Wolves - back from the sofa

[Maguire]

Surprised at the negativity on here. I really enjoyed the game and the last three home matches have been better than any of the shit Adkins has previously been serving up during his tenure here.

Norwood looks a player to me. A little in the Simon Osborn mould - linking play, moving the ball left to right and back again, good range of passing.

Murray is getting a tough rap on this board IMHO. He's a very good footballer who knows how to the lead the line in a way Pogrebnyak (who I like) does not. He'll score goals as well - great signing.

The downsides were that Pearce appeared to be drunk and Guthrie remains a horrible little bellend.

Still, RFC are a work in progress and I can see some progress so I for one am happy enough with yesterday's game.

[Ian Royal]

Not many Sandman.

Guthrie has had relatively few actively poor games like yesterday. He's had a fair few where he hasn't lived up to expectations, plenty where he's been fine and a few where he's been outstanding.

Same as most players really. Unlike Akpan, who's had few properly good games, at least one horrifically bad one - just about the worst midfield display I've ever seen and I saw the Burns sides - and lots of actively poor ones.

[teignmouth hoops]

I thought the defence was poor again, the goals we conceded were comical in the extreme and I guess Obita was due a bad game. I thought the game was passing by Akpan and I wasn't surprised when he came off at half time, he was just being passed around all the time and wasn't really getting involved, other than the one shot I think. I was surprised by Guthrie coming on as I thought any idjit would see that a Guthrie/Norwood partnership was never going to work without someone there to cover them and they were just overrun time and again - rank stupidity from Adkins for me. Also thought Guthrie was shown up by Kuhl once he came on, and as far as I am concerned the kid should be giving a prolonged run in the team, he is too good to be left on the bench.

One other thing, as I just saw that Murray is apparently winning the race for the man of the match award on Twitter, why exactly? Not convinced he would have scored without the deflection, I thought he was poor again and still don't see what he offers over Pog.

You thought he was poor, and don't see what he offers over the Pog, well for starters he works a lot harder, wins more balls, scores more goals, doesn't fall over like he's been shot, links up play better, communicates, looks like he cares, and is on probably half the money

[Ian Royal]

I'll start worrying about Murray when he has a dry spell of about 4 - 5 games where he doesn't even look like scoring.

So far he's had good chances in pretty much every game he's played and he's scored 3. That'll do. By contrast, I can recall Pog going games in a row with barely a sniff of an attempt at goal. Pog's alright too.

[Brum Royal]

I thought we were good value for a point yesterday. Two fairly fragile looking defences, allowing space and opportunity for some of the more creative players on either side to operate. Norwood had another good game, I've been really impressed with him in all the games I've watched him now, his range of passing is fantastic, and a great cross for the opener too. Equally for Wolves, Sako is a beast. Looks a very skilful player, and a big lad as well. Adkins finally looks to be getting his possession orientated, passing game now, helped by a fulcrum of Norwood, and virtually all the players look comfortable to receive the ball and play a pass. We played some very good possession football at times in both halves. I say virtually all, Akpan looks to be the exception. Nervy on the ball and doesn't look like he wants to receive it either, whether it's because he knows he's the fan's scapegoat and that is weighing on him, or because he genuinely is not comfortable on the ball.

Murray and Cox looking to be building a decent understanding now too, some good link up play.

I agreed with strap's comment earlier about slow starts to both halves, except we were a bit fortunate that Wolves didn't capitalise on it in the first half - it was definitely a game we grew into. That said, I thought at half time we were relatively comfortable, and in hindsight after the way the second half panned out I can't quite work out whether that was despite Akpan or because of Akpan.

I also agree with Gunter looking to be the weak point in the defence at the moment. Admittedly up against a very tricky opponent in Sako, but a combination of not getting enough defensive support from Taylor and not getting tight enough to Sako to stop crosses or shut him down, did lead to quite a few nervy moments. However, he does contribute a lot going forwards, and I do think we're better off with him in there than Cummings.

It was a definite bonus having a defunct PA system yesterday, much better without the goal music. Hopefully we will have more of that, now the club remembers we are capable of enjoying a goal without having to bounce around like berks to a bit of music. "Who are ya" and finger pointing is obviously a much more sophisticated celebration

[Snowball]

Murray is getting a LOT of attention from defenders, a lot of it illegal
and thereby he's making space for others as well as wearing down the
opposition centre-backs.

Second he's returning after a LONG time out of the game, he's new
to RFC and to the striking partnerships.

And his record despite this, 4 Starts, 312 minutes, 3 goals @ 104 minutes per goal. Crap, right?

