Shane Long

[Archie's penalty]

In one way I would like to see Long start for the rest of the season, just so we can see Snowball is so utterly wrong in his assessment of Long. Unfortunately that would mean we'd probably fail to make the Play offs, so I guess it's for the best he won't.

I think Snowball has a bit of a problem. I'd enjoy his posts a lot more if they weren't cram packed full of completely superfluous statistics all the time.

Less is more.

Maybe so. The team bored arguments are boring me at the moment though. We need February to come.

[Snowball]

Long grabs the odd goal. When he comes on as a sub and doesn't score, the impact of him not doing so is less. // You make this statistical claim that Long scores a goal every 2.2 games he plays, yet your own stats show that his rate is 1 goal every 4 games when he has started for Reading. And that's the crux of it. When he has started, Long has proven, in the main, to be relative ineffective. // Does that 'prove' he plays worse when he starts? No, it doesn't, but it illustrates the impact that is relatively poor scoring record can have on the team as a whole.

That's a tad unfair as he plays less minutes even when he does start
Just as Noel Hunt often comes off early, usually for Long.

If Shane starting has a bad effect on the team, why do we not imp[rove when he goes off?

Only ONCE in his career has Reading improved its point-count after Shane left the field.
That was a game where we were drawing 0-0 and Lita scored two late goals.
He's a negative influence, yet only ONCE in all his 20 starts have points be gained after he went off. Just 1/20 times. Fact


Doyle average 86 minutes per match when he starts.
Near as dammit the full 90 minutes and he started all 28 games

Long averages 73 minutes per match when he starts (3 times this season)

After Long has gone off in games we've scored 9 but conceded 6

When he has started, while he's been on we've scored 23 conceded 23 (3.17 goals "per minute"(in 19 games))

Last year we scored a whopping 38% of our goals in the last 15 minutes, the highest percentage in that league

Shane only started 3 of those games. but he came on as sub TWENTY times, mostly in that last 10-20 minutes
when 38% of our goals were scored!! So we were 3 times more likely to score when Shane came on!

[Snowball]

I think Snowball has a bit of a problem. I'd enjoy his posts a lot more if they weren't cram packed full of completely superfluous statistics all the time.


But that's because I'm arguing with clowns who think just saying something is proof. Mere opinion means squat.

Facts. Stats, the manager's assessment, that's what matters.

According to many on this list we have useless, too-slow centrebacks, one CM who is useless and runs around just waving his arms,
the other CM who can win ball but can't pass, a left winger who is over-rated and useless except at dead-balls, a right-winger
who is a complete waste-of-space and "just falls over". Both fullbacks have been called "ordinary at best".

Oh and Coppell is a numpty (of course) and the owner never sends any money (of course)

Only the keeper and Kevin-Noel are decent players (according to too many)

Yet we are second in the league, won at Wolves (top), Birmingham (3rd), Sheffield (4th)
have scored more goals than any other team, have the best goal-difference in the league.

You people need a few years watching Newport County!


When people mutter and make things up as they go along, I turn to facts. 75% of the stuff written on HNA is laughable

Fact. His goals per minute overall equates to 1 goal every 2.2 games.
Fact. In the Championship, when he has started, we have never lost (W3 D1)
Fact. Though he has started 20 times and only scored 5, he has only averaged 73 minutes (against Doyle's 86) so that 6+ goals in fairness

5 in 20 not that hot? It equates to 12 goals in a championship season
6 in 20 not that hot? It equates to 14 goals in a championship season

Fact. He has clearly gained us four points this year alone (Saints and Norwich) despite hardly ever starting.

[Dirk Gently]

Whilst I agree with what Snowball says, overall, all the stats in the world can't answer the question of "Would someone else playing in his place have done even better?"

[Snowball]

Whilst I agree with what Snowball says, overall, all the stats in the world can't answer the question of "Would someone else playing in his place have done even better?"

Ronaldo would

Tevez would

[Platypuss]

But seriously how does anyone break into a forward line like Doyle-Hunt?

By being better on the pitch? He had the opportunity.

Long started in preference to Hunt against Palace and Ipswich. From the following Shef weds game onwards NHunt was first choice of the two. Why was that?

