The Safe Standing Campaign

[Forbury Lion]

Just for people' information, this an example, frm germany, of what a sfae standing area might acrtually look like.



When it's designated as a seated area the bars are removed and the seats fold down.

Can someone pass this picture onto the club and ask them whether they would ever consider embracing an idea like this?

If a significant number of fans were prepared to pay a significant premium then it would certainly get the interest of the clubs money makers.

[Ooo Trevor Morley]

Why not just allow standing in seated areas? If the club and the fans decide on an area, maybe the back of Y25 and Y26, and have it as a standing zone, then the problem will be solved. Has someone thought of this already? Is there some problem with this idea?

[westendgirl]

Why not just allow standing in seated areas? If the club and the fans decide on an area, maybe the back of Y25 and Y26, and have it as a standing zone, then the problem will be solved. Has someone thought of this already? Is there some problem with this idea?

The problem with this idea is that the FLA (football licencing authority) attend games regularly and do not turn a blind eye to standing so the club will not either. The FLA can and do restrict the number of seats to be sold if there is (in their opinion) too much standing.

That is the reason for the campaign - to change the FLA rules not just to persuade the clubs to allow it.

[Ooo Trevor Morley]

Why not just allow standing in seated areas? If the club and the fans decide on an area, maybe the back of Y25 and Y26, and have it as a standing zone, then the problem will be solved. Has someone thought of this already? Is there some problem with this idea?

The problem with this idea is that the FLA (football licencing authority) attend games regularly and do not turn a blind eye to standing so the club will not either. The FLA can and do restrict the number of seats to be sold if there is (in their opinion) too much standing.

That is the reason for the campaign - to change the FLA rules not just to persuade the clubs to allow it.

I meant: why not campaign to allow standing in parts of the stadium i.e. at the back.

It seems that putting crash barriers on every single row of seating is a bit excessive, if not entirely unnecessary. My question was: why not push for us to be allowed to stand with out proposing these barriers or any changes be added to the stadium.

[Wycombe Royal]

Why not just allow standing in seated areas? If the club and the fans decide on an area, maybe the back of Y25 and Y26, and have it as a standing zone, then the problem will be solved. Has someone thought of this already? Is there some problem with this idea?

The problem with this idea is that the FLA (football licencing authority) attend games regularly and do not turn a blind eye to standing so the club will not either. The FLA can and do restrict the number of seats to be sold if there is (in their opinion) too much standing.

That is the reason for the campaign - to change the FLA rules not just to persuade the clubs to allow it.

I meant: why not campaign to allow standing in parts of the stadium i.e. at the back.

It seems that putting crash barriers on every single row of seating is a bit excessive, if not entirely unnecessary. My question was: why not push for us to be allowed to stand with out proposing these barriers or any changes be added to the stadium.

THat will never happen, on both safety grounds and the fact that you have season ticket holders who will want to remain seated in those areas.

I know the come back will be that they can move, but why should they? They have purchased a season ticket for a perticular seat and are entitled to sit in it.

[cheeryoleary]

Has Martin Salter expressed an opinion on this?

Not yet. However. Martin Salter will be the guest on the Reading 107 phone-in from 6.15 pm tomorrow (Friday), during which time I will be asking him to give his support and/or express his opinion on this.

Martin Salter, who is also a Vice President of STAR, the Supporters Trust at Reading

I can't find a response here as to whether Martin Salter supports "(a) priority ..... at the top of today's list", yet he claims to be a VP of STAR

I can't find Martin Salter's name listed here http://edmi.parliament.uk/EDMi/EDMDetai ... ESSION=885

manic bus drivers has been raised and is still being dealt with - so nothing else can be done on that in the short term. The other current priority is trying to get RFC to add on the royalty points for STAR members - that's an on-going activity!

Question: Forced to choose between the two, would you rather have a safe environment at a football match free of badly managed traffic and maniac bus drivers.... or 10 royalty points?

[Ooo Trevor Morley]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jFD15oZmgiU

I want to do this i.e. jump from side to side while singing. When do you think we'll be able to do this at Reading?

