Back from the match / Pub / Lounge (Villa)

[melonhead]

But surely our balance sheet has never looked better, and that's what it's all about isn't it?
Avon Royal

its certainly about being competetive both on the pitch and off it, and the last few years we certainly have been.the reality for us though, and AZ, is that unless we as a club grow sensibly and sustainably to a point where we can sustain premiere league spending, we will never have a decent balance sheet and make regular profits as a business. we just arent there yet though.we can possibly break even in the championship, and even then only while selling a player a season for decent money or taking money off our owner.
AZ has come in with some money behind him, and the ability to spend more than JM would to help us out. but its still not enough to bankroll silly spending. All we/he can do is keep feeding the money he can afford to in, keep growing, using the parachutes, and yo yo like west brom, and in that way its possible the club will succeed, become a prem club, and give us the success we crave, AND the Balance sheet AZ will want.

[melonhead]

OK.

Who would you replace Tabb & Ledge with?

dunno, lol



sidwell, and guthrie.....?

[reading_fan]

But surely our balance sheet has never looked better, and that's what it's all about isn't it?
Avon Royal

its certainly about being competetive both on the pitch and off it, and the last few years we certainly have been.the reality for us though, and AZ, is that unless we as a club grow sensibly and sustainably to a point where we can sustain premiere league spending, we will never have a decent balance sheet and make regular profits as a business. we just arent there yet though.we can possibly break even in the championship, and even then only while selling a player a season for decent money or taking money off our owner.
AZ has come in with some money behind him, and the ability to spend more than JM would to help us out. but its still not enough to bankroll silly spending. All we/he can do is keep feeding the money he can afford to in, keep growing, using the parachutes, and yo yo like west brom, and in that way its possible the club will succeed, become a prem club, and give us the success we crave, AND the Balance sheet AZ will want.

Agreed, and this is one main reason why I see no point in getting rid of Brian. We've always done things "one brick at a time" to use a Madejski-ism, and we may have to yoyo for a few seasons to establish ourselves, but isn't that a lot more of an interesting existence? We may struggle this season, but we will hopefully be able to bounce back and enjoy a season of success next year. Our club will be geared around the probability of relegation so we have no reason to fear it.

[melonhead]

agreed

& when i started to follow reading i would have killed to be a yo yo team
i still would

[Alexander Litvinenko]

But surely our balance sheet has never looked better, and that's what it's all about isn't it?
Avon Royal

its certainly about being competetive both on the pitch and off it, and the last few years we certainly have been.the reality for us though, and AZ, is that unless we as a club grow sensibly and sustainably to a point where we can sustain premiere league spending, we will never have a decent balance sheet and make regular profits as a business. we just arent there yet though.we can possibly break even in the championship, and even then only while selling a player a season for decent money or taking money off our owner.
AZ has come in with some money behind him, and the ability to spend more than JM would to help us out. but its still not enough to bankroll silly spending. All we/he can do is keep feeding the money he can afford to in, keep growing, using the parachutes, and yo yo like west brom, and in that way its possible the club will succeed, become a prem club, and give us the success we crave, AND the Balance sheet AZ will want.

Agreed, and this is one main reason why I see no point in getting rid of Brian. We've always done things "one brick at a time" to use a Madejski-ism, and we may have to yoyo for a few seasons to establish ourselves, but isn't that a lot more of an interesting existence? We may struggle this season, but we will hopefully be able to bounce back and enjoy a season of success next year. Our club will be geared around the probability of relegation so we have no reason to fear it.

Except that it's inevitable that our promising kids will be asset-stripped away, so the gains of stability and continuity will be pretty much wiped out.

Although there aren't many players that PL clubs would want, I can see McCarthy, Karacan and Morrison being made offers they'd not be able to refuse and we'd not be able to match.

[Vision]

OK.

Who would you replace Tabb & Ledge with?

Guthrie reckons he'll be available Saturday so thats at least an option.

Honestly though I wouldn't have sent Lawson D'Ath back out on loan . He wouldn't solve the lack of creativity issue per se but he can pose a threat for the opposition from midfield and in turn would give the front two more space and someone else to play off.

[holsgrove breaks a leg]

agreed

& when i started to follow reading i would have killed to be a yo yo team
i still would

Trouble is the real 'yo yo' model doesn't really exist now - WBA were the last exponents but a little while back and before then it was Bolton ages ago. The championship has become such a competitive league in terms of finances and close competition in games that relegated teams (unless a West Ham or Newcastle) are seeing the drop into the championship more with trepidation. Granted we got back up after 4 seasons (hardly yo yo though) but i maintain that the championship is as competitive as ever(which is why i like that league) and if we go down with or without Brian it is a tough ask to return with our current squad.