04 0,312 03 104 Mins/Goal Murray
06 0,498 00 498 Mins/Goal Pog

39 3,102 13 246 Mins/Goal Pog 2013-14

[Jano]

Figures don't really tell the whole story. Pog, when playing, has been stuck in a team creating next to no chances. Since Murray has come in along with the other new signings, we have been creating a huge amount more (admittedly that could be down to Murray/Pog being out of the team). I'd be very interested to see how Pog would do instead of Murray at the moment, as I think he would do somewhat better than he had been. I don't think Murray has been leading the line/winning headers any more than Pog was, and he seems to be getting bullied by defenders just as much as Pog was.

[teignmouth hoops]

Figures don't really tell the whole story. Pog, when playing, has been stuck in a team creating next to no chances. Since Murray has come in along with the other new signings, we have been creating a huge amount more (admittedly that could be down to Murray/Pog being out of the team). I'd be very interested to see how Pog would do instead of Murray at the moment, as I think he would do somewhat better than he had been. I don't think Murray has been leading the line/winning headers any more than Pog was, and he seems to be getting bullied by defenders just as much as Pog was.

Sorry still can't agree, part of it is about attitude and understanding the English game and what you need to do as a team player. He just doesn't seem to want to scrap enough in games when things aren't going our way, also Pog has had some games this season and played the other night at Derby for a full 90 mins

[Wycombe Royal]

Second he's returning after a LONG time out of the game

He made his return from injury on the 8th February this year, nearly 8 months ago...and he has now appeared in 21 matches since then. Yes the majority were substitute appearances but to say "he's returning" is a wide of the mark....

[Thomas L'Heureux]

Figures don't really tell the whole story. Pog, when playing, has been stuck in a team creating next to no chances. Since Murray has come in along with the other new signings, we have been creating a huge amount more (admittedly that could be down to Murray/Pog being out of the team). I'd be very interested to see how Pog would do instead of Murray at the moment, as I think he would do somewhat better than he had been. I don't think Murray has been leading the line/winning headers any more than Pog was, and he seems to be getting bullied by defenders just as much as Pog was.

Further to this, Cox is a very good foil for both. I've been incredibly impressed with him; his work-rate and know-how have brought a lot to this team. He's very sly, and despite his lack of real pace often gets the better of his marker. For me Pogrebnyak would definitely be more of a threat with Cox linking the play than he has been in recent seasons, although that isn't to say I'd play him over Murray (as I wouldn't).

[Snowball]

Second he's returning after a LONG time out of the game

He made his return from injury on the 8th February this year, nearly 8 months ago...and he has now appeared in 21 matches since then. Yes the majority were substitute appearances but to say "he's returning" is a wide of the mark....

He played a TOTAL of 403 minutes last season and 16 minutes this before joining us. That's four-and-a-half 90 minute games. Wowser.

[The Goat was fed]

Positives:
- Scored three goals against a team that had barely conceded all season.
- Good 'grit' to come back twice. We 100% wouldn't have done that last year.
- Simon Cox/Glenn Murray look like they've been playing together forever. Really good to watch.
- Happy for Jake Taylor. I think he's actually the most limited of the kids, but he keeps on turning up in good positions and you can't fault that.

Negatives:
- Terrible management from Adkins to bring off Akpan and bring on Guthrie. Sure Akpan wasn't having a blinder, but after the first five minutes Wolves created nothing in the first half, changing it was really poor. Sometimes, just by being in a certain position you force attackers to try something else. Sure if they actually knew you were crap they'd just charge past you, but they don't know that. They just know you're in a good defensive position. Akpan can do that, Guthrie can't.
- I'm sorry Ian Royal, but Danny Guthrie is a horrible piece of work and doesn't even have the good grace to be our best player, he's crap. I think it's fair to say Norwood is a substantial improvement and you know why? He plays the ball quickly. Danny Guthrie takes all year to make his mind up before trying some vanity ball with the defence set. Guthrie kills our tempo. Know football, know that to be true.
- Defence still so leaky. Obita can be forgiven for that monstrosity as it's just "face palm" not indicative of some more substantial flaw. Gunter appears to get targeted by teams with good wingers and Pearce just can't deal with anything when he's facing his own goal.


Overall:
- There's enough positives to think we've got a real chance of getting play-offs this year.
- If Jem Karacan, Danny Williams and G-Mac all come back "as they were" after lengthy layoffs, the majority of our problem areas are fixed. Genuinely interested to see who gets in the midfield with everyone fit.

[Snowball]

Apart from 6 in 12 for Fulham (a hat-trick first game distorts the figures) Pog hasn't looked prolific these last few years
whereas Murray had a brilliant season before his injury and has started very well in goals/minute terms for us


Murray has a career average of a goal every two games.

The stats below are for all games/levels and Pog has played more top-level football, but...


279 Apps 088 Goals 28 Assists 20287 Minutes = 231 Mins/Goal POGREBNYAK
338 Apps 130 Goals 36 Assists 23729 Minutes = 183 Mins/Goal MURRAY



Shame we'll never go 442. Maybe Pog could play RW

[Bandini]

Norwood looks a player to me. A little in the Simon Osborn mould - linking play, moving the ball left to right and back again, good range of passing.

