Failure to buy a striker

[pea]

Seven million is about the highest rate you'll get for a player who has only proved themselves at championship level. That's what Adam Johnson went for last year. We were better off selling him to a club with a significant sell-on clause where he could showcase his talent in a big European league than holding on to him for half a season and then selling him to a bigger club who weren't necessarily going to see him afterwards (and so we might not receive an additional fee) for the same initial fee, regardless of how much he improved in that time, and with the risk of derailing our season midway through (we would be about where swansea are now with Sig in our side I reckon).

I realisr that last sentence was really long but I hope that made sense.

[brendywendy]

We were building a team around Gylfi? My God, that is naive! We were never going to hold on to a talent like that, not even for the season. The only chance (a slim one) was selling him and loaning him back.

We PLAYED Gylfi because he was a prodigious talent, but no manager in the CCC, unless he has QPR's
money could even DREAM of keeping him

that's what Brian said about this season - he was building the team around Gylfi. I have to laugh at someone who clearly has been watching Reading for about 5 minutes telling me I'm naive about the way the club is run.

He was only a youngster and there no need to sell immediately. Not every club sells its prime asset (that is still developing) at the drop of a hat.

Maybe, just maybe, Brian was not in on the decision to sell him.
Maybe, just maybe, the powers that be upstairs discovered a £4M black hole in the books......

worst conspiracy theorist ever

[Wimb]

Selling Gylfi was a business decision 100% but a business decision that will help the football club over the long term and if you don't understand that simple concept then that's fair enough.

Not one person in the football club WANTED to see Gylfi go, but the offer represented such an opportunity to the club that it would have been downright stupid to turn it down. It wasn't the 'drop of a hat' it was an unbelievable offer that very few people, including us keyboard warriors, expected. I seem to remember people quoting £5 million or 3.5 million when speculating about a possible sale so the fact the club has gotten so much plus the potential for more in the future is a credit to the board.

As pea mentioned we got the BEST possible return for a Championship player that you could possibly expect to get and the fact we've got a sell on clause will only benefit the club in the long run. Gylfi would no doubt have happily stayed this season but are people so short minded that they don't remember the massive question marks we had over the squad at the time?!

We had fitness doubts over just about our entire back line, Chris Armstrong was looking like his career was over, Cummings had had 1 half decent game at left back, Williams was injured and looking out of his depth, Ivar was (and still is) injured and we had Gunnarsson as our only cover at centre half. Simple fact if we had to put out a back four of Williams, Gunnar, Pearce and Griffin, we'd get nowhere near the playoffs even if we had Sig in the team.

By selling Gylfi we not only ensured we could bring in Kiz and Harte but that there was money available for the RIGHT player and gave us the future flexibility to plug any holes that may arise. You can slag off our 3 strikers all you want but Long, Church and Hunt are all international forwards on decent wages and you'd hardly call them a weakness in the same way you would having Gunnarsson as our only reserve centre back.

No fan out there wasn't disappointed to see such a talent go but if you really believe he'd have stayed with us if we remained in the Championship then either you're expecting him to regress in terms of ability or the guy is the second coming of Steve Bull, both of which are unlikely.

Not ONE single club in this league can hold onto talent for a great period of time. Joe Ledley, Jagielka,Joleon Lescott, Kyle Walker/Naughton, Kevin Doyle, Adam Johnson, Andy Johnson are all prime examples of 'vital players' who 'loved' the clubs they'd been brought up in but still moved onto bigger clubs.

[Svlad Cjelli]

Spot on, except for the last paragraph - Gylfi has even fewer ties to reading than many of thoe players listed had to the clubs they left. It's not as if he was a Whitley or Southcote boy, we has from Iceland!

But I fear that it's all a waste of words - too many people have decided they know exactly what happened, so won't let facts or cogent arguments change their minds.

[Harpers So Solid Crew]

Gylfi was at RFC for a long time tho, same as Doyle, we took him into the game when others would not, we nutured him and helped him become the player he is. Doubt SC will get any credit, for looking after him and not throwing him in too soon.

[Hoop Blah]

I agree with the analysis of the sale of Sigurdsson Wimb, and as much as I wish we didn't have to sell him it was the right decision and credit to Hammond for getting such a good deal.

The only issue I have with it all, and the point of the thread, is that we needed to bring in a forward or at least some form of attacking player to fill the void the sale left. We supposedly tried and failed with a late bid for Morison, which I'd heard failed because of a lack of time, not finances. That's a reall pity and in my eyes a bit of a mistake.

[Wycombe Royal]

We supposedly tried and failed with a late bid for Morison, which I'd heard failed because of a lack of time, not finances. That's a reall pity and in my eyes a bit of a mistake.

