Matt Mills

[JR]

Mills sat with the fans today. True fan's player. Could become a royal legend!

[Sun Tzu]

At the moment referees make mistakes that have a huge impact on the game and their apologists (other referees like you, for instance ) accuse others, like me, of ignorance for criticizing a system that consistently uses the appeal system as an extension of the respect campaign

No, i point out your ignorance where you clearly have no idea what the Respect campaign is about. I accuse you of nothing. The appeals system has been around for donkey's years and there are more appeals now than ever and more decisions over turned (largely because the basis on which you CAN appeal has been widened greatly, in direct contrast to your view !

by not just upholding decisions that are clearly wrong but also punishing large numbers of clubs for merely having the brass neck to question decisions made by officials whose standards are often questionable to say the least.

Managers get punished not for criticising referees but for the place and way they do it.

I don't need to know chapter and verse of the current appeals system to know it isn't working and, frankly, I really don't give a toss about any county appeals you may have attended.

That's OK, you've made it clear you have no interest in the reality of what goes on, just on your partial and poor perception of it. That's your option.

As a fan, I'm pig sick of the condescension of people like you

That's OK, as a fan I'm pig sick of ignorant people who can't even be bothered to try and understand something before launching into criticism of it.

Believe it or not, the game wasn't invented for cr@p referees to eke out a comfortable living without the scutiny that would ensure they either improve or get replaced.

Indeed it wasn't. And luckily there is a system which heavily scrutinises the performance of officials. They just don;t publish the results in the Mail. And officials do improve and get replaced.

The primary function of any appeals system should be to correct as many wrong decisions as possible and that is clearly not the case at the moment.

That's not how the clubs use it though is it....
I agree that blatently wrong decisions of fact should, where possible, be corrected. However there is a limit to what can be done. You cannot give a goal that was wrongly disallowed, you cannot give a foul throw that was missed on the basis of appeal. You also cannot undermine the officials by using hindsight and endless TV replays to tidy up things you don;t like. It's a fundamental aspect of football that it is refereed according to the opinion of the referee. Therefore you can only criticise referees if you judge their decisions in context, from the position where they were when incidents occurred and by respecting that they are entitled to form an opinion that is different to yours.
You've got a fundamental problem with life if you think that you can sit down after a 90 minute game of football and set about 'correcting' every perceived error made by the officials. You'd kill the game.

[Murts-is-Lej]

Can you imagine how cr*p a referee would look if he made as many bad decisions in a game as most players do? In the players case they have to make the right decision in a split second and then have the skill to execute their decision. With a ref he gets the same split second to make the decision but the execution (blowing the whistle or not) doesn't take much skill!

When I'm ref'ing or line'ing and some nob gives me abuse for a poor decision my stock answer is "it's just possible that both you and I will make a mistake at some point in this match - I promise not to abuse you for c*cking up if you do the same for me - is that fair?" It's amazing how often that piece of logic shuts them up (or confuses them perhaps?)...

[Rax]

At the moment referees make mistakes that have a huge impact on the game and their apologists (other referees like you, for instance ) accuse others, like me, of ignorance for criticizing a system that consistently uses the appeal system as an extension of the respect campaign

No, i point out your ignorance where you clearly have no idea what the Respect campaign is about. I accuse you of nothing. The appeals system has been around for donkey's years and there are more appeals now than ever and more decisions over turned (largely because the basis on which you CAN appeal has been widened greatly, in direct contrast to your view !

by not just upholding decisions that are clearly wrong but also punishing large numbers of clubs for merely having the brass neck to question decisions made by officials whose standards are often questionable to say the least.

Managers get punished not for criticising referees but for the place and way they do it.

I don't need to know chapter and verse of the current appeals system to know it isn't working and, frankly, I really don't give a toss about any county appeals you may have attended.

That's OK, you've made it clear you have no interest in the reality of what goes on, just on your partial and poor perception of it. That's your option.

As a fan, I'm pig sick of the condescension of people like you

That's OK, as a fan I'm pig sick of ignorant people who can't even be bothered to try and understand something before launching into criticism of it.

Believe it or not, the game wasn't invented for cr@p referees to eke out a comfortable living without the scutiny that would ensure they either improve or get replaced.

Indeed it wasn't. And luckily there is a system which heavily scrutinises the performance of officials. They just don;t publish the results in the Mail. And officials do improve and get replaced.

The primary function of any appeals system should be to correct as many wrong decisions as possible and that is clearly not the case at the moment.

