Leigertwood

[Ian Royal]

Last season, I bumped into an ex QPR player i know who is now a scout for them. He was there, ostensibly, to watch Kebe (this with them in the PL and us in the Champ and was before we knew about Anton).

We talked about Kebe (he concluded he was good but not better than anyone they already had) and also about Leighterwood. He summed up Leighterwood like this:

"He can have a blinder of a game for you - 9 out of ten, and then the next two or three games will be 3 out of ten. He never consistantly has a 7 or 8 out of ten which is what you need from your starting players".

I think this is spot on. Leighterwood had a much better game against United but he was F*cking woeful against Villa and Wigan. Why he appears to lack consistancy is a mystery to me but Brian must have known this about him yet still picked him every week, regardless of how he played in the previous game.

Under Brian, he was undroppable and he doesn't deserve that status based on his performaces in the PL.

Those defending him based on his (undoubtably great) performances last year in the Champ need to bear in mind that football (especially the PL) is like evolution by natural selection and you can't rest on your laurels.

The reason Brian has gone is his failure to adapt to his (and the teams) new environment.

Here endeth the (alternate view) lesson...

Sounds like a load of bollocks to me. He was consistently 7/8 out of 10 last season and the season before, if not better. I wouldn't say he's been 9/10 at any point this season and he's been 3/10 on only a few occasions at worst.

[facaldaqui]

He was a significant contributor to QPR's promotion but became surplus to requirements once they got to the Premier League as he is nowhere near up to the required standard

Nothing very true there. He came to us fairly early in QPR's promotion season, and he said Warnock had already told him he wasn't part of his plans. He is in my opinion very close to the required standard for the prem--falling only slightly short. Pity we didn't get Gylfi, who would have brought the best out of Ledge. I love the bloke.

[Hampshire Royal]

The fact that you believe Gunter to be German shows your complete lack of knowledge about Reading.
Are you just trolling with your accusations of racism or are you truly that thick?
Your concept of "pure Suvvern" equates to essentially only three Reading players: Shorey, Morrison and McCarthy. Are you seriously suggesting that criticism of any player apart from these ones is due to fans being racist?

You've been on this forum for 9 years now so presumably you are not a child but seriously, grow up!

You know what? You're absolutely right!! I am truly that thick, it's just that I needed someone to point it out to me. Thank you, I am truly grateful for your penetrating insight into my true character.

Just one small point - I've been on this forum since the mid/late Nineties, and the biggest change I've seen is that the humour that used to be on here has largely gone. There always were heated discussions, but they were always carried out with mutual respect between the protaganists (well, nearly always).

Oh, just one more small point - just because you don't see the humour in something, it doesn't mean that it wasn't meant to be humorous!!

[West Stand Man]

The fact that you believe Gunter to be German shows your complete lack of knowledge about Reading.
Are you just trolling with your accusations of racism or are you truly that thick?
Your concept of "pure Suvvern" equates to essentially only three Reading players: Shorey, Morrison and McCarthy. Are you seriously suggesting that criticism of any player apart from these ones is due to fans being racist?

You've been on this forum for 9 years now so presumably you are not a child but seriously, grow up!

You know what? You're absolutely right!! I am truly that thick, it's just that I needed someone to point it out to me. Thank you, I am truly grateful for your penetrating insight into my true character.

Just one small point - I've been on this forum since the mid/late Nineties, and the biggest change I've seen is that the humour that used to be on here has largely gone. There always were heated discussions, but they were always carried out with mutual respect between the protaganists (well, nearly always).

Oh, just one more small point - just because you don't see the humour in something, it doesn't mean that it wasn't meant to be humorous!!

Wrong. Humour is a received art not just a transmitted one. It is only funny if the recipient finds it so, otherwise it is usually just offensive.

[West Stand Flash]

Typical tin pot Reading fans living in the past. Easily poorest player this season.

