Madejski Out and I mean Out

[MR. CYNICAL]

Completely agree with Mr Meldrew.
What frustrates me is the word 'transition' .
Don't remember Mr Madejski using it during the season ticket renewal period!!
In fact i can't remember him using it at all.

[philM]

I started worrying when JM spoke on the radio about the "obscene" wages in the Prem. You don't hear other owners moaning in public about that, you pay the price if you want to play with the big boys and thats it.

I suspect he has now set a salary cap and given the green light to get rid of anyone who is above that level (if they won't take a reduction in pay!). I also suspect that is causing major problems in trying to attract quality proven players.

The level of that salary cap is probably average for mid table Championship sides and that is where we will stay, or lower. When JM said that he wouldn't pay Prem level salaries he was basically quitting the chase.

[Sir Dodger Royal]

Hi
If all you RTGs want to know where the money has gone then SDR will provide you with access to the information.

Give me a couple days for the real facts. SDR is on the case.

[Royal Lady]

Club policies - Fan's Buyout - end of page 1 a copy of the most recent accounts. Top of Page 2 me asking why a loan by Madejski for the hotel expansion of £17 million is showing in the football club accounts. No responses.

I don't understand accounting, but I find it hard to see how during the season we finished 8th we had no overdraft, allegedly, yet by the end of the relegation season we had a £6 million overdraft, an £8 million "loan" to the football club by Madejski outstanding and more than double that for the hotel. I do understand that there is such a company as RFC holdings or whatever, but I would really like to see a set of accounts for the Football Club in isolation. Even the staff costs etc include hotel staff. Why?

[Handsome Man]

Hi
If all you RTGs want to know where the money has gone then SDR will provide you with access to the information.

Give me a couple days for the real facts. SDR is on the case.

Wages?

[Sir Dodger Royal]

Well you may be right but let SDR get at the facts.

[ankeny]

At present at the rate he is going we could be back where he came in. Firstly he is not investing and secondly he can't walk away because he owns the bloody club.

As usual he is all talk and no action. If he really wanted to sell the Club at a sensible price then that can be arranged. The problem is he wants to scam any new buyers in the same way as he has for the past three seasons scammed RFC fans. Those are the facts. Real Facts.

You know SDR is spot on as usual. Get reallllllllllllllllllll

Spot on SDR,only problem is most of this lot cant see it .He has replaced all our assets with kids and kept a few old guys we cant sell hoping we cant see the join.The clique on here will treat us with scorn but we are right.Get your maps out for Hartlepool if things dont change because him and the pipsqueak thought they could get Smith on the cheap but Watford would not play ball,I dont blame them.Now we got a hopeless Yes man for a manager,the other hundred people applying must have had to much ambition.The sooner Madj and his lapdogs get out the better

[Royalupnorth]

I haven't read every post here, so if I am just saying something that has been said previoulsy then I apologise.

Last season we DID finish 4th, as many have said. But the last 2 months or so were not pretty, and goal scoring was a problem. In fact the stats are not much better than now.
That was with the squad that we have lost.

I am bitterly disappointed by the downturn, but we do not know what has caused it. Last season some were crying out to get rid of an increasingly ineffective Hunt, an error ridden USA and Doyles goals had dried up too.
It seems much more likely to me that the downturn is nothing to do with players in and out, but more to do with the club just not showing any ambition, and that filtering through to the players. Could it be that goal bonuses have been slashed? Win bonuses? Or just a club that asks the players to do "just enough".

My team has lost its drive.
It makes me sad

[Royal Lady]

Can NO-ONE explain to me about the accounts???

[Northern Git]

Can NO-ONE explain to me about the accounts???

RL I will ahve a go when I have recovered from my horrendous hangover - if I try and look through the figures now my eyeballs may well fall out

[Rev Algenon Stickleback H]

WR is right, the banks see we haven't got massive revenue streams and have now called in the overdraft. If you lent money to someone who had a 30k a year job and suddenly they were on 10k, wouldn't you want your money back sooner rather then later?

where did the overdraft come from?

The club figures show we didn't have one at all in 2006/7, yet it was £7 million the following year. We made a £6 million profit in both of those seasons.

Player bonuses, signings, new media centre. Could be any number of things

You misunderstand.

How can we get a £7 million overdraft in the same season that we made a £6 million profit?

[Forbury Lion]

Can NO-ONE explain to me about the accounts???

Send me copies and I have a crack at interpreting them.

A theory is that the accounts looked better when they were after a buyer, Now they're not after a buyer the picture looks less rosey. Could be for tax reasons as that's linked to profits.

[Franchise FC]

Player bonuses, signings, new media centre. Could be any number of things

You misunderstand.

How can we get a £7 million overdraft in the same season that we made a £6 million profit?

Because cash and profit are NOT the same thing.

[Northern Git]

Club policies - Fan's Buyout - end of page 1 a copy of the most recent accounts. Top of Page 2 me asking why a loan by Madejski for the hotel expansion of £17 million is showing in the football club accounts. No responses.

I don't understand accounting, but I find it hard to see how during the season we finished 8th we had no overdraft, allegedly, yet by the end of the relegation season we had a £6 million overdraft, an £8 million "loan" to the football club by Madejski outstanding and more than double that for the hotel. I do understand that there is such a company as RFC holdings or whatever, but I would really like to see a set of accounts for the Football Club in isolation. Even the staff costs etc include hotel staff. Why?

Right feeling a bit better now.

The accounts are for RFC Holdings PLC. These numbers are a combination of Reading Football Club Limited and Millenium Madejski Hotels.