Anyway, if Coppell thought Long was as good as you do, why did he buy Noel Hunt in the first place?

Choosing to ignore this one, too?

[Baines]

Whilst I agree with what Snowball says, overall, all the stats in the world can't answer the question of "Would someone else playing in his place have done even better?"

Ronaldo would

Tevez would

I'll need to see some stats to back that up plz.

[Riskit for a biscuit]

I agree he's not a championship player. He's a premiership player

You merely saying "he's not good enough" don't make it so. Based on his goals/game, he's better than Lita
and if Lita was clearly out-scoring Long on goals per game you'd be screaming it from the rooftops

If he's a premiership player, why can't he earn an extended run in the first team of a CHAMPIONSHIP club?

NOT pacy? What planet are you on? Exactly how did he get his 11 league goals again? Did the opposition fall over?

SC thinks he's both pacy and strong.

I'm on Earth, last time I checked. He scores headers from set pieces mostly, and this is often a result of lack-luster defending/an excellent delivery. He's not strong or pacey at all, he gets muscled off the ball easily because he's built like a 12-year old. Just watch him next time he's on the ball; he won't have the confidence to shoot himself, if he has the pace to beat defenders, I have never seen him use it.

And yet in 20 actual league starts (some when he was just 18) Long has scored 11 goals and 4 assists. Strange that.
Maybe the opposition sucked the ball into the net. (Remember Lita has scored just 20 in 57 starts (+21)


Where does "Lita contributes to the team" come from when the official club statistics
list him as just 7 assists in FOUR seasons? And at Swansea his selfishness cost us a draw.

Lita at least has the awareness to attempt to link up plays and lay off long balls to the wingers. Again, watch him. His ability to pass and manipulate a football is far superior to Long's. Please note that I'm not saying Lita is a world-class footballer, but he's considerably better than Long.

Using stats to try and prove an argument is fine, but they are easily manipulated, it iss not the de facto end to an argument that you seem to think it is.

[Snowball]

I'll need to see some stats to back that up plz.


Will, "Ronaldo is European Footballer of the Year & World Footballer of the Year" be OK?

[Baines]

But if Shlong had been given the chances that Cronaldo's been given...

[Snowball]

He scores headers from set pieces mostly

Does he, now?

11 League goals. 6 shots, 5 headers... so not even mostly headers

His header at Derby was from a header-on by Sidwell

His header HOME to Derby was from a Murty cross in open play

His header against Wigan was from a Hunt cross in open play

His header against Norwich was from a Henry cross in open play

His header against Saints was from a Duberry knock-down


So, you say MOST of his goals are headers from set-pieces, yet when we check the FACTS it turns out he scored six goals with his feet,
three goals from headers from crosses in open play, and the two that he scored in less-than-fully-open play were NOT direct from free-kicks

In other words NONE of his goals were scored by headers direct from free-kicks.

NONE does not equal "MOST"


DERBY Header

Little and sub John Oster continued to probe and look for a telling cross from the flanks but the equaliser came with only three minutes remaining through Long. Shorey's right-sided corner evaded everyone in the box and Sidwell floated a hopeful header at the far post back across the face of goal, where the young Irishman rose highest to finish with a header from only a yard out and level the scores at 2-2.

DERBY Header & Shot, plus assist

The Royals were running riot, and sub Shane Long thumped home a superb header from Graeme Murty's brilliant cross.

Another great move on 80 minutes saw Reading stream forward, and Oster hit the post when clean through after Long's unselfish pass.

Long added his second of the game, with Hunt playing him in after the ball was well won by Sidwell. It was a neat finish by the youngster after his first touch seem to take him wide. At the same moment, news filtered through that Sheffield United had equalised.

SHEFF UTD SHOT

Sidwell was in on goal but got crowded out, only for the United clearance to bounce straight off him and into Shane Long's path. He tucked home off the post, and celebrated his first Premiership goal by claterring into mascot Kingsley!

WIGAN Header

It came out to Hunt, and he stood up a cross to the back post where Long rose brilliantly over David Unsworth to nod home.

