Brian: The right decision?

[Woodcote Royal]

WR does it again. Transparently disappeared last time we went on a decent run, he doesn't bother posting when we secure a credible draw with QPR, but sure enough turns up again when we take a point at Blackburn.

Yep, having a life means I tend to ration the time I spend in the presence of Grade A twats discussing the same depressing football and results.

For those who don't reside in Bodkin's backside, QPR was an OK result in a sea of mediocrity from a squad that should be wiping the floor with the likes of Sheffield Wednesday when, in fact, it was they and Peterborough who used us as a mop and bucket

Anyone with more than 3 brain cells could spend their entire day posting about how cr@p we've been this season because the good days have been few and far between but some have better things to do.

Fair enough. I fully accept that your busy periods happen to coincide with our better results.

Frankly, QPR was a lost opportunity but at least it was against a decent side.

[LoyalRoyalFan]

People like Royalee and winchester_royal would be thrilled to see us keep 51% of possession in League Two.

THE ADKINS REVOLUTION

[Hoop Blah]

You are trying to justify the sacking of Brian, when the facts at present suggest otherwise, HTH.

The facts suggest it was the wrong decision, not that it was a horrific immoral decision.

Sacking McDermott was the right decision irrespective of the success or failure of Adkins tenure.

[Big Foot]

You are trying to justify the sacking of Brian, when the facts at present suggest otherwise, HTH.

The facts suggest it was the wrong decision, not that it was a horrific immoral decision.

Sacking McDermott was the right decision irrespective of the success or failure of Adkins tenure.

IMO It would've been had he been sacked 51 weeks ago. We lost against Wigan & Villa (as we did with he 2 defeats which preceded McDermott's sacking in Feb 2013) & the new manager coming in would've had a month before the transfer window to get settled + the transfer window to act.

The other obvious positive of sacking McDermott at that time would've been that Adkins' was off the market so we wouldn't have to put up with him.

Sacking McDermott when we did was wrong.

[winchester_royal]

People like Royalee and winchester_royal would be thrilled to see us keep 51% of possession in League Two.

THE ADKINS REVOLUTION

Seriously m8, you're embarrassing yourself.

[winchester_royal]

You are trying to justify the sacking of Brian, when the facts at present suggest otherwise, HTH.

The facts suggest it was the wrong decision, not that it was a horrific immoral decision.

Sacking McDermott was the right decision irrespective of the success or failure of Adkins tenure.

I agree, personally I think it was the right call and don't see how Brian doing well at a new club changes the fact that he'd lost the dressing room and fanbase here. He'll have learnt plenty of lessons from it, just like Rodgers did, and is a better manager as a result. That doesn't mean he'd necessarily have made it work here though, and those that argue that he would have because of what he's now doing at Leeds by the same logic must also state that it was wrong to get rid of Rodgers.

[Hoop Blah]

@ Big Foot, I think that would've been far too early and the club rightly gave McDermott enough time and opportunity to save his season and prove he could either keep us up or start evolving us in the right direction.

His last throw of the dice was to win the Wigan and Villa games, which we didn't come anywhere close to doing, and that failure was his last act.

[SPARTA]

You are trying to justify the sacking of Brian, when the facts at present suggest otherwise, HTH.

The facts suggest it was the wrong decision, not that it was a horrific immoral decision.

Sacking McDermott was the right decision irrespective of the success or failure of Adkins tenure.

Agreed. He had taken this club as far as he could have, and whilst he would have stayed and tried to take us back up, he had lost a lot of the dressing room and you very rarely come back from that. Adkins is a very good manager, but Reading fans want everything and they want it now; they're not prepared to wait.