As ever with bland figures like these they are not very revealing. You would need to get hold of the Football clubs individual accounts and, more specifically, the management accounts to fully understand the figures.

Few points are plain though.

JM has not increased his personnel financial support of RFC (or the Hotel) in the years covered by these figures. This would indicate that the Media Centre and the Hotel extension were funded by external sources.

JM and his fellow directors did not draw any salary from the club during this period. Interestingly this means that Nicky Hammond is a Director in name only (unless he is working for free)

JM is accumulating interest on his loans to the Club and Hotel. It is a bit tricky to see if he taking any of this accruing interest, but the total interest debt to him increased by £391,230 in our last Premier season. A total of £1,183,929 was paid out in 'interest and other charges' during this period. As JM is by far the biggest creditor RFC Holdings has I would think that he received a substantial part of this, but again it is impossible to say from these figures.

It is not possible to say from these numbers what the £6,932.994 overdraft was used for (again you world need to see the management accounts.). It is normally a very expensive way of borrowing cash so I would think it is unlikely to be used for long term projects such as the Hotel extension or the Media centre. I understand that RFC Holdings had to pay back a considerable part of this on relegation to the Championship (not shown on these figures of course).

Neither the club or hotel paid any non employee related tax during the period. They did of course pay NI contributions etc. for the staff .

There is no way to tell if the Directors charged any management fees for their services.
There is no way to see the extent of inter company trading between RFC holdings and other Madejski owned companies, such as Benham Goodhead Group who print the programmes etc.
It is not possible to say if RFC holdings are being charged for the use of Hogwood Training ground, and if so who is the owner of the property.

Sorry I cannot enlighten you any more - but get me the management accounts and we would be able to see precisely whats going on.

As for how you can get an overdraft when you made a profit - easy! An overdraft is simply a loan. It tends to be non specific so is used for day to day cash needs and negates the company having to take out many smaller loans. They will have agreed a overdraft limit with a bank and can operate within this limit as and when they see fit. I believe this limit was slashed by the bank on relegation. You probably find out that the fees RFC gained from the sale of Kitson, Sonko and Shorey were used to pay this back. The perils of having no JM cash to back us up I am afraid!

[Franchise FC]

Actually i do feel that iv'e been scammed. All the money i have put into RFC over the last 20 years will not be payed back to me yet the greedy chairman wants back everything he has put in ..... doesn't seem right to me

The difference being that when he put vast sums into the club he had no guarantee of getting the money back. The fact that we have progressed so far that he may actually be able to do so is remarkably rare in football

[strap]

No one is calling for boom or bust tactics like Leeds had and I'd be the first to speak up if we were paying the like of Seth Johnson £37k a week!

But it doesn't take Carol Vorderman to work out that we've brought in a phenonemal amount of dough since 05/06 - including now as we're in our last season of parachute payments - and where has it been invested ? Nice new media centre which will be great for the local hacks to use when crowds dip below 10k again!!

I fully agree that investment is needed - but there is a big difference between prudent investment and the sort of panic buying that some people are baying for.

So presumably you will agree then that BR suddenly spending £xMill in the final week of the transfer window when:
a)most of the attractive buys have already been snapped up,
b)clubs know we're desperate and will hike prices
c) we end up buyin fot the sake of it
is piss poor management ?

What should have happened is that
i)a sensible assessment is made of the inherited squad
ii)those ear-marked for moving on (SHunt, Bikey, Doyle, Harper etc) immediately discounted from the squad - and any apps they subsequently make are sen as a bonus
iii)sensible targets identified at realistic prices, (rather than the nonsense shown with Smith), and negotiations commenced as soon as squads returned for pre-season

What actually happened was naivety (or greed) of the highest order.

let us hope we can somehow retain our presence in this division for next season, and actually use pre-season 2010-11 propoerly - and not the cheapskate version we have ben treated to for the past 5 years or so. We can safely ignore January's wiondow as thath has been shown to be for panic buying only, and we never spend anything significant then anyway.

Please find a buyer at a sensible price soon Mr Mad. You donlt want to be here, and the way thigs are going, the fans won't want you around in this mode for much longer.

You'll always make more money from your property ventures, so stick with them for the rest of your fortune building career.

Thanks for all your help!

[IMAMATEOFJOVSKY]

You're a weirdy.

I don't understand what you're saying? I'm more than happy to watch my club in League 1 again with real fans, passionate fans that you recognise at games, that support their club no matter what.

You're responding to FineRain who can't be arsed to go to games, yet has an awful lot to say.

If going down means we manage to clear out muppets like Finerain and TWYI then it wouldn't in any way be a disaster IMO.

if going down meant that you fooked off, it would be even better and would be well worth it ! Cock!

[Royal Lady]

Cheers Northern Git for your accounting explanations. So, am I correct in saying that when people on here go on about "we've" made a loss blah blah blah, they are, in fact, referring to RFC Holdings, which includes amongst other things the hotel, and not solely the football club. And does this mean that, actually, we're no nearer knowing where all the tv revenue and transfer money went as no-one appears to have had sight of the actual Reading Football Club accounts, rather the RFC Holdings accounts?

[IMAMATEOFJOVSKY]

He's using RFC money to support his activities in other areas - ie Hotel -shouldnt be allowed ....there is definitely underhand activity going on but Im sure he's got it well covered so it will never get rumbled

[Royal Lady]

This is what I am getting at - I want to see RFC accounts relating solely to the football club ins and outs. I'm not interested in the hotel at all. I am, however, very interested if I discover that a lot of the football club revenue was transferred over to the hotel or somewhere else.