Emerse Fae

[Alan Partridge]

great Championship footballers

the list is huge, players bought for millions who were rubbish, at every team, even the big ones-


some succeed straight away-henry-torres
some fail and are shipped out-djemba djemba-veron
others take a while to acclimatise but come back stronger-drogba, ballack

paying the increased wages and fees is no guarantee of success
&
losing a milllion on fae if he fails and is sold? > losing 15 M on veron

It's all relative, £15million to CHelsea is the equivalent of £250,000 to us.

i.e it doesn't really matter, anyway we aren't trying to compete with those clubs.

Name your strongest Reading side with everyone fit and available

i'd hazard a guess that Matejovsky is the only 'new' player among it. That's only because Sidwell left.

Speaks voLOLumes.

[Archie's penalty]

great Championship footballers

the list is huge, players bought for millions who were rubbish, at every team, even the big ones-


some succeed straight away-henry-torres
some fail and are shipped out-djemba djemba-veron
others take a while to acclimatise but come back stronger-drogba, ballack

paying the increased wages and fees is no guarantee of success
&
losing a milllion on fae if he fails and is sold? > losing 15 M on veron

It's all relative, £15million to CHelsea is the equivalent of £250,000 to us.

i.e it doesn't really matter, anyway we aren't trying to compete with those clubs.

Name your strongest Reading side with everyone fit and available

i'd hazard a guess that Matejovsky is the only 'new' player among it. That's only because Sidwell left.

Speaks voLOLumes.

No it doesn't - Cisse...

And using lol in the middle of a word does not something funny make...

[brendywendy]

i reckon matejovsky would be in the side alongside sidwell if he was still here

also cisse is playing very well for the 1st team
i also believe if murts wasnt captain then rosenior could be in the 1st team too


and its not just about picking our best player and then saying oh new player x is not even as good as him
we have improved the squad, we have improved the 1st team

we have struggled to fill our sidwell shaped hole, would scott brown have done any better than fae? who knows, but plenty of teams struggle to replace their best player, just as we are

[Alan Partridge]

I'm a firm believer in that you will always get what you deserve in lots of things. If you put lots of something in be it effort, time, money whatever you will end up getting a reward eventually. I think in many ways Reading deserve to go down. Obviously I don't WANT that to happen at all, I want Reading to stay up and continue to improve and grow as a club, like all fans do. But Reading's net spend over the last 2 years has been on Championship budgets, and if that's what you pay on this scenario...then that's where you'll end up. This is a league where you really can't stand still, if you do you go from 8th to 18th.

All the other teams manage to find players to come to their clubs, yet Reading struggle where Derby County with 8 points all season succeed. How?

Reading for wahtever reasons have refused to pay the going Premiership rates for players, that to me is hugely disappointing. If you are given this Premiership money and you talk a good game and boy do Reading talk a fantastic game I think you have a duty and a responsibility to your fans as well as current team to spend a good chunk of that money to prduce a good, competitive Premiership football team. Reading have failed miserably at this part of being a Premiership club.

I don't think anyone can question the effort of the current team, I hardly ever feel they haven't given 100% in most games, but ultimately they just aren't good enough in lots of positions. It's been pretty obvious since August/September time yet we've still failed to act on it sufficiently.

I will be going to as many games as possible and will go next season regardless what league we are in, but this season has been thoroughly depressing for the most part. Due to the clubs own self incompetence of purchasing players, there is no way this team should have been fighting a relegation battle with some of the crap teams that are in the league this season.

[Archie's penalty]

I'm a firm believer in that you will always get what you deserve in lots of things. If you put lots of something in be it effort, time, money whatever you will end up getting a reward eventually. I think in many ways Reading deserve to go down. Obviously I don't WANT than to happen at all, I want Reading to stay up and continue to improve and grow as a club, like all fans do. But Reading's net spend over the last 2 years has been on Championship budgets. This is a league where you really can't stand still, if you do you go from 8th to 18th.

All the other teams manage to find players to come to their clubs, yet Reading struggle where Derby County with 8 points all season succeed. How?

Reading for wahtever reasons have refused to pay the going Premiership rates for players, that to me is hugely disappointing. If you are given this Premiership money and you talk a good game and boy do Reading talk a fantastic game I think you have a duty and a responsibility to your fans as well as current team to spend a good chunk of that money to prduce a good, sompetitive Premiership football team. Reading have failed miserably at this part of being a Premiership club.

