Harte Signs

[Snowball]

I know I shouldn't say it but Snowball by what spin is Giggs 49th best player-is that in Manchester?

ACTIM Stats, the official ratings system of the Premiership,
second only in accuracy to Hoop Blah's personal opinion

[Snowball]

http://www.premierleague.com/page/EAInd ... 06,00.html

[Stranded]

Actm is a load of rubbish, and the media went mad on Scholes after a couple of very good performances but he's already started to show why he, and Giggs, where used sparingly by Fergie last year.

The media talk rubbish most of the time to fill their pages, they're still decent but not a patch on what they were and can't handle the physical demands.

WHY is Actim a load of rubbish?

Because you say so?

Who do YOU think are currently playing best in the Premiership?

They are diverting fun at best. For example, it tends to show a goalkeeper of a side at/near the bottom as the top in the division, not because they are the best but becaue they are the busier.

[Woodcote Royal]

I think you will find that Harte is in his very,very late twenties-most people call it their thirties.

I was talking about Armstrong and Zurab.

I know Armstrong is not a new signing but when Gylfi left he had been an inactive member of the squad for more than a season and no one was expecting the vital contribution a left back returning from injury would make in midfield.....................................it was vital given injuries and suspensions and very significant in allowing us to deal with the loss of a £7m player.

[Hoop Blah]

Actm is a load of rubbish, and the media went mad on Scholes after a couple of very good performances but he's already started to show why he, and Giggs, where used sparingly by Fergie last year.

The media talk rubbish most of the time to fill their pages, they're still decent but not a patch on what they were and can't handle the physical demands.

WHY is Actim a load of rubbish?

Because you say so?

Who do YOU think are currently playing best in the Premiership?

Because it measures outcomes and events on the pitch but can't factor in the many influencing factors outside of the players control.

It's fine as a talking point and something to sell to papers and websites but not really to judge players ability and performance.

It had Hahnemann as the Premier Leagues best keeper for a long time didnt it?

[Snowball]

Hoop, I asked a question

Who do YOU think are currently playing best in the Premiership?


Who are ACTUALLY PLAYING BEST at the moment? Which strikers? Which midfielders? Which defenders? Which keepers?
Do it honestly, without looking at any tables such as ACTIM.
Now, please don't mix up, WHO-IS-THE-BEST-PLAYER with who-is-currently-on-top-form-and-playing-every-game
Rooney is a great player currently playing about my level = pretty crappy.
Now, just let's say people on this list could GENUINELY do this. IGNORING last year's form and the year before, and they chose their best players from live games and TV games, players who are CURRENTLY playing best, not THE BEST OVERALL. Clearly there's going to be a lot of Chelsea players in there... their form as a team is awesome; they've let in 2 goals and scored 23 in 7 games. Drogba? Kalou? Malouda? Anelka?

Yep, sure enough, 3 of those are in the top 4 strikers. Malouda top midfielder with Mikel 3rd.

When you sit down and consider which players are really on form, then check against the rankings, they coincide well.

And three of the Chelsea back four make the top ten, one of Man City

Shouldn't we expect Rooney to be low down as he's off form? He doesn't make )current form) the top 100

How about Man City? They've let in just 3 goals in 7 games (see above)

1 7 4 0 0 14 0 2 0 1 9 2 +21 18 Chelsea
2 7 3 1 0 07 2 1 1 1 2 1 +06 14 Man City
3 7 3 0 0 09 2 0 4 0 7 7 +07 13 Man Utd
4 7 2 0 1 12 4 1 2 1 4 5 +07 11 Arsenal
5 7 2 1 1 05 3 1 1 1 3 3 +02 11 Tottenham
6 7 2 2 0 06 3 1 0 2 3 9 -03 11 West Brom

So it's pretty obvious that Chelsea should have midfielders and strikers in the top 20 and a few defenders high up, also. Man City's defenders should feature, and so on.


PS You say that keepers at the bottom of the table should feature because they are busier. Wrong. They lose marks for goals conceded.

But here is a stat. Which keeper, this season, has made the most first-half saves?

Peter Cech of CHELSEA Guess who is top of the GK listing?