Lets not forget we were struggling around mid-table with McDermott before TSI came in and threw some money at the team. Roberts was the perfect signing for our backs against the wall lump it style, and it paid dividends. But without that investment or those signings, we were staring at a 9th or 10th place that season - much you might argue we look like doing this season (at this point). You have to give the guy time. He's trying to create a passing culture rather than a panic and hit it long culture that was built into McDermott's squad. We've seen improvements in how we're trying to play (building from the back and trying to create space), but a lot of McDermott's old boys still look very uncomfortable with the ball at their feet, hence Adkins mixing it up a bit and us still using the odd long ball. Saints weren't exactly Arsenal! They passed it about, they moved very well and created plenty of chances through the middle and down the wings, but they too had a physical presence about them, and played a few long balls too!

I for one hope Adkins sticks around for at least two full seasons. I'd like to see a few of the older players move on and see some youth get a chance, and see what they can bring to the team (energy and fearlessness for a start).

People pining for McDermott after all this time is actually pretty sad.

[Elm Park Kid]

I said back in March that it was the wrong decision and I stick by that.

Maybe McDermott wasn't the right type of manager to take us forward, maybe in the long run it was better that we got rid of him, but the fact was that his long term results with the team meant he deserved to see out the season. I still feel as though there is an open wound within the club and is one of the reasons that we haven't warmed to Adkins.

[Cureton's Volley]

Simples really he was flavour of the month so got the Liverpool job on the back of his work at Swansea, not that he had to much work at Swansea because the club was tailor made for him thanks to Martinez and he's managing a top 6 team because A. the retirement of Sir Alex Ferguson has had a big effect on the stability of the established order in the PL and B. His team have only really beaten one of the teams around them, Man United when they were smack bang in the process of recovering from Ferguson retiring. The rest of their big games they've either lost or drawn Arsenal, Southampton and Everton so basically they are flat track bullies chewing up the likes of Sunderland and Crystal Palace.

Some people fit at certain clubs Rodgers in theory should have fitted in at Reading, having been here from a young age. His problem was that he went to Chelsea and became Mr Billy Big Bollocks so when he came back he was a pompous, Mourinho light, d1ck who spouted shit about "World class models" and "Skilful Soldiers". We were right to sack him because he and his personality didn't fit in here same as Adkins and his personality doesn't fit in here.

It might be frustrating for people on HNA? who want Reading to follow the crowd and be like whichever club and style of play is in fashion but there is a Reading way whether you like it or not. That way is a club that spent most of it's time bumping along in the bottom two divisions and has understatedly and sensibly grown and outperformed "bigger clubs" in the same division over the last decade plus. That means we suit managers like Steve Coppell and Brian McDermott who are sensible and understated. You might be frustrated with it and it may not be glamorous but that is just the way it is.

[Big Foot]

@ Big Foot, I think that would've been far too early and the club rightly gave McDermott enough time and opportunity to save his season and prove he could either keep us up or start evolving us in the right direction.

His last throw of the dice was to win the Wigan and Villa games, which we didn't come anywhere close to doing, and that failure was his last act.

I, like most fans, thought (& still do think) that McDermott is/was the right man to try and take us back up.

[Cureton's Volley]

McD is going to get a nasty taste of deja vu. If Leeds go up there is plenty of money waiting to be invested (with real money, unlike the invisible man's) and they will want prem style football and real results for that investment. He'll be out before Xmas next year.

...or perhaps, as an intelligent person, relatively new to management, he'll learn from his mistakes first time around...

+1 to this.

I remember him saying on Goals on Sunday shortly after he was sacked that he would be stronger for last season's experience. I also remember around this time 2 years ago in his interview with Richard Keys and Andy Gray on Talksport that the playoff final hurt had made him stronger. I didn't have any great expectations that season but came away from that interview feeling positive about the future - and we all know what happened some 5 months later.

That's what I didn't get about last season, I admit he did struggle but it was his first season at that level, if he'd taken us back up and struggled again then that would have been a case for him to go, but he had less than a year. Apart from anything else his record with us I felt allowed him a bad season. An overall record that imo is still better than anyone we've had - including Coppell.

McDermott was sacked in February having won Prem MOM in January.