That's not how the clubs use it though is it....
I agree that blatently wrong decisions of fact should, where possible, be corrected. However there is a limit to what can be done. You cannot give a goal that was wrongly disallowed, you cannot give a foul throw that was missed on the basis of appeal. You also cannot undermine the officials by using hindsight and endless TV replays to tidy up things you don;t like. It's a fundamental aspect of football that it is refereed according to the opinion of the referee. Therefore you can only criticise referees if you judge their decisions in context, from the position where they were when incidents occurred and by respecting that they are entitled to form an opinion that is different to yours.
You've got a fundamental problem with life if you think that you can sit down after a 90 minute game of football and set about 'correcting' every perceived error made by the officials. You'd kill the game.

Sun - you're barking mad, how you can defend the standard of referreeing that we've had to endure this season is frankly laughable.

Oh, that's right, you're a referree too!

No wonder Mills lost what in my mind was a perfectly valid appeal - because of t****rs in the referreeing community spouting rubbish about respect when most haven't the balls to stand up and admit that the red card was wrong!

ZERO credibility.

[Sun Tzu]

Sun - you're barking mad, how you can defend the standard of referreeing that we've had to endure this season is frankly laughable.

I haven't said anything about the standard of refereeing. I've been highly critical of many refs this season. There have been what look to me like some very poor decisions. I'm a very low level, very infrequent ref but you'll find refs actually tend to be highly critical of other refs, they just don;t do it in public ! (yes, I am aware of a slight inconsistency from me on this point !!)

No wonder Mills lost what in my mind was a perfectly valid appeal - because of t****rs in the referreeing community spouting rubbish about respect when most haven't the balls to stand up and admit that the red card was wrong!

ZERO credibility.

And the 'respect' campaign doesn't come from the 'refereeing community'. It's an FA initiative and it's not just about basic deceny towards officials !!
I woudl agree the campaign has pretty low credibility, not least becasue very few managers or players have the brains to understand why it makes sense to behave decently on and off the pitch (not just towards officials).
Fergie's disgraceful comments about the Germans was as much a breach of the concept of Respect as were his comments about a referee being unfit to officiate or Mourinho's comments about Stephen Hunt....

[Woodcote Royal]

At the moment referees make mistakes that have a huge impact on the game and their apologists (other referees like you, for instance ) accuse others, like me, of ignorance for criticizing a system that consistently uses the appeal system as an extension of the respect campaign

No, i point out your ignorance where you clearly have no idea what the Respect campaign is about. I accuse you of nothing. The appeals system has been around for donkey's years and there are more appeals now than ever and more decisions over turned (largely because the basis on which you CAN appeal has been widened greatly, in direct contrast to your view !

by not just upholding decisions that are clearly wrong but also punishing large numbers of clubs for merely having the brass neck to question decisions made by officials whose standards are often questionable to say the least.

Managers get punished not for criticising referees but for the place and way they do it.

I don't need to know chapter and verse of the current appeals system to know it isn't working and, frankly, I really don't give a toss about any county appeals you may have attended.

That's OK, you've made it clear you have no interest in the reality of what goes on, just on your partial and poor perception of it. That's your option.

As a fan, I'm pig sick of the condescension of people like you

That's OK, as a fan I'm pig sick of ignorant people who can't even be bothered to try and understand something before launching into criticism of it.

Believe it or not, the game wasn't invented for cr@p referees to eke out a comfortable living without the scutiny that would ensure they either improve or get replaced.

Indeed it wasn't. And luckily there is a system which heavily scrutinises the performance of officials. They just don;t publish the results in the Mail. And officials do improve and get replaced.

The primary function of any appeals system should be to correct as many wrong decisions as possible and that is clearly not the case at the moment.

That's not how the clubs use it though is it....
I agree that blatently wrong decisions of fact should, where possible, be corrected. However there is a limit to what can be done. You cannot give a goal that was wrongly disallowed, you cannot give a foul throw that was missed on the basis of appeal. You also cannot undermine the officials by using hindsight and endless TV replays to tidy up things you don;t like. It's a fundamental aspect of football that it is refereed according to the opinion of the referee. Therefore you can only criticise referees if you judge their decisions in context, from the position where they were when incidents occurred and by respecting that they are entitled to form an opinion that is different to yours.
You've got a fundamental problem with life if you think that you can sit down after a 90 minute game of football and set about 'correcting' every perceived error made by the officials. You'd kill the game.

There's always a "limit" to what "can be done" That limit rarely exceeds the point where cr@p officials offer an apology for their cr@p performances. It never involves any reasons for appeals being turned down being made public. In fact, wherever possible referees decisions are upheld and not only is the outcome of Mat Mills appeal the norm, many more incidents of harsh red cards are not appealed in thr first place simply because clubs fear being further penalised just for appealing

Only a referee could defending the current state affairs with the condescending sh*te you have posted on this thread.

Referees are always right even when we're wrong and anyone daring to suggest otherwise will be shown to have said so offensively, inappropriately and/or in the wrong place.