1 109 Petr Cech Chelsea (conceded 2 goals)
2 106 Joe Hart Man City (conceded 3 goals)
3 097 Matthew Gilks Blackpool (conceded 15 goals)*
4 090 Brad Friedel Aston Villa (conceded 12, but 6 in one game)
5 086 Edwin Van der Sar Man Utd (conceded 9 in 7, undefeated)
6 082 Scott Carson West Brom (conceded 12 but 6 in one game)
7 078 Paul Robinson Blackburn (conceded
8 071 Thomas Sorensen , Stoke (conceded 9)
9 071 Ben Foster Birmingham (conceded 9)
10 069 Manuel Almunia Arsenal (conceded 9)


Cech, great keepr, Hart now THE England keeper, Foster, Robinson, Carson all internationals
All these keepers (maybe not Almunia?) are very, very good keepers, and we should EXPECT
them to be high in the table, and they are.

* Conceded 10 in 2 games (6-0, 4-0), 12 in 3 (2-2) but the keeper has otherwise played very well
and apart from their two drubbings, Blackpools GD in the other games is a very healthy +6 and they lie 9th
The keeper was brilliant at Liverpool

[Snowball]

Because it measures outcomes and events on the pitch but can't factor in the many influencing factors outside of the players control.

It's fine as a talking point and something to sell to papers and websites but not really to judge players ability and performance.

It had Hahnemann as the Premier Leagues best keeper for a long time didnt it?

But the whole POINT of the system is to REMOVE SUBJECTIVITY. It openly states it doesn't have extra allowance for an incredible shot or a breath-taking pass. It allows for minutes on the pitch, whether your team won/lost, whether you score or keep a clean sheet, percentage of tackles won, percentage of successful passes and so on.


I remember Joe Cole first for England. He played great in part, made some great passes
but also did something dumb and conceded a goal. How do we score that? Overemphasise
the good bits and forget the one-off error? Or get p!ssed off about the dumb concession
and downgrade the good bits cos they didn't actually produce goals?

Problem is punters have no system, are fickle and ludicrously biased and subjective.

[IcelandicStokie]

But, Stranded, doesn't a miss rate as high as that suggest that maybe we shouldn't be TAKING those long shots and a pass trying to put someone in with a BETTER chance would be the right option.

Quite often when long shots are taken there is no "forward passing" option available, so they have a choice to either shoot, try and retain the ball and probably lose it, or pass backwards (and suffer the gorans of the crowd).

No problem, we'll just shoot over the bar instead. That's more efficient.


Or, of course, it COULD be, that like corners which are actually UNproductive,
because Gyfli scores just THREE (admittedly brilliant and spectacular) free-kicks
in a SEASON, the players, fans AND coaches think we should really be

(a) Playing for free-kicks (aren't we seeing more and more of that with Long winning frees for Harte to take?

This of course, changes the way we play. Instead of trying to keep the ball alive, we look for lots of dead-ball situations

(b) Opting for a free-kick SHOT (last season, taken by Gylfi of course) rather than a clever pass to the wing
or a through ball, or a one-two, or a chip to be headed


Fact is Gylfi missed 111 times. That doesn't include mis-control or shots blocked as the man is about to shoot,
that's "shots-away" off target or saved.


Gylfi had 71 shots on target. Take away 7 penalties, that's 64 shots on target for 14 goals. FIFTY saved

Church was on target 30 times and 12 went in - 18 saved. He scores 40% of the time on target.
Kebe was on target 31 times and 12 went in, 19 saved He scores 39% of the time he's on target
Long was on target 24 times and 9 went in, 15 saved. Long scored 38% of the time he was on target

All three of these are far more "deadly", better at converting chances, than Gylfi

Gylfi managed 22% (21.8%), so it seems likely that either

(a) He's a very wasteful striker
or
(b) He/the team didn't always take the best option

Is this a thread about Harte joining or how many shots Siggy missed during his relatively short stint at Reading? How you seem intent on making Siggy look bad is beyond me really. He is a class player, be it at Reading or somewhere else, deal with it.

[Hoop Blah]

Who do YOU think are currently playing best in the Premiership

Personally I don't watch much Premier League football live, I don't even watch much on TV highlights so I couldn't answer that with any real degree of confidence.

I've seen enough of Schole and Giggs to know that they are capable of good moment and good games but with their advancing years their ability to produce that consistently is greatly diminished.

