Steward abuse and standing

[Jerry St Clair]

but there is absolutely no reason to stand throughout.

What does that mean? I like to stand, so why can't I?

Because there are no standing facilities.

That isn't a reason for not standing.

Anyway, what "facilities" are required to stand, other than the physical ability to do so?

[Magnus]

but there is absolutely no reason to stand throughout.

What does that mean? I like to stand, so why can't I?

Because there are no standing facilities.

That isn't a reason for not standing.

Anyway, what "facilities" are required to stand, other than the physical ability to do so?

Indeed. Don't think my local bus stop has any standing facilities either but people seem to manage.

[RoyalBlue]

I saw that steward in Y21 he was up and down so much I thought he was trying to start a Mexican Wave.

I can see how you'd make that mistake. He was waving his arms up and down each time he jumped up!

However, even he gave up after Lita's goal when the whole East Stand continued standing and urging the team forward.

Would be really funny but for the disgusting and inexcusable double standards adopted by RFC on this matter and STAR's abject failure to make a stand (no pun intended) on it.

[Hoop Blah]

I was asked at the senior management meeting today to pass on a message to all fans of Reading, the East stand and Y26 in particular, that the club will not condone persistant standing and will certainly not allow abuse of the stewards who are doing the job they are employed for.

This is not a discussion of what the rules should be and whether we agree with them but a warnng that the rules that currently exist will be enforced and if it is necessary large numbers may find themselves banned from the Madejski.

The club is particularly aware that Reading fans are bottom of the fans fair play league and possibly working towards reduced away allocations if they continue this way. Although our fans are witty and knowledgeable in some songs, their song on Saturday abusing their own stewards is a step too far for the club.

Why have you posted this? Would a better course of action have been to respond that you are there to support the fans interests, not lecture them on their behaviour?

This might help to answer the your question

Whilst reading the stadium planning application I noticed this strange desciption of STAR:

Reading FC also has a Supporters Trust (STAR) which aims to create goodwill for the club amongst supporters and the local community by promoting support and ensuring that home fans act responsibly with respect to the local community.

So in the clubs mind, STAR are actually their PR mouthpiece and fan police. What happened to representing the fans views?

[bigmike]

It is a joke that the authorities concede that Man Utd fans stand up because that's what Man Utd fans do.

A statement on the Man Utd official site yesterday was telling their fans to sit down at the match last night otherwise they would get a reduced allocation for their next visit to the Madejski (that was an instruction from the Football Licensing Authority).

http://www.manutd.com/default.sps?pagegid=%7BB4CEE8FA%2D9A47%2D47BC%2DB069%2D3F7A2F35DB70%7D&newsid=406882

Man u Fans just print their own tickets anyways... They certainly do for european away games

[Magnus]

Thanks Hoop Blah I missed that, very interesting.

Incredible, the corporate monster of Reading FC grows and grows it seems. Are there any breakaway fans groups that represent and speak up for the fans?

[STAR Liaison]

That isn't a reason for not standing.

Anyway, what "facilities" are required to stand, other than the physical ability to do so?

At the risk of being an apologist for RFC just because I can give you an insight into what rules they work under, I can tell you that according to the Green Guide (which specifies dimensions etc needed at a football stadium) the facilities required is more space. This is because you need more room for standing shoulder to shoulder than you do sitting.

Don't tell me I am wrong because it is not my conclusion but the rules - tell them (the FLA) and as they are unlikely to read this that might just involve a little work

[Jerry St Clair]

Don't tell me I am wrong because it is not my conclusion but the rules - tell them (the FLA) and as they are unlikely to read this that might just involve a little work

Woah, steady on there. No need for the defensive nature of your post.

[Royal Lady]

I presume the laws have changed since the Elm Park days then, as I distinctly remember being shoulder to shoulder a few times on the South Bank!

[Harps stay sharp]

but there is absolutely no reason to stand throughout.

What does that mean? I like to stand, so why can't I?

Because there are no standing facilities.

That isn't a reason for not standing.