Murray is getting a tough rap on this board IMHO. He's a very good footballer who knows how to the lead the line in a way Pogrebnyak (who I like) does not. He'll score goals as well - great signing.

The downsides were that Pearce appeared to be drunk and Guthrie remains a horrible little bellend.

From the sofa here, but agreed with all of that (apart from the fact that is was "Osborne", obviously). Nice to have Cox back.

I'll add that Murray looks like a friend of a friend who whenever I saw him in the pub brought along his stuff (book, umbrella, things like that) in a Tesco carrier bag.

[Wycombe Royal]

Second he's returning after a LONG time out of the game

He made his return from injury on the 8th February this year, nearly 8 months ago...and he has now appeared in 21 matches since then. Yes the majority were substitute appearances but to say "he's returning" is a wide of the mark....

He played a TOTAL of 403 minutes last season and 16 minutes this before joining us. That's four-and-a-half 90 minute games. Wowser.

You do realise that in this time he has also been completing full training sessions and playing some reserve games. Like I said he is not "returning", he "returned" quite a while a go.

So if he played these 403 minutes over a period of 2 years since coming back from his injury would he still be "returning" in your eyes?

[Royalwaster]

Apart from 6 in 12 for Fulham (a hat-trick first game distorts the figures) Pog hasn't looked prolific these last few years
whereas Murray had a brilliant season before his injury and has started very well in goals/minute terms for us


Murray has a career average of a goal every two games.

The stats below are for all games/levels and Pog has played more top-level football, but...


279 Apps 088 Goals 28 Assists 20287 Minutes = 231 Mins/Goal POGREBNYAK
338 Apps 130 Goals 36 Assists 23729 Minutes = 183 Mins/Goal MURRAY



Shame we'll never go 442. Maybe Pog could play RW

A bit embarrassed to agree with Snowball ... but totally agree that Murray is far better option at moment than Pog; thought Pog did a good job for us last season - was the only one who could hold the ball up for us sometimes up front ... but I just find he lacks mobility and just doesn't score enough goals. Murray just looks to me so much more like goal machine. Also, I think we've not yet seen the best of him - on Sunday, he clearly tired in the 2nd half and hopefully with fitness training and more matches will be able to last the full 90 minutes with the same workrate as the 1st half. Still nice to have Pog as a sub .... quite exciting to think of Pog and Murray up front in a game we're chasing ...

[Royal Rother]

I'm just glad that Murray at least makes some kind of an effort to stay upright when a defender gets within 2 feet of him.

Refreshing.

[Vision]

Surprised at the negativity on here. I really enjoyed the game and the last three home matches have been better than any of the shit Adkins has previously been serving up during his tenure here.

Norwood looks a player to me. A little in the Simon Osborn mould - linking play, moving the ball left to right and back again, good range of passing.

Murray is getting a tough rap on this board IMHO. He's a very good footballer who knows how to the lead the line in a way Pogrebnyak (who I like) does not. He'll score goals as well - great signing.

The downsides were that Pearce appeared to be drunk and Guthrie remains a horrible little bellend.

Still, RFC are a work in progress and I can see some progress so I for one am happy enough with yesterday's game.

I'll go along with this pretty much although once he'd settled down I thought Guthrie grew into the game pretty well. Norwood looked equally at home pushed a bit further forward when Kuhl came on as he was when playing in front of the back four. Genuinely quality signing and likewise Murray who may be a bit greedy and single minded but won't go missing ala Le Fondre whenn the going gets tough and will deliver goals unlike Pog.

[Snowball]

You do realise that in this time he has also been completing full training sessions and playing some reserve games. Like I said he is not "returning", he "returned" quite a while a go.

So if he played these 403 minutes over a period of 2 years since coming back from his injury would he still be "returning" in your eyes?

His injury was May 2013

He was out, badly injured, came back February last season for 4/5 games, then, since (and including) March 22nd he played 113 minutes first-team football.

This season he got 16 minutes. So that's 129 minutes competitive football in 27 weeks, less than 1.5 90-minute games.

Training, reserve games, under-21s are nothing like full-on competitive games. 403 minutes competitive football

That's from 12-May 2013 to 12-Sept 2014 = 16 Months = 25 minutes per month.

I say he's still coming back, and barring a fitness breakdown will improve for 3-4 months yet

[Ian Royal]

Second he's returning after a LONG time out of the game

He made his return from injury on the 8th February this year, nearly 8 months ago...and he has now appeared in 21 matches since then. Yes the majority were substitute appearances but to say "he's returning" is a wide of the mark....

He played a TOTAL of 403 minutes last season and 16 minutes this before joining us. That's four-and-a-half 90 minute games. Wowser.

But it shows he's been IN the game and he recovered from the injury that caused his lay off months ago.