Having won 1 of his last 6, Bodkins quest for a superior style of play is producing worse performances in the 2nd tier............................Nige needs a good December or it could be curtains in the new year.

And, frankly, I could live with that. Forget dead slow and stop, we've been in reverse since the day he arrived. I don't buy the view that he should be given lots of time because, IMHO, it's time we don't have.

McDermott's legacy was 4 seasons of parachute payments, brilliantly secured on a shoestring, and right now it's all being wasted on some of the most turgid sh+t I've seen at this club. Worst of all, it's coming from what must surely be the most expensively assembled squad we've ever had at this level.

I know there are a number of tiny brains who infest this forum so, just to be clear, I've never had the slightest inclination to support Leeds and continue to stump up £400+ for my seat at the Mad Stad. It will take a lot more than a know nothing Russian and his 2nd rate manager for this to change but I think I'm entitled to expect something on offer to tempt me into sitting in the damn thing once in a while

Both very good posts

[Zana Badawi]

I, like most fans, thought (& still do think) that McDermott is/was the right man to try and take us back up.

I'm one of those fans.
However, we cant ignore the fact that the Wigan game was Brian's worst week at Reading. He said the wrong things before the game, picked the wrong team, picked the wrong formation and said the wrong things after the game.

The reason that wasn't a sackable offence is that we then went on to advertise ourselves as a Premiership team to any incoming manager. Any incoming manager worth their salt would have seen through this and, so its no surprise when we end up with a manager who isn't worth their salt. That's the folly of Anton's decision - he got exactly what he asked for. Sadly, we the fans have to suffer as well. Surely its obvious that the club needs a reality check. Sadly, I cant see how we can get out of this unmotivated mess we're in without removing Adkins and getting a more realistic manager in. I cant help feeling that if we still had Brian, we would only be facing the problems a relegated side faces, without the complications of a club believing they are something they aren't. I would say that Adkins is on the same wavelength as our delusional owner, and not on the same wavelength as the players or the fans. That frustrates me more than any run of poor form.

PS. Are there still fans denying Rodgers has been successful. Its one thing saying he didn't suit Reading, but that doesn't mean he hasn't been successful elsewhere.

[stealthpapes]

They killed the fucking dog?

[winchester_royal]

I, like most fans, thought (& still do think) that McDermott is/was the right man to try and take us back up.

I'm one of those fans.
However, we cant ignore the fact that the Wigan game was Brian's worst week at Reading. He said the wrong things before the game, picked the wrong team, picked the wrong formation and said the wrong things after the game.

The reason that wasn't a sackable offence is that we then went on to advertise ourselves as a Premiership team to any incoming manager. Any incoming manager worth their salt would have seen through this and, so its no surprise when we end up with a manager who isn't worth their salt. That's the folly of Anton's decision - he got exactly what he asked for. Sadly, we the fans have to suffer as well. Surely its obvious that the club needs a reality check. Sadly, I cant see how we can get out of this unmotivated mess we're in without removing Adkins and getting a more realistic manager in. I cant help feeling that if we still had Brian, we would only be facing the problems a relegated side faces, without the complications of a club believing they are something they aren't. I would say that Adkins is on the same wavelength as our delusional owner, and not on the same wavelength as the players or the fans. That frustrates me more than any run of poor form.

PS. Are there still fans denying Rodgers has been successful. Its one thing saying he didn't suit Reading, but that doesn't mean he hasn't been successful elsewhere.

Sure, and it's one thing saying that Brian's time at Reading coming to an end was best for both parties and that he'd go on to do well somewhere else, and it's another saying that he's completely useless and any other team he took charge of would immediately get relegated.

The point I'm making is that just because Brian is doing well at Leeds that doesn't necessarily make it so that he'd have led us to glory this season. A fresh start with new players that he didn't have entrenched opinions on was the best thing for him imho, and it doesn't come as a huge surprise to me that the one player he took with him to Leeds has had a pretty atrocious season thus far.