I don't think anyone can question the effort of the current team, I hardly ever feel they haven't given 100% in most games, but ultimately they just aren't good enough in lots of positions. It's been pretty obvious since August/September time yet we've still failed to act on it sufficiently.

I will be going to as many games as possible and will go next season regardless what league we are in, but this season has been thoroughly depressing for the most part. Due to the clubs own self incompetence of purchasing players, there is no way this team should have been fighting a relegation battle with some of the crap teams that are in the league this season.

I feel your pain AP. I just think we have done a pretty good job in finding players. I hate all the fake posturing of Madejski, Howe and the like but we are doing our best. We are still a small club, not much bigger than Wigan in the end. Which great players have they brought in over the last couple of years? Heskey = not bad, Koumas?

Ask most neutrals and they say the crucial factor this year has been the loss of Sidwell. I hope and pray we will stay up. Then we can have a lovely rest during the holidays. You won't see my face round here when people like SKDD start to bitch from May the 8th onwards about signing 7 million pound players...

[Southbank Old Boy]

We are still a small club, not much bigger than Wigan in the end. Which great players have they brought in over the last couple of years? Heskey = not bad, Koumas?

They've bought in plenty of decent players over the last two or three seasons. Some have paid off, some haven't. Some have been established and some have been gambles similar to ours. The they've been willing and able to bring them in is the big difference though.

Here's some 'highlights' from Wigans transfers

Chimbonda, Scharner, Henri Camara, Fitz Hall, Ryan Taylor, Henchoz, De Zeeuw, Kirkland, Kilbane, Michael Brown, Marlonn King etc etc

[Archie's penalty]

We are still a small club, not much bigger than Wigan in the end. Which great players have they brought in over the last couple of years? Heskey = not bad, Koumas?

They've bought in plenty of decent players over the last two or three seasons. Some have paid off, some haven't. Some have been established and some have been gambles similar to ours. The they've been willing and able to bring them in is the big difference though.

Here's some 'highlights' from Wigans transfers

Chimbonda, Scharner, Henri Camara, Fitz Hall, Ryan Taylor, Henchoz, De Zeeuw, Kirkland, Kilbane, Michael Brown, Marlonn King etc etc

Ok I'll give you Chimbonda and Scharner, Ryan Taylor ain't bad but the rest?

I think you can make a case that Cisse, Matejovsky and Rosenior are in a similar league to the Wigan successes I have mentioned above...

[bcubed]

I'm a firm believer in that you will always get what you deserve in lots of things. If you put lots of something in be it effort, time, money whatever you will end up getting a reward eventually. I think in many ways Reading deserve to go down. Obviously I don't WANT that to happen at all, I want Reading to stay up and continue to improve and grow as a club, like all fans do. But Reading's net spend over the last 2 years has been on Championship budgets, and if that's what you pay on this scenario...then that's where you'll end up. This is a league where you really can't stand still, if you do you go from 8th to 18th.

All the other teams manage to find players to come to their clubs, yet Reading struggle where Derby County with 8 points all season succeed. How?

Reading for wahtever reasons have refused to pay the going Premiership rates for players, that to me is hugely disappointing. If you are given this Premiership money and you talk a good game and boy do Reading talk a fantastic game I think you have a duty and a responsibility to your fans as well as current team to spend a good chunk of that money to prduce a good, competitive Premiership football team. Reading have failed miserably at this part of being a Premiership club.

I don't think anyone can question the effort of the current team, I hardly ever feel they haven't given 100% in most games, but ultimately they just aren't good enough in lots of positions. It's been pretty obvious since August/September time yet we've still failed to act on it sufficiently.

I will be going to as many games as possible and will go next season regardless what league we are in, but this season has been thoroughly depressing for the most part. Due to the clubs own self incompetence of purchasing players, there is no way this team should have been fighting a relegation battle with some of the crap teams that are in the league this season.

I know this has all been said before but not perhaps so eloquently and with such feeling
I totally agree - well said AP

[Southbank Old Boy]

We are still a small club, not much bigger than Wigan in the end. Which great players have they brought in over the last couple of years? Heskey = not bad, Koumas?

They've bought in plenty of decent players over the last two or three seasons. Some have paid off, some haven't. Some have been established and some have been gambles similar to ours. The they've been willing and able to bring them in is the big difference though.

Here's some 'highlights' from Wigans transfers

Chimbonda, Scharner, Henri Camara, Fitz Hall, Ryan Taylor, Henchoz, De Zeeuw, Kirkland, Kilbane, Michael Brown, Marlonn King etc etc

Ok I'll give you Chimbonda and Scharner, Ryan Taylor ain't bad but the rest?