[Alexander Litvinenko]

agreed

& when i started to follow reading i would have killed to be a yo yo team
i still would

Trouble is the real 'yo yo' model doesn't really exist now - WBA were the last exponents but a little while back and before then it was Bolton ages ago. The championship has become such a competitive league in terms of finances and close competition in games that relegated teams (unless a West Ham or Newcastle) are seeing the drop into the championship more with trepidation. Granted we got back up after 4 seasons (hardly yo yo though) but i maintain that the championship is as competitive as ever(which is why i like this league) and if we go down with or without Brian it is a tough ask to return with our current squad.

More significantly, the financial gap between PL & Championship has got so much bigger - and next season will be even bigger still with the new TV deals. "Yo-yo"ing will become even harder, the financial impact of relegation will be even greater, and establishing yourself in the PL will become more difficult also.

[Great Knolly]

Agreed Legitwood was quite poor yesterday, but I actually think the problem yesterday was the wingers . If they offer nothing, as they did last night, it puts a lot of pressure on the rest of the team . For a start the full-backs feel obliged to overlap more often than they ought to. MacAnuff made a couple of decent runs, but HRK was nearly inept going forward.
We need the occasional genius of Kebe , even if it's only for 3 moments in a game . Until he's fit, McCleary should start ahead of HRK.

[Pandoras Box]

Agreed Legitwood was quite poor yesterday, but I actually think the problem yesterday was the wingers

You can't blame the wingers for Leigertwood's inability to pass to one of his own squad or for his poor ball control.Would we be better if the ball was hoofed from the backs to forwards to ensure no midfield intervention? At least it'll take a few seconds longer to get back to the other team.

[Alexander Litvinenko]

Agreed Legitwood was quite poor yesterday, but I actually think the problem yesterday was the wingers

You can't blame the wingers for Leigertwood's inability to pass to one of his own squad or for his poor ball control.Would we be better if the ball was hoofed from the backs to forwards to ensure no midfield intervention? At least it'll take a few seconds longer to get back to the other team.

'Greed. Leigertwood seems to have the same relationship to the ball that Superman does to Kryponite. he's just not comfortable on it and needs to get rid as soon as possible.

[Stuka]

I've been wanting to scapegoat somebody for some time now, and I think Leigertwood must just be the man. I have noticed several examples of his ineptitude in particular over the last few games.

[Vision]

Agreed Legitwood was quite poor yesterday, but I actually think the problem yesterday was the wingers

You can't blame the wingers for Leigertwood's inability to pass to one of his own squad or for his poor ball control.Would we be better if the ball was hoofed from the backs to forwards to ensure no midfield intervention? At least it'll take a few seconds longer to get back to the other team.

'Greed. Leigertwood seems to have the same relationship to the ball that Superman does to Kryponite. he's just not comfortable on it and needs to get rid as soon as possible.

His main problem last night seemed to be the opposite. Got caught dwelling on it too many times.

[RoyalBlue]

Nicked from ESPN but saves me typing my own observation which was exactly the same.

Up front, Reading’s attack put a lot of effort in and had a few half-chances from scrambles in the box but otherwise didn’t trouble the Villa keeper. Too often they found themselves winning the ball down the channels as a result of hard work and then finding no support from midfield and only one one player in the box to aim for

One perfect example of this was when Roberts did really well to break clear down the left but looked up to find that the only Reading player who had bothered to get in their box was ALF and he was covered by 3 defenders! No point whasoever in McDermott building our play around wingers and crosses when he hasn't got a midfield capable of supporting that style of play!

[Extended-Phenotype]

Shocking subs last night too. McD really is testing the most loyal of supporters waiting until gone the 80th minute before making any changes to his shambles of a side. How come Pog can't even get on the pitch as a f/cking sub? Why take off our most effective forward for a player who hardly merited starting in the championship? Why give McCleary less than 10 mins to make an impact when our wings were so dire?

Sorry, no escaping it, McD is costing us points. Wake the f/ck up, Brian. You can't hide sh/t tactics and poor decisions behind this fable of a small budget.

[LoyalRoyalFan]

What a turgid effort that was.

Tabb and Leigertwood might as well have not even been on the pitch considering we completely bypassed them throughout the match. Even when they did have possession, they both conceded it cheaply. They sit far too deep and offer no support going forward. Anyone who said that McDermott was right to drop Guthrie should be ashamed of themselves, the only player who offers any sort of midfield threat.