I would guess it failed because of both. We always attempt to get the best deal possible and will not bow to other clubs demands. But the issue here was that there was not enough time to negotiate to reach a compromise.

[Hoop Blah]

We supposedly tried and failed with a late bid for Morison, which I'd heard failed because of a lack of time, not finances. That's a reall pity and in my eyes a bit of a mistake.

I would guess it failed because of both. We always attempt to get the best deal possible and will not bow to other clubs demands. But the issue here was that there was not enough time to negotiate to reach a compromise.

Without knowing the full ins and outs it's a bit difficult to know but to my mind the best deal isn't always the cheapest and I'm guessing that we probably refused to pay a premium for the man we wanted due to the last minute nature of the deal.

Would having a player we wanted for Sept/Oct/Nov/Dec have been worth that premium? Within reason I'd say yes.

[Wycombe Royal]

We supposedly tried and failed with a late bid for Morison, which I'd heard failed because of a lack of time, not finances. That's a reall pity and in my eyes a bit of a mistake.

I would guess it failed because of both. We always attempt to get the best deal possible and will not bow to other clubs demands. But the issue here was that there was not enough time to negotiate to reach a compromise.

Without knowing the full ins and outs it's a bit difficult to know but to my mind the best deal isn't always the cheapest and I'm guessing that we probably refused to pay a premium for the man we wanted due to the last minute nature of the deal.

Would having a player we wanted for Sept/Oct/Nov/Dec have been worth that premium? Within reason I'd say yes.

I take that on board but I was merely suggesting the way the club works. In recent times we haven't paid a "premium for players", yes some haven't worked out but we haven't paid over the odds for any recently in my opinion.

[Svlad Cjelli]

As a club policy we won't be taken advantage of. if a club or player tries to do that we'll walk away.

[Hoop Blah]

I agree that's the way the club work, and it's commendable in some ways, but at the end of the day what's more important, coming out with the right player that the manager whats (up to a price of course) or to feel you've got the best price possible.

There's a balancing act of course, I'm just not convinced we have that balance quite right when you look at the quality in our squad.

It is what it is though, and the club obviously know a lot more about the figures involved than I do!

[under the tin]

Selling Gylfi was a business decision 100% but a business decision that will help the football club over the long term and if you don't understand that simple concept then that's fair enough.

Not one person in the football club WANTED to see Gylfi go, but the offer represented such an opportunity to the club that it would have been downright stupid to turn it down. It wasn't the 'drop of a hat' it was an unbelievable offer that very few people, including us keyboard warriors, expected. I seem to remember people quoting £5 million or 3.5 million when speculating about a possible sale so the fact the club has gotten so much plus the potential for more in the future is a credit to the board.

As pea mentioned we got the BEST possible return for a Championship player that you could possibly expect to get and the fact we've got a sell on clause will only benefit the club in the long run. Gylfi would no doubt have happily stayed this season but are people so short minded that they don't remember the massive question marks we had over the squad at the time?!

I don't think that anyone can argue with any of that.

Spot on, ......so won't let facts or cogent arguments change their minds.

Simple fact if we had to put out a back four of Williams, Gunnar, Pearce and Griffin, we'd get nowhere near the playoffs even if we had Sig in the team.

That's not a cogent argument,nor is it a fact. It's just your opinion. HTH.

[Barry the bird boggler]

Heston meets the wallet this week, probably to be told you can have 5p and a Strawberry Mivvi to squander on the best players available.

And of course to also be told the old chestnut you'll have to sell if you want more.

[brendywendy]

[leon]

Of course selling Gylfi was a business decision, and an understandable one, and the sort of thing the JM has done before (eg the Wembley play off team - well the good bits) - I'm just a little concerned that we were happy to sell a key part of the team at short notice without no contingency in place. That's just not good business planning I'm afraid.

Maybe there was an unexpected hole in the finances - again that's a bit concerning a well run club shouldn't get itself into that sort of a problem. We'll never know I guess. No conspiracy theories just a bit cynical.

[under the tin]

Heston meets the wallet this week, probably to be told you can have 5p and a Strawberry Mivvi to squander on the best players available.

And of course to also be told the old chestnut you'll have to sell if you want more.

I read the article in the 'paper. it was interesting to see JM emphasising that income is not covering operating costs.
I've said many times before on here that Brian has a horse trading job on. Gylfi was sacrificed to strengthen elsewhere, and I expect that theme to continue. I don't think that the club can do much to avoid the departure of Kebe, and it will be these monies that Brian will have to go shopping with.

For those who did the simplistic maths, Gylfi's £6M - £4M black hole = £2M for Brian to spend, well I think you are in for a disappointment.
In the light of JM's comments, I think that the club will squirrel that money away to help cover future shortfalls. It's certainly what I would do.