I think you can make a case that Cisse, Matejovsky and Rosenior are in a similar league to the Wigan successes I have mentioned above...

I think it's more the intent they've shown than the actual success of the players involved.

In players like King, Hall and Camara they cherry picked players from the Championship/relegated sides. In Henchoz and de Zeewu they got two excellent centre half's who were proven Premiership players. Similarly Kirkland was an England squad member with a highly thought of future.

Can you picture us signing players with that caliber of experience at the moment?

[Wycombe Royal]

Can you picture us signing players with that caliber of experience at the moment?

And where has that "calibre" and "experience" got them? (not to mention the money it cost).

[handbags_harris]

We are still a small club, not much bigger than Wigan in the end. Which great players have they brought in over the last couple of years? Heskey = not bad, Koumas?

They've bought in plenty of decent players over the last two or three seasons. Some have paid off, some haven't. Some have been established and some have been gambles similar to ours. The they've been willing and able to bring them in is the big difference though.

Here's some 'highlights' from Wigans transfers

Chimbonda, Scharner, Henri Camara, Fitz Hall, Ryan Taylor, Henchoz, De Zeeuw, Kirkland, Kilbane, Michael Brown, Marlonn King etc etc

Ok I'll give you Chimbonda and Scharner, Ryan Taylor ain't bad but the rest?

I think you can make a case that Cisse, Matejovsky and Rosenior are in a similar league to the Wigan successes I have mentioned above...

FWIW I'd take Camara over Leroy (well, Leroy's already done that technically), Henchoz/de Zeeuw over Cisse, Michael Brown over Emerse Fae/Khalifa Cisse...

[Vision]

We are still a small club, not much bigger than Wigan in the end. Which great players have they brought in over the last couple of years? Heskey = not bad, Koumas?

They've bought in plenty of decent players over the last two or three seasons. Some have paid off, some haven't. Some have been established and some have been gambles similar to ours. The they've been willing and able to bring them in is the big difference though.

Here's some 'highlights' from Wigans transfers

Chimbonda, Scharner, Henri Camara, Fitz Hall, Ryan Taylor, Henchoz, De Zeeuw, Kirkland, Kilbane, Michael Brown, Marlonn King etc etc

Which rather begs the question how come last season they only survived by the skin of their teeth on the last day and this season they are only one point ahead of us when we are supposed to be failing so miserably.

It does make me laugh when people assume that just because a certain team approahes something in a certain way and is successful ( a relative concept in itself) that it means that if we approached it in the same way we would be equally successful.

Equally just because clubs such as Ipswich, Leeds, Bradford and Birmingham went down having spend a lot of money trying to get to the supposed "next level" doesn't follow that it would be the same for us. Its not simply about money spent, if it were the league tables would be decided before a ball is kicked.

You do what works best for your club and what you believe in. we don't have a manager (such as a Rednapp for example) who has a track record for bringing in a lot of personnel and getting them to gel quickly. What Coppell is good at is developing and nurturing a team spirit and togetherness by gradually building a team. He is not and never has been a man to throw money at a situation. I'm not convinced that spending 15m+ on the 3 or 4 players that consistently get mentioned on here would have us in any better a position than we are now.

That may seem like he's burying his head in the sand and doing little to improve the situation to some on here but to me its just him doing what has worked for him in the past and what has given us unparalelled success (theres that relative word again) over the last couple of seasons.

[Archie's penalty]

We are still a small club, not much bigger than Wigan in the end. Which great players have they brought in over the last couple of years? Heskey = not bad, Koumas?

They've bought in plenty of decent players over the last two or three seasons. Some have paid off, some haven't. Some have been established and some have been gambles similar to ours. The they've been willing and able to bring them in is the big difference though.

Here's some 'highlights' from Wigans transfers

Chimbonda, Scharner, Henri Camara, Fitz Hall, Ryan Taylor, Henchoz, De Zeeuw, Kirkland, Kilbane, Michael Brown, Marlonn King etc etc

Which rather begs the question how come last season they only survived by the skin of their teeth on the last day and this season they are only one point ahead of us when we are supposed to be failing so miserably.

It does make me laugh when people assume that just because a certain team approahes something in a certain way and is successful ( a relative concept in itself) that it means that if we approached it in the same way we would be equally successful.

Equally just because clubs such as Ipswich, Leeds, Bradford and Birmingham went down having spend a lot of money trying to get to the supposed "next level" doesn't follow that it would be the same for us. Its not simply about money spent, if it were the league tables would be decided before a ball is kicked.