[Skin]

Why not just allow standing in seated areas? If the club and the fans decide on an area, maybe the back of Y25 and Y26, and have it as a standing zone, then the problem will be solved. Has someone thought of this already? Is there some problem with this idea?

The problem with this idea is that the FLA (football licencing authority) attend games regularly and do not turn a blind eye to standing so the club will not either. The FLA can and do restrict the number of seats to be sold if there is (in their opinion) too much standing.

That is the reason for the campaign - to change the FLA rules not just to persuade the clubs to allow it.

I meant: why not campaign to allow standing in parts of the stadium i.e. at the back.

It seems that putting crash barriers on every single row of seating is a bit excessive, if not entirely unnecessary. My question was: why not push for us to be allowed to stand with out proposing these barriers or any changes be added to the stadium.

THat will never happen, on both safety grounds and the fact that you have season ticket holders who will want to remain seated in those areas.

I know the come back will be that they can move, but why should they? They have purchased a season ticket for a perticular seat and are entitled to sit in it.

The safety arguement makes me laugh. It will still be the same number of people in the stadium just that some might stand where their seats are. The authorities keep referring to 'safety grounds' so just how many people do we reckon have been injured standing in an all-seater stadium? Probably none? Its an over reaction to the tragic terracing disasters of the past, when the whole set ups were completely different.
The issue regarding STH'S who won't want to stand is debatable if you refer to the sections of the ground already mentioned, predominately at the top half of Y24/25/26. When allowed to these sections usually stand en-mass anyway.

[biscuitman]

Up 106 now, what happens now? John Redwood wouldnt sign it because nothing happens after they reach a target! Great!

[Dirk Gently]

Things are starting to happen - the Sunday Mirror reports that Caborn is to reexamine the issue, and there is also a meeting scheduled between him and Mike Hancock (who raised this EDM) in mid-March.

Also, as an aside, on the 5Live phone in this morning about congested trains, someone texted in and said "if it's safe for me to stand on a train why isn't it safe for me to stand at a football match? The football ground isn't travelling at 70 mph!"

[T.R.O.L.I.]

Things are starting to happen - the Sunday Mirror reports that Caborn is to reexamine the issue, and there is also a meeting scheduled between him and Mike Hancock (who raised this EDM) in mid-March.

Also, as an aside, on the 5Live phone in this morning about congested trains, someone texted in and said "if it's safe for me to stand on a train why isn't it safe for me to stand at a football match? The football ground isn't travelling at 70 mph!"

Neither are the trains nowadays.

[Keeper]

I've always thought that its funny that during the match, when most people stay in one place and are watching the match that standing at this time is more dangerous than before kick-off or at half-time, because thats when people want to move around, go downstairs and generally stand around when there is more chance of being in someones way

Also, if there were areas of safe standing, would the stewards still need to come up the stairs and sit on one of the steps causing a huge safety issue and fire hazard?

[Forbury Lion]

Standing isn't the safety problem, It's falling.

I think there's an element of policing, It being far easier to control a seated crowd than a standing one as people are more likely to stay where they are and not all surge in one direction or other.

Without some form of barrier system there can be no standing.

Also, how do you ensure people are standing in the right place?

[weybridgewanderer]

i think the issue of standing was more related to overcrowding than anything else. hillsborough springs to mind

Now that "all ticket" games are the norm and there is no more "pay at the turnstyle" its far easier to control the numbers getting access to the stadium therefore making removing the overcrowding issue.

However from a policing point of view, now you know who the ticket was sold to for any particular seat so if a missile is thrown or other complaints received (sectarianism, racism) it is easier to find the person the ticket was sold to. This would not be so easy in a standing area unless you are to stand "where you are told to stand".

I am aware that the person sold the ticket may not be the person occupying the seat.

[Dirk Gently]

On this subject, one of the campaign members has posted the Safe Standing question onto David Cameron's blog.

The safe standing question won last week's vote and you can see the responses on :
http://www.webcameron.org.uk/blogs/2213-Standing-areas-at-football-grounds-discussion--does-David-support-the-EDM-signed-by-over-100-MPs

[biscuitman]

http://www.webcameron.org.uk/

Latest Video from Cameron, talks about safety first