I think it's telling when the only option McDermott brings off the bench to change the game up front is Noel Hunt. He is the worst striker at the club and you knew the game was lost when he came onto the pitch. Where is Pog? McCleary had a good impact again, but he had about 10 minutes to make any sort of a difference. Why leave the subs so late?

The clock is ticking for McDermott.

[The Beardy Man]

Shocking subs last night too. McD really is testing the most loyal of supporters waiting until gone the 80th minute before making any changes to his shambles of a side. How come Pog can't even get on the pitch as a f/cking sub? Why take off our most effective forward for a player who hardly merited starting in the championship? Why give McCleary less than 10 mins to make an impact when our wings were so dire?

Sorry, no escaping it, McD is costing us points. Wake the f/ck up, Brian. You can't hide sh/t tactics and poor decisions behind this fable of a small budget.

I got the impression Roberts got taken off as after 2 games in a few days he was knackered. Can only surmise that Hunt was brought on to try and run about a bit in a 'we'll take a point' sense. Didn't work, and I thought Alf had been pretty quiet for the last 10 mins or so before hand as well, but can sort of see the logic....just our luck this year to concede a goal as soon as the change was made

[LoyalRoyalFan]

And as a final point, to the "fans" who booed the team off at half time who were sat a few rows behind me last night, I hope you're happy the boys got the result you were obviously so keen to see.

What's wrong with fans booing an inept performance once AGAIN?

[melonhead]

agreed

& when i started to follow reading i would have killed to be a yo yo team
i still would

Trouble is the real 'yo yo' model doesn't really exist now - WBA were the last exponents but a little while back and before then it was Bolton ages ago. The championship has become such a competitive league in terms of finances and close competition in games that relegated teams (unless a West Ham or Newcastle) are seeing the drop into the championship more with trepidation. Granted we got back up after 4 seasons (hardly yo yo though) but i maintain that the championship is as competitive as ever(which is why i like this league) and if we go down with or without Brian it is a tough ask to return with our current squad.

More significantly, the financial gap between PL & Championship has got so much bigger - and next season will be even bigger still with the new TV deals. "Yo-yo"ing will become even harder, the financial impact of relegation will be even greater, and establishing yourself in the PL will become more difficult also.

except yo yoing doesnt depend on how much better the prem is than the champ
alot of it it depends on how much money you have in the champ(and how well you use it) and theres no doubt that relegated teams will have a monetary advantage over those who werent.
and the financial impact of relegation for us wont be that bad, since we havent spent much of the gains we made by coming up, the players will all be on contracts that would reflect a relegation in their wages, and theyre all of a standard/type that wouldnt necessarily be being hunted by prem teams

[BR2]

Easy to make scapegoats of Ledge and Tabb but once again they were outnumbered.
That numbskull Woodcote couldn't understand the concept put forward the other week that we should go with just one wide player rather than what Brian thinks is compulsory-you have to play two when in fact Brian you don't.
The only player who looked up to Premier League last night was Bannen who tried all game to play pass-and-move football.

It does look as though Brian is like a Sunday League manager-get all of your mates to play and they will do their best to help each other out and never mind tactics because it can work out now and again.
This however is not Sunday League and watching on TV just highlights the lack of considered football.
Two wingers who fall over when anybody gets near them,defenders who (clearly under instruction ) are told to welly the ball as far as possible,two strikers who struggle to head a ball (more so Roberts),two central midfielders who think that getting near the opposition box is a sin.
On first thoughts the defence did o.k.but the two central defenders only mainly had one striker to mark and Villa is a side that offers so little in terms of goal threat that they managed to make our defence look better than they are except at set-pieces when ,as usual,they were all over the place.

Somebody spoke earlier of picking up a few wins-"Few" means 8 or 9 just to have a chance of survival and whereas Villa and Sunderland may well continue to threaten to join the relegation party we still have to end up with 3 teams below us and,regardless of January signings,I think we are showing so few signs of being good enough to be at least 4th from bottom.
Yes,we don't tend to get beaten by big scores (so far),but that is due to playing roughly 8-2 as a formation with the wide two just occasionally getting in the way.

Surely we are not just going to carry on playing the same way and just hoping for a miracle but so far there are very few signs of us being able to play differently so maybe it is time for somebody new with a different outlook on how we should play and a break away from the apparently cosy set-up.
BTW (i don't count Shorey as he was one of ours who just went away for a few years) I noticed that last night's line-up inluded only ONE player who was not with us last season and any owner who has shelled out (not enough of course) money during the summer is entitled to ask WHY?