Anyway, what "facilities" are required to stand, other than the physical ability to do so?

Indeed. Don't think my local bus stop has any standing facilities either but people seem to manage.

What I mean is Reading FC have a licence that allows spectators to watch football in an all seated arena. Therefore there are no licensed standing areas. Supporters are not permitted to stand for long periods under the terms of that licence.

There is no reason to stand as there are seats provided. Saying I like standing will not save Reading FC from losing revenue due to the fact that they will have to reduce visting supporters allocations.

Man Utd fans have got a reputation for standing and should be punished. Otherwise our fans will continue to say...'well they're standing up so why can't we'...and the standing sitting situation and stewards being abused for carrying out their job will go on and on for years to come.

[kadzidlo]

We should ban the Man Utd fans from our stadium next season, we'd fill the ground with Reading Fans easy.

If they can't obey the laws within our stadium then they should not be allowed to attend the game.

[RoyalBlue]

Here's another question for STAR to pose to the senior management at the club, although I doubt they'll offer much of an answer as usual.

If the issue of standing is such a serious issue, then why isn't there a recoprical agreement between clubs i.e. a supporter turfed out for standing at the Mad Stad is then banned from their own stadium and vice versa?

How do they do it ? - well video footage and still photos sent to the other club for starters, assuming the club/police can't get any evidence of identity. Ticket sales should also help identify offenders or at least the person who bought the ticket for them (one advantage of all seater grounds with seats allocated/linked to ticket sales).

[shadesrwrf]

Here's another question for STAR to pose to the senior management at the club, although I doubt they'll offer much of an answer as usual.

If the issue of standing is such a serious issue, then why isn't there a recoprical agreement between clubs i.e. a supporter turfed out for standing at the Mad Stad is then banned from their own stadium and vice versa?

How do they do it ? - well video footage and still photos sent to the other club for starters, assuming the club/police can't get any evidence of identity. Ticket sales should also help identify offenders or at least the person who bought the ticket for them (one advantage of all seater grounds with seats allocated/linked to ticket sales).

Surely if you want the ability to stand at grounds it doesn't make any sense to be asking anybody how they're going to deal with fans who do it?

I don't want to see other clubs dealing with this issue. I want to see fans standing. Well done to the Mancs for getting away with it.

[Forty]

There seems a certain degree of disbelief about the way away fans are treated. I for one do not really believe that they're ejected. What about a regular statement saying how many have been ejected - that'd make us think.

[Winchester Royal]

In my opinion, its about providing the majority with what they appear to want.
If 4,500 United fans are going to stand up, then its probably in the best interests of the stewards to let them, and just make sure they're not crowding the entrances or blocking the aisles.

If theres 2000 Reading fans who want to stand in Y24-26 and the rest of the fans want to sit down, its easier to make the 2000 sit down and do what the rest do.

[Harold]

Quit crying and all stand for a game.

[Farnborough Royal]

Quit crying and all stand for a game.

Post of the day

[STAR Voice]

...... Throughout the first half, the front row of United supporters in the South Stand stood right in front of a line of stewards, who in turn were stood facing them just a couple of feet away.

Guess what, after half time, every single person in that front row was back in their position and joined the rest of the South Stand in standing for the whole of the second half. This clearly exposes the fairy tale of 'quiet ejections of offenders from the concourses' as the complete and utter load of b*llocks that most Royal supporters, with the exception of our STAR 'representatives' know it to be.

Why the hell do STAR think the club are refusing to tell them how many away supporters are ejected for standing? Might it not be that they know only too well that to do so would show, once and for all, that they are not being truthful?

Do the STAR officials who deal with the club management on matters such as this not have any pride? Do they not resent being strung along, taken for mugs and being fed untruths? I certainly would.

Instead, they appear to completely lack shame and trot back from their meetings with the club to pass on messages from the club management to us about the misbehaviour of the home fans etc. etc.