You are living proof that we have a growing problem in the game; officials with over inflated ego's and a growing inability to do their jobs to the required standard added to a system that all too often allows such incompetence to go unchecked.


If your attitude is typical, referees are going to get everything they deserve from any requests for respect.

[crossie]

I think the standard of refereeing has been poor, but I saw the Mills incident and didn't think it was 50-50...looks like a red to me

[Rax]

I think the standard of refereeing has been poor, but I saw the Mills incident and didn't think it was 50-50...looks like a red to me

Well to be fair, Sun, Woodcote, you and me all have opinions on the rights and wrongs of all this - I was fuming because at RFC we tend to accept the good and the bad (the 'ghost' goal at Watford and the ref 'passing' the ball to the Norwich forward are 2 examples...) and we NEVER do a Fergie and blame everyone else in public when we lose - we hardly ever appeal against reds and to have Mills missing 4 crucial games because of an unintentional handball and at worst a clumsy challenge, and to have that appeal dismissed out of hand made my blood boil!

Finally, Sun - apologies, have re-read my post and it sounded a bit nastier towards you than I intended. Thanks for your well reasoned and thoughtful reply.

[leon]

Mills sat with the fans today. True fan's player. Could become a royal legend!

could

[Sun Tzu]

If your attitude is typical, referees are going to get everything they deserve from any requests for respect.

Woodcote in ' I only read my own posts' non - shocker.

I'm always up for a good discussion with people but there is no pint in trying to engage with someone who spends half a debate with their fingers in their ears shouting 'I'm not listening'.

Respect.

[rhroyal]

Well at least the FA have it better than UEFA. I remember last year Darren Fletcher missed the Champions League final for a perfect tackle. Abidal also missed it when Anelka tripped over his own feet. However, red cards could only be rescinded in the case of mistaken identity. Not sure how relevant that is here, but the sheer stupidity of the rule annoyed me. It's trying to make refs infallible, when they're human beings.

[parky]

The view on this thread by 'referees' is a strange one, losing the game is not the issue, and I'm not going to defend the referee's we have had this season, because some of them have been a disgrace, however some have been good, and there have been moments of great refereeing for instance a player on the field injured on the far touchline where the player could easily have rolled off however the referee (Dean I think it was) made the physio come on because then the treatment got to the player quicker, also some great advantages and some offside calls that have been close and the assistant has turned out to be right.

Also for some of the 'referees' on here the appeal being turned down is nothing to do with respect.

A direct free kick is awarded to the opposing team if a player commits any
of the following seven offences in a manner considered by the referee to be
careless, reckless or using excessive force:
• kicks or attempts to kick an opponent
• trips or attempts to trip an opponent
• jumps at an opponent
• charges an opponent
• strikes or attempts to strike an opponent
• pushes an opponent
• tackles an opponent

A player, substitute or substituted player is sent off if he commits any of the
following seven offences:
• serious foul play
• violent conduct
• spitting at an opponent or any other person
• denying the opposing team a goal or an obvious goal-scoring opportunity
by deliberately handling the ball (this does not apply to a goalkeeper within
his own penalty area)
• denying an obvious goal-scoring opportunity to an opponent moving
towards the player’s goal by an offence punishable by a free kick or a
penalty kick
• using offensive, insulting or abusive language and/or gestures
• receiving a second caution in the same match

So there we go, in the opinion of the referee is the crucial bit therefore the appeal could never have stood up because nobody else was THE REFEREE

[North Somerset Royal]

Mills sat with the fans today. True fan's player. Could become a royal legend!

Yes he was just in front of us but regretably not with his girlfriend.

[The Cap]

North Somerset wrote:

Yes he was just in front of us but regretably not with his girlfriend.

Yeah our thoughts entirely. Loved the man for making it in to the crowd. Shame the missus was missing but, hey, that's a minor. Done your credit rating the world of good yesterday Matty. "Matt Mills,there's only one Matt Mills.....".

[SpaceCruiser]

I still think video replays are the answer.

[Ian Royal]

I still think video replays are the answer.

to what question, and how?

[Sun Tzu]

I still think video replays are the answer.

to what question, and how?

They are definitely the answer.

But as Ian so rightly points out it is the question that is the important thing....

[Cripple Creek]

Yep, definitely video replays. It's one of those answers that is so beautiful in its simplicity it doesn't need a question.

[North Somerset Royal]

HOLLYOAKS babe Emma Rigby has ditched her footballer boyfriend-AND her plans to crack Hollywood.
The actress, 19, who plays Hannah Ashworth, will stay in the soap till November. She had said she would quit in June for the USA.
Meanwhile her footballer boyfriend Matthew Mills, 22, has got the boot after nine months together.
A source said: "They grew apart."
http://www.newsoftheworld.co.uk/showbiz ... ywood.html

[SLAMMED]