on blue 5, causing a trip, which is a foul. As you didn't see this, we'll overturn the goal for a foul. Please award defensive freekick.
Ref: Thanks VAR, defensive freekick on edge of six yard box for blue.

Simple. Might encourage them to follow their actual communication protocols rather than that cluster oxf*rd we all heard a while back.

You need to think through an awful lot of scenarios other than the most simplistic before you can decide whether that woukd have any chance of working.
As you can see at any televised game lots of decisions aren’t at all like that and the referee’s thought processes are way more complex.
As I said those sort of things work in black and white sports like cricket and rugby but not so well in football.