[melonhead]

massive LOL @ ^^that

not even close

[Z175]

I think people savaging Leigertwood for not being able to pass or remain in possession for more than a few seconds, probably think that Buffon never scored enough goals or Thierry Henry was crap at tackling...

Hes had 2 or 3 awful games, but even in those he's probably been our only player to win a tackle. Rest of the time hes been a collusus in the middle, let down by the fact that once he wins the ball (which he does over 80% of the time, in the PL!), theres absolutely no options, and nothing Reading can do with it, so its either kicked out of player or passed back in anxious circumstances. Karacan and the full backs were always options last year, but now they are just marked out of the game. Brian realised this and brought in Akpan, who has the strength and vision for this league, but hes just too raw at the moment.

I'd also say Legs was consistently 7/8 last year... And the season before, we didn't lose in his first 20 or so league games?! Thats consistency!

[Snowball]

Spot on, Z


Remember that L-Wood has been responsible for two phenomenal runs, the one when he arrived
and the race to being Championship winners last year.

In the same way as a lone striker can be made to look awful by poor service,
or a winger can be starved of the ball, or a fullback seriously exposed when
he gets no cover from midfield, so it is with L-wood. If he doesn't have close support,
options, after winning the ball, he will have problems.

How many games have we played 442 and we have been outnumbered?

How many games have we played 451 but against world-class midfields?

I said, before, L-wood is a rock, but he needs two good midfielders alongside him.

Without him, I doubt we'd've got 12 points this season

[melonhead]

Spot on, Z


Remember that L-Wood has been responsible for two phenomenal runs, the one when he arrived
and the race to being Championship winners last year.

In the same way as a lone striker can be made to look awful by poor service,
or a winger can be starved of the ball, or a fullback seriously exposed when
he gets no cover from midfield, so it is with L-wood. If he doesn't have close support,
options, after winning the ball, he will have problems.

How many games have we played 442 and we have been outnumbered?

How many games have we played 451 but against world-class midfields?

I said, before, L-wood is a rock, but he needs two good midfielders alongside him.

Without him, I doubt we'd've got 12 points this season

yes.

totally agreed.

people slagging him, and mcanuff know oxf*rd all about the game

[maffff]

.....and people criticising him for Rio strolling past. Isn't there a defence behind Leigertwood that are equally if not more culpable?

How many other times did he put a block or a tackle in and stop pressure on the defence?

[Ian Royal]

.....and people criticising him for Rio strolling past. Isn't there a defence behind Leigertwood that are equally if not more culpable?

How many other times did he put a block or a tackle in and stop pressure on the defence?

Not really, Mariappa(?) put a better challenge in and Pearce got a block on Rooney's shot.

Leigertwood is very good Championship player who's not quite good enough for the PL, although he'd probably be ok if he was surrounded by proper PL quality players who could carry his weaknesses. Everything about him is just a little too sluggish to properly cope at this level where the speed of thought, reactions and strength of the players is so much greater than at a lower level. He's no where near as bad as the worst of his detractors claim though. And his passing this season hasn't been helped by McDermott's 'kick and rush' approach and a total lack of movement from most of the rest of the team (although he's pretty guilt of that too).

He's the only midfielder we have who's got good height, strength, and tackling ability all in one package. And that's why he's kept playing.

[Hampshire Royal]

.....and people criticising him for Rio strolling past. Isn't there a defence behind Leigertwood that are equally if not more culpable?

How many other times did he put a block or a tackle in and stop pressure on the defence?

What???? You mean Rio Ferdinand, who plays for the best team in the country and is a current International, got past Leigertwood? That just proves how rubbish he is and fully deserves the scapegoat title. McDermott out............

[Millsy]

I don't know how anyone can call Legs a decent striker when he's not scored many for us!

[Only one Trevor Morley]

a good player occasionally. great when he joined on loan, more sporadic since. similarities with salako in that respect.