You do what works best for your club and what you believe in. we don't have a manager (such as a Rednapp for example) who has a track record for bringing in a lot of personnel and getting them to gel quickly. What Coppell is good at is developing and nurturing a team spirit and togetherness by gradually building a team. He is not and never has been a man to throw money at a situation. I'm not convinced that spending 15m+ on the 3 or 4 players that consistently get mentioned on here would have us in any better a position than we are now.

That may seem like he's burying his head in the sand and doing little to improve the situation to some on here but to me its just him doing what has worked for him in the past and what has given us unparalelled success (theres that relative word again) over the last couple of seasons.

A great measured post Vision. You are Stevie Coppell (meant in the nicest possible way) AICMFP...

[IMAMATEOFJOVSKY]

Partridge is totally right -

Players will not join us if we are not showing ambition - how many ways are there to show ambition?

Lets extend the stadium capacity - Now shelved

Lets pay premiership wages - Not happening

Would hate to think what guffaw Bugs is saying to players when TRYING to attract them to the club, when they ask what our future ambitions are ; Ah well we're building a new media centre that will be hardly used next season, we were planning to expand capacity but thats on the back burner, but we are going to be upgrading King Nero's leather seats in the directors box for French and Saunders and the other c list celebrities - - and well probably be disposing of our next batch of academy players to oblivion shortly too - please sign the contract here!

We have created our own monster and that is why we will only attract foreign players/lower league players and not premiership players to this club - additionally, that is why some of our current crop are holding back on committing their future to the club

We've been found out this season, and yes, we have done the 2nd season syndrome proud!

[Archie's penalty]

Partridge is totally right -

Lets pay premiership wages - Not happening

Uh what is 25,000 a week to Doyle and Hunt if not premiership wages?

We have created our own monster

That is quite frankly a ridiculous statement...

[IMAMATEOFJOVSKY]

Compare our wage bill to all the other premiership clubs and divide it by the number of squad players - its not happening and therefore not ridiculous!!

[Alan Partridge]

Vision does make a lot of valid points. I nodded along to a lot of it. One thing though, I read a piece from Coppell that he wouldn't look at short term transfer solutions I would ask why not? Was Duberry not a stop gap because Sonko was out long term? But I digress.

How would making a series of short term signings that would aid us in the PRESENT in keeping us up? He may feel that Kebe, Fae, Rosenior may be excellent players in 2 -3 years time, but what good are they to us now? If the club are as desperate as they say they are to stay in this league then surely signing a couple of players either till the end of the season or on loan, for the short term of keeping us here would ahve been wise? could reasses at the end of the season and bring these guys like Fae through.

All this 'for the future' stuff isn't helping us as we slide to our 7th straight defeat.

Otherwise Vision your post is very valid.

[Vision]

Vision does make a lot of valid points. I nodded along to a lot of it. One thing though, I read a piece from Coppell that he wouldn't look at short term transfer solutions I would ask why not? Was Duberry not a stop gap because Sonko was out long term? But I digress.

How would making a series of short term signings that would aid us in the PRESENT in keeping us up? He may feel that Kebe, Fae, Rosenior may be excellent players in 2 -3 years time, but what good are they to us now? If the club are as desperate as they say they are to stay in this league then surely signing a couple of players either till the end of the season or on loan, for the short term of keeping us here would ahve been wise? could reasses at the end of the season and bring these guys like Fae through.

All this 'for the future' stuff isn't helping us as we slide to our 7th straight defeat.

Otherwise Vision your post is very valid.

The point I'm making is that very rarely do Coppell signings actually come in and make an immediate impact anyway. Even if you or i think the likes of Cahill,Taylor or O'neill would have done so, the manager himself doesn't .. He stated as much in the case of Cahill. Duberry was (and still is) a stopgap and at 800k has proved to be a decent one but thats a huge difference to paying 5m+ for Cahill who lets be honest is no more proven in the Premiership than Sonko and Ingimarsson were last season.

FWIW i think Rosenior should be playing right back now but then that still comes down to my belief that Coppell's mistakes this season have been in not utilising his squad to its full potential rather than not spending the money that is available to him which is what most seem to think..

The truth is its just pure conjecture on both our parts because we'll never know one way or another if we'd have done better with either approach as the manager has decided to do things his way. What he's acheived with this club so far says to me he's earned that right.

[Archie's penalty]

Vision does make a lot of valid points. I nodded along to a lot of it. One thing though, I read a piece from Coppell that he wouldn't look at short term transfer solutions I would ask why not? Was Duberry not a stop gap because Sonko was out long term? But I digress.