[melonhead]

They killed the fucking dog?

melonhead autoreply generator:
did someone mention me?

[floyd__streete]

he had lost a lot of the dressing room

Worst. Cliche. Ever.

Privy to conversations within the inner sanctums of the Madejski Stadium are we?

And your assertion that we were heading for a midtable finish without the signing of Roberts could in some way be seen to be a fair one.....but it totally disregards the context of the 5th place finish the season before. And of course BMc had to sell his best player - the player whom we had built our team around the previous season - in successive summer transfer windows and still took us to 5th place and then 1st place. Compare that to the generous-looking budget Adkins has spaffed on ageing, crocked left backs and overweight unfit wingers.

People 'pining for McDermott' could - as you say - be seen as 'sad'.....but belittling his achievements whilst bigging up the supposed superior football we are playing under Adkins in the face of the dull and uninspiring reality is downright tragic. Under Brian in his last 12 months alone we had West Ham and Saints away, two of the most gripping and clinical performances I have ever seen from Reading and even in that last, chastening season we still had some belting games such as a 3-4 against would-be Champions Man Utd. In 8 months under Adkins we've had, what, 45 pleasant minutes of football against Watford. And that has been just about it really in terms of excitement. Still, as long as we win 55-45 in terms of possession stats eh

[Hoop Blah]

@ Big Foot, I think that would've been far too early and the club rightly gave McDermott enough time and opportunity to save his season and prove he could either keep us up or start evolving us in the right direction.

His last throw of the dice was to win the Wigan and Villa games, which we didn't come anywhere close to doing, and that failure was his last act.

I, like most fans, thought (& still do think) that McDermott is/was the right man to try and take us back up.

McDermott of two years previous to his sacking maybe. McDermott with the baggage of 12 months of mistakes and getting dicked on week in week out and then having to rebuild a team by bringing in players who weren't in his pocket from his previous roles in the club, I'm not so sure.

Sometimes things just run their course and a fresh voice is needed.

[Zana Badawi]

The point I'm making is that just because Brian is doing well at Leeds that doesn't necessarily make it so that he'd have led us to glory this season. A fresh start with new players that he didn't have entrenched opinions on was the best thing for him imho, and it doesn't come as a huge surprise to me that the one player he took with him to Leeds has had a pretty atrocious season thus far.

No-one knows how good or bad Brian would have been this season.

The argument is that we have to stop making excuses for Adkins - that just makes us as deluded as the club. I've heard/read all sorts of nonsense about Adkins, not least from Adkins himself. IMO, we're a demotivated mess and it doesn't matter how much of a shift Pog puts in, or what possession stats we have, or that Guthrie can play a Hollywood pass every now and then - the fact is the club is sliding away from the reality that we are in the championship and we aren't entitled to get promoted from it. I believe Adkins is cruising as much as the Team Board is at the moment - desperately looking for chinks of light rather than addressing the problems at hand. That makes him a suspect manager in my book.

I repeat I have no idea if Brian could do any better, but I thought he was a decent manager with a ropey team in the championship last time. I feel a bit sorry for Adkins - he's been set up to fail (but he took the job when he knew it was set up to fail), but the time has come for him to get his head out of the clouds, lower his expectations, motivate the team and not come home from a tricky away game contented, when we could have won it with a stonewall penalty. If he don't care, why should we?

And the Noel Hunt analogy doesn't work. The last time we gave away all the club players who cared about the club was under Burns and we took years to get over that.

[Zana Badawi]

Sometimes things just run their course and a fresh voice is needed.

Id agree if we were talking about Coppell - he went stale a good year before he left.
Brian hadn't gone stale. A club is a club. It isn't just a manager. Anyone could see the club was a mess last year and it wasn't just McDermott. He was the fall guy for a number of people. Probably the same people who leaked a photo of us talking to a player in the transfer window and then made a story out of it.

I will say again that Brian was dreadful in the Wigan game, but surely everybody has bad weeks?