Man City SHOT

The much-threatened opening goal came after 61 minutes and it was made in Ireland. Hahnemann's long ball was flicked on by Long, and Doyle did brilliantly to hold off Michael Ball on the left wing before delivering a pinpoint low cross to Long who sidefooted home from ten yards.

Pompey “Shot”

Then, Reading had a third with 12 minutes left. Harper hit a cracker from the edge of the box, and it was deflected by sub Shane Long on its way past James. Pompey screamed for offside, but the linesman correctly kept his flag down.

NEWCASTLE (shot)

Shane Long came on for the tireless Lita, and immediately went upfield as Shorey prepared to take a free kick in his own half.

The delivery aimed for Sonko, and he battled for a header. It fell loose to Long, who chested then rifled just inside the post with his second touch. A fantastic introduction for the young Irishman, and for a second it looked like it had got away with him, but he rifled home for a vital goal.

NORWICH Header and wins a penalty

It was not quite desperation time, but we were hugely relieved when winning and scoring a penalty on 84 minutes. Long battled with City skipper Mark Fotheringham inside the area, and the Canary tried to get his arm in front of our striker, but instead saw the ball hit him on the upper part of his arm for a penalty, a pretty soft one at that.

Fotheringham may have had a case for a nudge in the back from Shane, but referee Trevor Kettle judged in our favour. Stephen Hunt stepped up, and keeper David Marshall got a hand on it when diving right but thankfully it snuck in.

Then the result was quickly out of sight when we added a second. Henry did really well to take possession and get out wide, then whipped in a fabulous cross, matched by a cracking header from Long at the near post.

BURNLEY shot

Burnley boss Owen Coyle made a couple of changes, but Ivar Ingimarsson and the effortless Andre Bikey always looked in command, and the game was wrapped up soon after when Doyle charged down the left and delivered a low cross perfectly into the stride of Long, who finished with ease.

SAINTS “Header”

With six minutes left, we had an equaliser. A free kick was knocked down by Duberry, and Long bravely got there to head home among a crowd of bodies. He clattered into 'keeper Davis but it was of no concern as he celebrated a vital goal.

5 Headers 6 shots

[Southbank Old Boy]

This guy is priceless!!!!

[Snowball]

Well, facts are facts, dearie. I just like bursting bubbles with sharp facts.

This place is 90% piss and wind. Opinion posted as fact most of the time

Only Doyle, Noel, and either keeper are apparently half-decent. This lot say it so it must be true.

Harpur, League 1 player? Yeah, right.


Oh and "Wolves are an average team in a bad league"

but we are five points below them.

So are we a below-average team?


As I say, piss and wind.

[Platypuss]

But seriously how does anyone break into a forward line like Doyle-Hunt?

By being better on the pitch? He had the opportunity.

Long started in preference to Hunt against Palace and Ipswich. From the following Shef weds game onwards NHunt was first choice of the two. Why was that?

Anyway, if Coppell thought Long was as good as you do, why did he buy Noel Hunt in the first place?

Choosing to ignore this one, too?

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.

[Southbank Old Boy]

That would be great if your facts actually meant anything

As Dirk and plenty of others have said, it all counts for very little when you cant know what would've happened if so and so played instead

Long has done ok to be fair to him. He's not improved much since he's been here but he has a decent knack of scoring goals when its all instinctive and he doesnt have to think about it

Ask him to do any more than that though and he struggles, as anyone who's actually spent a bit of time watching him play will testify. Your impressive array of analysis doesnt come close to actually saying how many times he didnt do as well as you'd one of our forwards would do in a given situation, and how many times he's looked out of his depth against just half decent defenders

[working class hero]

Long has been loyal and shown a good attitude.

Lita has been a prize tosser.

And over the last couple of seasons Long has been about 3 times as prolific.

'Nuff said.

[seahawk10]

Snowball is on a roll. I like Shane Long too, but think he is in the correct role right now. Impact sub.

[Gordons Cumming]

Talk about dissect a player.

[Snowball]

I'm dissecting the list

[Ian Royal]

Stats are very useful, but you need more than just stats to show anything

And I'm sorry, but yours are dredging the bottom of the barrell.