The Actim index may remove the the subjectivity of watching a game but my view is that it, and any statistical model for scoring football, ignores it to it's detriment.

[Snowball]

How you seem intent on making Siggy look bad is beyond me really. He is a class player, be it at Reading or somewhere else, deal with it.

This must be why I said:

Stranded, like you I think Gylfi is a BRILLIANT player, fabulous, a match-winner,
special, out-of-the-ordinary, and a good bloke.

I said on these boards that he'd end up at a UK Premiership top-six club.

If we, somehow were about to sign a Gylfi, right now, I would be deliriously happy.


I would FULLY EXPECT that Gyfli to improve our results.

I EXPECTED that Gylfi was personally responsible for a real percentage of our points and we would take time to recover from his leaving.

Doesn't change the facts that we get more points without him

[Sarah Star]

Harte isn't a bad player, but that Nathan Dyer is very good. Can't we buy him?

[Royalee]

Harte isn't a bad player, but that Nathan Dyer is very good. Can't we buy him?

No, Madejski will liquidate the club's assets and sell Kebe in January, we can't possibly buy anyone as we're struggling to survive with the £30 million or so's worth of sales and Premiership money, especially when we've spent the ambitious sum of one pence.

[Millsy]

Harte was found out today.

[Snowball]

I thought, first half that the back four played very well
and the guy next to me was commenting on their confidence
and the way their being slower didn't seem to matter.

I agreed. The Swansea goal was a very good break straight down the middle
and I presume that's Kish and Mills territory (and maybe Karacan)

Sure Swansea had a couple of good breaks at speed in the second half
when we were pressing, but that's what breaks are, fast counter-attacks
when our full-backs are on the attack!

And Dyer is quick, would out-pace at least 20 of the left-backs in this league.

Do opposition supporters call for their left back to be dropped every time Kebe
takes them apart? No, of course not. Wingers (Little apart) are fast and will often
skin full-backs. That's their job.

Our defence played well for all the first half, and had a bad five minutes
(but didn't concede) in the second. Other than that Swansea didn't create much
and they look a pretty decent outfit, up to fourth.

They have won 9 of their last 12 games including today.

BTW, Harte had a fantastic moment when he sent Dyer the wrong way and
made an inch-perfect pass of at least 50 yards to Kebe. Utter Class.

I would continue to play Harte at LB.

[Snowball]

BTW - Carlisle are now 2nd.

Now SIXTH, as I predicted.

Six weeks ago (Harte's last game) they were clear top, 4 points and +5GD clear of Brighton

They are now 6 points BEHIND Brighton and -4GD. That's a TEN POINTS turn-around and -9GD in 8 games

10 Point loss to Brighton
06 Point loss to Exeter
05 Point loss to Peterboro
05 Point loss to Huddersfield
04 Point loss to Bournemouth
02 Point Loss to Wednesday


Still say they are playing well and maintaining their position?

[Snowball]

BTW - Carlisle are now 2nd.

Second yes, but seventh on current form, only second because they WERE top

That a class spin you've put on that there Snowball.

Now sixth and falling

[Ian Royal]

Harte was found out today.

I don't think it was any surprise he struggled against such pace. Which is why McDermott has to take some flak there. Especially not for making a change. Although I guess the real damage didn't come from there in the end.

[Victor Meldrew]

Harte was found out today.

I don't think it was any surprise he struggled against such pace. Which is why McDermott has to take some flak there. Especially not for making a change. Although I guess the real damage didn't come from there in the end.

Although of course Dyer smashed one against the bar when he should have scored.
Hopefully Brian will see sense and play Armstrong at left-back on Tuesday.

[Snowball]

I WAS at the game but have waited for the highlights to check my fallible memory.


The chance that hit the bar was NOT down to Harte's lack of speed.

He was caught out by an excellent through pass when the winger was already flying. No fullback can turn
and catch a winger who is that speedy. LOOK at it.

The second break it was ZURAB who was skinned, not Harte





Federici's two saves were very VERY good, especially the second one from the close-in flick

[From Despair To Where?]

From where I'm sitting, the stats indicate we play better with Cummings in the team. Compared to Harte. 3 more points gained, 2 more goals scored, same number of goals conceded in the same number of games.