Hard to see any progress for the forseeable future

[Thaumagurist*]

So, Woodcote, you're admitting that you were wrong about Coppell, unlike Schards who refuses to admit he was wrong?

[Woodcote Royal]

My fears about Steve Coppell concerned his ability to learn from past mistakes. I wasn't prepared to watch a repeat of last season's favourites getting picked regardless of results and performance. As long as he was prepared to re-assess his approach, the man who got us to the promised land always deserved a chance to put things right.

I still see his refusal to replace Shorey until he'd left as a major error that saw us lose at Charlton and drop other points with Hunt at left back but, who could deny how well he has done since those first few games of the season?

Only those who start threads like this and refuse to back down.

I'm currently beside myself with joy at how well this season is shapng up

[Millsy]

I apologise for coming into this thread late - you must all be bord of it by now I'm sure.

A slightly new point by me therefore is that I honestly dont see much progress being made beyond what we achieved in the Prem so far unless there are changes of attitude made if we go up. If we go up only to have a pathetic wage structure, no real interest in signing decent ppl when needed etc then I will be sceptical. We have to learn form our mistakes.

As for Schards not apologising well that's his issue. I've no interest in defending her/him or gloating. The wrongness of the original post does its own talking but the broad concept of progression remains an issue whether s/he meant that or not.

[Sun Tzu]

If we go up only to have a pathetic wage structure, no real interest in signing decent ppl when needed etc then I will be sceptical. We have to learn form our mistakes.
.

I'm not sure about the wage structure. We've got players on very decent money, and in at least one case a player who on the face of it has decided he's happy with his money DESPITE knowing that some very major teams would be after him.

We also know that what we've paid our top players is actually not that out of line with what established senior players at some other clubs are earning.

We've also got to find the answer to the question about where the money comes from to suddenly pay players 100k a week (or even 50k)

[Thaumagurist*]

If we go up only to have a pathetic wage structure,

Do you really think we can afford to have a ridiculous wage structure that we cannot sustain?

[Ian Royal]

I apologise for coming into this thread late - you must all be bord of it by now I'm sure.

A slightly new point by me therefore is that I honestly dont see much progress being made beyond what we achieved in the Prem so far unless there are changes of attitude made if we go up. If we go up only to have a pathetic wage structure, no real interest in signing decent ppl when needed etc then I will be sceptical. We have to learn form our mistakes.

As for Schards not apologising well that's his issue. I've no interest in defending her/him or gloating. The wrongness of the original post does its own talking but the broad concept of progression remains an issue whether s/he meant that or not.

Progress is not necessarily bettering our best ever league finish. Progress would be establishing ourself as a yoyo club, compared to what we've previously been.

In all situations there are peaks and troughs. Each time we've had a peak our trough has not been as low as the previous one. So far our peaks have pretty much all been better than the last one. That doesn't mean we're not making progress if that doesn't happen this time. If the next few seasons end up as:

2nd, 14th, 16th, 19th is progress. Equally, 2nd, 19th, 3rd (play off winners) 16th would also be progress for the club. It's building a platform where we can better 8th.

At the moment any finish like that is a lucky one off, no matter how deserved.

[Arch]

If we go up only to have a pathetic wage structure,

Do you really think we can afford to have a ridiculous wage structure that we cannot sustain?

Pathetic/ridiculous; pathetic/ridiculous... it's so hard to decide. I don't envy Sir John.

[Arch]

Well, anyway, I'm pretty much done with this thread. Might as well sum up my analysis of it - since all 76 pages are replete with drivel I feel entitled to dump one last effluence into it.

After we lost to Ipswich we had 7 point from five games and had been well beaten twice (albeit by teams who were sure to be "there or thereabouts" this season ). There were broadly three ways things could go: we could get worse and end up in a relegation scrap; we could muck along in mid-table mediocrity; we could improve and get into the promotion mix. Schards could not see the latter without a "sea change". As it happens (as it's happened before), modest adjustments were all that were required to bring the team together and rise above the dross. So his vision was wrong - no need to apogise (which is just silly) and up to him whether he admits it. There's been a good amount of goalpost moving about what constitutes progress, but surely in the context it meant getting to regular winning ways, being one of the best in the division and competing for promotion.

I think the reason the thread has lasted is because it became symbolic. Apart from 05-06 and to some extent 06-07, there have always been people on the board who insisted the Madejski-Coppell business approach was wrong and doomed, and people who saw a long-term trend in every reverse - the STGs. Part of being an RTG is keeping the faith when things go badly. So this thread became about vindicated faith for many people.

And thus endeth the lesson.

[Royal With Cheese]

It's building a platform where we can better 8th.