[Vision]

Heston meets the wallet this week, probably to be told you can have 5p and a Strawberry Mivvi to squander on the best players available.

And of course to also be told the old chestnut you'll have to sell if you want more.

I read the article in the 'paper. it was interesting to see JM emphasising that income is not covering operating costs.
I've said many times before on here that Brian has a horse trading job on. Gylfi was sacrificed to strengthen elsewhere, and I expect that theme to continue. I don't think that the club can do much to avoid the departure of Kebe, and it will be these monies that Brian will have to go shopping with.

For those who did the simplistic maths, Gylfi's £6M - £4M black hole = £2M for Brian to spend, well I think you are in for a disappointment.
In the light of JM's comments, I think that the club will squirrel that money away to help cover future shortfalls. It's certainly what I would do.

Agreed. I dont really know why people seem surprised by this. To a certain degree its how most clubs operate.

Our situation is slightly exacerbated by being 2 seasons out of the Premiership. We're still in a levelling off process really as JM alluded to as we're still carrying too many outgoings for our natural income. You only have to look at the financial (and indeed league positions) of clubs 2,3 or 4 seasons after relegation from the Premiership if they dont get back there. Bigger Clubs with far more natural income than ourselves have found themselves in real trouble both on and off the pitch generally because they dont have people paying attention to this sort of thing until its too late.

Its frustrating for sure when as fans we look at our side as being a player or two away from a promotion outfit but in all honesty the make up of most championship clubs is such that most of the other teams' fans can say the same thing.

Where we may have an advantage in the future is that the Academy does seem to be producing players of a standard that is fit for purpose in the Championship. By fit for purpose obviously I mean the likes of Pearce,Karacan,Church etc are decent championship players rather than stellar ones at this stage of their development but there is potential for them to improve further (in fact I think Karacan and Pearce are significantly better players now than at this time last season). If this process continues then we may be in a position to once again take these players as a core group and then add the odd grizzled pro or (dream on) a marquee signing or two to supplement them.

People can and obviously will knock the way we do things because on the face of it we seem to holding ourselves back by playing to rules that many others dont adher to. Personally,however frustrating it might be at times, I'm happy with the way we're going about it.

[Who Moved The Goalposts?]

For those who did the simplistic maths, Gylfi's £6M - £4M black hole = £2M for Brian to spend, well I think you are in for a disappointment.
In the light of JM's comments, I think that the club will squirrel that money away to help cover future shortfalls. It's certainly what I would do.

It's not as bad a picture as that. Half (ish) of that £4m hole was filled before Gylfi left through Marek, Cisse and Rasiak all departing. Which also means next year's hole won't be as bad (until we're told otherwise no doubt).

You're spot on about the saving of that money though. I think Brian will get bugger all to spend in January, eased by the promise of some cash in the summer. I may well be wrong, but I genuinely do believe JM has no intention of promotion while either a) he's still here or b) until the general economic situation (and his business empire) shows signs of massive improvement. Of course, he'll try to ensure that the team do just enough to give the fans a bit of belief that promotion is possible, because he wouldn't want the fanbase dimishing and making things even harder. A tricky balancing act indeed. Who'd be a chairman or manager, eh?

[Hoop Blah]

If this process continues then we may be in a position to once again take these players as a core group and then add the odd grizzled pro or (dream on) a marquee signing or two to supplement them.

People can and obviously will knock the way we do things because on the face of it we seem to holding ourselves back by playing to rules that many others dont adher to. Personally,however frustrating it might be at times, I'm happy with the way we're going about it.

Totally agree with these bits.

It's unlikely that we'll be able to produce or keep youth players who are good enough to be the key players at this level (if they show enough promise they'll usually get snapped up by higher teams and then, if not good enough, slowly drop back down to their rightful level) but we can build a squad of the likes of Pearce and Karacan over time.

What we have to do is make sure we supplement those players with the right type and quality to get the best out of them. 1 or 2 players can make such a difference to a team and make those around them play so much better.

[brendywendy]

Of course selling Gylfi was a business decision, and an understandable one, and the sort of thing the JM has done before (eg the Wembley play off team - well the good bits) - I'm just a little concerned that we were happy to sell a key part of the team at short notice without no contingency in place. That's just not good business planning I'm afraid.

Maybe there was an unexpected hole in the finances - again that's a bit concerning a well run club shouldn't get itself into that sort of a problem. We'll never know I guess. No conspiracy theories just a bit cynical.

it may have been unexpected by you, but it wasnt by the club.
i dont know what you think we could have done about it, other than get rid of our best players even quicker and not go for promotion with SSC