I'm slightly fed up with players like ledge though.... the thought of signing and effectively using a better ball playing midfielder who would thrive under poy/adkins is exciting. yes he has done a lot for reading but i'd just like to be excited by a bit more flair...

[Hampshire Royal]

The fact that you believe Gunter to be German shows your complete lack of knowledge about Reading.
Are you just trolling with your accusations of racism or are you truly that thick?
Your concept of "pure Suvvern" equates to essentially only three Reading players: Shorey, Morrison and McCarthy. Are you seriously suggesting that criticism of any player apart from these ones is due to fans being racist?

You've been on this forum for 9 years now so presumably you are not a child but seriously, grow up!

You know what? You're absolutely right!! I am truly that thick, it's just that I needed someone to point it out to me. Thank you, I am truly grateful for your penetrating insight into my true character.

Just one small point - I've been on this forum since the mid/late Nineties, and the biggest change I've seen is that the humour that used to be on here has largely gone. There always were heated discussions, but they were always carried out with mutual respect between the protaganists (well, nearly always).

Oh, just one more small point - just because you don't see the humour in something, it doesn't mean that it wasn't meant to be humorous!!

Wrong. Humour is a received art not just a transmitted one. It is only funny if the recipient finds it so, otherwise it is usually just offensive.

I am well aware that humour is a 'received art not a transmitted one'. However, what I said was not necessarily wrong, because what I said was that the fact that if you don't see something as funny, it doesn't alter the fact that it was meant (by the transmitter of the humour) to be funny.
The real problem with forums like this is that it can be difficult to spot irony in the written word, particularly if you're one of those tightly-bound individuals that have the ability to only see the written word, and not the real meaning behind it. I blame the 'McDonalds University' type of education that we have now.

[Z175]

This sensible debate has been sidetracked by the usual accusations of racism v sense of humour failure...

So how did Gunter get his German name?

Actually we have a few funny names, both our right wing Jamaicans have Scottish clan names, our northern striker sounds oddly French and what the hell is the origin of the name Leigertwood?!

[Hampshire Royal]

Oh, for goodness sake!!

[P!ssed Off]

I am well aware that humour is a 'received art not a transmitted one'. However, what I said was not necessarily wrong, because what I said was that the fact that if you don't see something as funny, it doesn't alter the fact that it was meant (by the transmitter of the humour) to be funny.
The real problem with forums like this is that it can be difficult to spot irony in the written word, particularly if you're one of those tightly-bound individuals that have the ability to only see the written word, and not the real meaning behind it. I blame the 'McDonalds University' type of education that we have now.

Your first comment regarding black players was not "humour" whatsoever.

""Reading fans don't like black players" - LOL, just kidding why did nobody get the joke?"

Your second comment was possibly meant to be humour, it didn't seem like a logical argument that would come from a logical person anyway, hence why I asked if you were trolling.

Anyway, I don't believe that my education is the reason for your lack of comedy, but maybe that comment was another 'joke'.

Either you attempted to tell a joke about racism that was not remotely funny or you simply accused others of being racist. Either way this ones on you, don't blame your audience if two jokes in a row fail badly.

Finally, for future reference what possibly gave you the idea that racism in football was a good topic for comedy? I'd leave that out of your next routine.

[Hampshire Royal]

Thanks for the advice about how I should conduct myself on stage. I'll bear it in mind!
Funnily enough I'm on stage tonight playing a really nasty racist character. Great fun!
The whole point of my post was to ask the question 'why is it that McAnuff and Leigertwood are singled out to be scapegoats, when they have been two of the most consistently good performers in this most awful of seasons?'
I know I am sensitive to racism - I am white, married to a black woman. I hear and see racism everywhere we go. She, to her credit, tells me to tone down my reactions as 'it happens all the time and we can't change it, just ignore it'.

[LoyalRoyal22]

Not mobile or technically good enough for a starting place each week in the Premier League. The end