Ian, don't taqke this the wrong way but the absolute best we can hope for is mid-table Premiership. It's a nice ambition to shoot for Europe but, on a regular basis, this just isn't going to happen. Anyone who thinks we're building a platform for european football is getting a bit carried away.

2WW1WC. The original comments were that:

1) We will remain a mid table Championship club unless Madejski and Coppell go and

2) Football played by Reading this season has been dull and uninspiring

My personal take on this was that the original post was a knee jerk reaction to the Ipswich game (by all accounts, dull and uninspiring) but what has been worse is the failure to admit that there is a possibility that he's wrong - coupled with some rediculous after the event betting claims has made for enjoyable reading.

[The 17 Bus]

PS. I'm sure Wolves fans are delighted that there team is still in the FA Cup.

So would we be if our third round game had been postponed, this means absolutely feck all.

[Royal With Cheese]

PS. I'm sure Wolves fans are delighted that there team is still in the FA Cup.

So would we be if our third round game had been postponed, this means absolutely feck all.

Rubbish. They've now got a mid-week game and a game on Saturday night. A chance to pick up injuries, suspensions and generally knacker themselves out for the tricky trip to Bristol City. I expect them not to win the City game.

[weybridgewanderer]

charlton fans wanted "progress"

they decided curbishly had taken them as far as they could and looked for change

....

[UrbieG]

charlton fans wanted "progress"

they decided curbishly had taken them as far as they could and looked for change

....

Quite.
I'll wager that this won't prevent, promotion or not, people saying the same about SC /JM before May.

[The 17 Bus]

PS. I'm sure Wolves fans are delighted that there team is still in the FA Cup.

So would we be if our third round game had been postponed, this means absolutely feck all.

Rubbish. They've now got a mid-week game and a game on Saturday night. A chance to pick up injuries, suspensions and generally knacker themselves out for the tricky trip to Bristol City. I expect them not to win the City game.

err exactly, it is not the fault of Wolves that they are still in the cup and having to play tomorrow, i feel sure that playing on the original date would have been better, win or lose.

Thought you would have got what i meant you old cheese you.

[seahawk10]

Well, anyway, I'm pretty much done with this thread. Might as well sum up my analysis of it - since all 76 pages are replete with drivel I feel entitled to dump one last effluence into it.

After we lost to Ipswich we had 7 point from five games and had been well beaten twice (albeit by teams who were sure to be "there or thereabouts" this season ). There were broadly three ways things could go: we could get worse and end up in a relegation scrap; we could muck along in mid-table mediocrity; we could improve and get into the promotion mix. Schards could not see the latter without a "sea change". As it happens (as it's happened before), modest adjustments were all that were required to bring the team together and rise above the dross. So his vision was wrong - no need to apogise (which is just silly) and up to him whether he admits it. There's been a good amount of goalpost moving about what constitutes progress, but surely in the context it meant getting to regular winning ways, being one of the best in the division and competing for promotion.

I think the reason the thread has lasted is because it became symbolic. Apart from 05-06 and to some extent 06-07, there have always been people on the board who insisted the Madejski-Coppell business approach was wrong and doomed, and people who saw a long-term trend in every reverse - the STGs. Part of being an RTG is keeping the faith when things go badly. So this thread became about vindicated faith for many people.

And thus endeth the lesson.

Well summed up! Although you are wrong on one point, you will never be finished with this thread. It has been one of the most interesting threads on HNA that last few months. It's the thread that just keeps on giving. And you are correct, schards doesn't need to apologise for a thread written on an internet forum supporting his favorite football club. He doesn't even have to admit he was wrong (which he was). All of us have been wrong before and will be again. The fact that he was passionate enough about his (and our) club to make such an emotional post calling for change is actually a good thing. People love this club and I am proud to be associated with the club and the supporters and there is nowt wrong with that.

[Rex]

This thread will run and run. What about the potential after and during the closed season.

Debate on any of the new signings
Will we get into the top spot
Will we get automatic promotion
Will Coppell go Y/N
If he stays what investment will be needed
Who will go/stay
Will a fire sale begin.

And so on.

[Millsy]

do aliens exist?

[Elliott]

We've signed Hreidarsson!!

[Royal With Cheese]

Thought you would have got what i meant you old cheese you.

Err, no not really. Do I deserve a whooooosh? I know it's not Wolves' fault their game was postponed. The general point is that not being in the FA Cup will/is directly affecting our chances of promotion and damaging both Wolves and Birmingham. It's really taking a side swipe at anyone stupid enough to think that should be our priority this season. The same people who think Hunt is rubbish and that we should sack Coppell. I think this forum is infected with Swindon fans.

[rg6royal]

We've signed Hreidarsson!!

Source?