How would making a series of short term signings that would aid us in the PRESENT in keeping us up? He may feel that Kebe, Fae, Rosenior may be excellent players in 2 -3 years time, but what good are they to us now? If the club are as desperate as they say they are to stay in this league then surely signing a couple of players either till the end of the season or on loan, for the short term of keeping us here would ahve been wise? could reasses at the end of the season and bring these guys like Fae through.

All this 'for the future' stuff isn't helping us as we slide to our 7th straight defeat.

Otherwise Vision your post is very valid.

The point I'm making is that very rarely do Coppell signings actually come in and make an immediate impact anyway. Even if you or i think the likes of Cahill,Taylor or O'neill would have done so, the manager himself doesn't .. He stated as much in the case of Cahill. Duberry was (and still is) a stopgap and at 800k has proved to be a decent one but thats a huge difference to paying 5m+ for Cahill who lets be honest is no more proven in the Premiership than Sonko and Ingimarsson were last season.

FWIW i think Rosenior should be playing right back now but then that still comes down to my belief that Coppell's mistakes this season have been in not utilising his squad to its full potential rather than not spending the money that is available to him which is what most seem to think..

The truth is its just pure conjecture on both our parts because we'll never know one way or another as the manager has decided to do things his way. Which lets face it, his record with us dictates is the right way.

I think we are in a position to start picking up points now (whether we will or not is another matter). We have a full squad what with all our players back from injury and the ACN (apart from Little of course). We have found a centre back in Cisse who I think will form a great partnership with Sonko (who looked lean, mean and on his game against Everton). We have Matejovsky who looks promising and confident in his own ability and thus Harper has a competent midfield partner for the first time this year.

My only query is, like you Vision, should Coppell be playing Rosenior or not. On a minor scale there is the Doyle/Lita quandary. I think Murty has been playing ok. Against Villa I would play Rosenior but can you drop your captain?

[Southbank Old Boy]

The point I'm making is that very rarely do Coppell signings actually come in and make an immediate impact anyway....FWIW i think Rosenior should be playing right back now but then that still comes down to my belief that Coppell's mistakes this season have been in not utilising his squad to its full potential rather than not spending the money that is available to him which is what most seem to think..

I agree we don't see many of Coppell's signings come in and set the world on fire (although it could be argued that the likes of Duberry, Gunnarsson, Doyle, Lita, Long, Ingimasson and Kitson all did excatly that) and that a lot of the issues this year seem to be because Coppell is being so loyal to his old guard. Is it just the case that Coppell needs time to mould players into the role he needs them to play, or is it that he won't give his new players a chance because he hasn't convinced himself their good enough when he signs them?

It's a bit of a mystery, although I'm not sure he's any different to anyother manager in that sense, as those players I've mentioned above all made a pretty immediate impact.

Which rather begs the question how come last season they only survived by the skin of their teeth on the last day and this season they are only one point ahead of us when we are supposed to be failing so miserably.

It does make me laugh when people assume that just because a certain team approahes something in a certain way and is successful ( a relative concept in itself) that it means that if we approached it in the same way we would be equally successful.

Equally just because clubs such as Ipswich, Leeds, Bradford and Birmingham went down having spend a lot of money trying to get to the supposed "next level" doesn't follow that it would be the same for us. Its not simply about money spent, if it were the league tables would be decided before a ball is kicked.

You do what works best for your club and what you believe in. we don't have a manager (such as a Rednapp for example) who has a track record for bringing in a lot of personnel and getting them to gel quickly. What Coppell is good at is developing and nurturing a team spirit and togetherness by gradually building a team. He is not and never has been a man to throw money at a situation. I'm not convinced that spending 15m+ on the 3 or 4 players that consistently get mentioned on here would have us in any better a position than we are now.

That may seem like he's burying his head in the sand and doing little to improve the situation to some on here but to me its just him doing what has worked for him in the past and what has given us unparalelled success (theres that relative word again) over the last couple of seasons.

and

And where has that "calibre" and "experience" got them? (not to mention the money it cost).

The original point was that other clubs, and Wigan was the example given, could find players to bring in. Obviously it's a bit of a case of horses for courses because all clubs situations are different, but perhaps the question should be where would they be without adding those players?

We have areas in our team that we probably wanted to strengthen. We didn't even though we're told that funds were available etc etc, I was just agreeing that other teams seem to be able to get players in when they feel they need to. We just seem to huff and puff then say there wasn't anyone willing to come to little old Reading.