Oh and what about the complete and utter b*llocks regarding supporters of away clubs having their ticket allocations reduced for persistent standing? Those very same United fans who were allowed to stand throughout the league fixture at the Mad Stad, whilst home supporters next to them were treated with an iron fist as usual, were rewarded for their behaviour with an increased ticket allocation
(And yes, I do know they were 'entitled' to an increased allocation of 15% but that then could have been cut back. But, of course, that might have cost RFC money - although maybe the reduced allocation could conveniently be half the South Stand - and that is clearly a far more important consideration than enforcing safety rules!)

Ok, I'll rise to this little tirade, since in your fury you have insulted both my integrity and my intelligence. It’s strange that you clearly know so much about the situation – you must do, since you’re quite happy to state things as facts that you have no knowledge of. (NB I’ve omitted some parts of your original post – this is for reasons or brevity only.)

As it happens, I do know the numbers ejected and arrested this season, as I spent 3 hours in a Safety Advisory Group Meeting last week, and the information was given there. But as that was a confidential forum I'm not going to breach confidence and publish it here.

I also know that the club is a private, commercial, organisation. They can release whatever information they do or don’t want to release. I don’t like it, and I think they should publish these figures, but tough titty, mate - that’s life!

Can I ask why is it so important to you? Please explain exactly why you're getting so hung up on it and what difference it actually makes to your behaviour if it's 2 people, or 200 or 2,000.

I can also categorically confirm that the policy is “quiet ejectionsâ€

[STAR Voice]

Here's another question for STAR to pose to the senior management at the club, although I doubt they'll offer much of an answer as usual.

If the issue of standing is such a serious issue, then why isn't there a recoprical agreement between clubs i.e. a supporter turfed out for standing at the Mad Stad is then banned from their own stadium and vice versa?

How do they do it ? - well video footage and still photos sent to the other club for starters, assuming the club/police can't get any evidence of identity. Ticket sales should also help identify offenders or at least the person who bought the ticket for them (one advantage of all seater grounds with seats allocated/linked to ticket sales).

This has already been discussed - there is no such reciprocal agreement, although some clubs (and the FLA) believe it will be a good idea. Other clubs just aren't interested, and nor are the Premier League.

So while it might work to a certain extent, I'm convinced that the underlying problem is with the legislation, not with the way it's being implemented.

[STAR Voice]

I saw that steward in Y21 he was up and down so much I thought he was trying to start a Mexican Wave.

I can see how you'd make that mistake. He was waving his arms up and down each time he jumped up!

However, even he gave up after Lita's goal when the whole East Stand continued standing and urging the team forward.

Would be really funny but for the disgusting and inexcusable double standards adopted by RFC on this matter and STAR's abject failure to make a stand (no pun intended) on it.

Please tell me exactly what arguments you'd like me to make "in a stand" on this. I'll be happy to put them forward if I think that they'd have any chance of success.

But as far as I can tell from the arguments so far, you want me to say "Because there are too many away supporters breaching ground regulations for you to be able to stop them, you ought to let home supporters do exactly the same."

I know damn well that if I suggested that I'd get laughed at - and if by some miracle the club agreed to that, then Reading Borough Council would take their safety licence away as soon as they heard about it.

So, please, tell me exactly what arguments you'd like me to use "in this stand"?

As to the "not representing our members" stuff - whilst there are a significant number who want to see standing back at football matches (including me - see numerous posts passim), that number is still a minority. We are not a single-issue organisational, and whilst this is obviously of critical importance to some people, to the majority of our members it's hardly on the radar.

As I've said lots of times, RFC has no option under current regulations - vast effort is going in to get those regulations changed, but RFC is unable to do what you want.

An important part of my role, as I see it, is to tell the club what the fans are thinking and the fans what the club are thinking, and trying to influence opinion on both sides as much as I can.

I can't change the law or the opinions of people who see things their own way, and I'm afraid it's tough luck if sometimes the reality of life doesn't match what they want it to be. That’s not going to stop me communicating that reality of life, and I'm not going to try and fight a battle that I know is unwinnable - because the "enemy" in this battle is the FLA and DCMA, not Reading FC!