Are to unhappy Steve Clark is staying?

[sandman]

If Clarke wasn't looking to go, he wouldn't have spoken to Fulham in the first place. Then there would have been none of this rubbish. It seems entirely feasible that he threw his toys out of the pram because he couldn't take his backroom staff - none of whom I think we'd miss.

However, clearly the board couldn't afford to lose the entire coaching team a few hours before our next match - therefore, I reckon we'll be lining up a new manager and backroom staff and as soon as they are ready to come, we'll ditch Clarke and "his" backroom staff and good riddance I say!

None of this suggests he was looking to go at all.

Likely cause of events is he was focused on prep for tomorrow. Howe gets a call from Fulham saying we'd like to talk to your manager, we're willing to pay £x if we employ him or even just for the right to talk. Howe goes OK, Steve Fulham would like to talk to you about their position, you are free to talk if you wish. He thinks OK, I'm happy here but that could be an interesting opportunity - so he goes for the talk to weigh up what is best for him (as I think we all would).

If the deal was out of this world (both financially and professionally) he may wellhave gone, it clearly wasn't so he stays with an employer that he is happy working for.

We all know that football clubs will get rid almost at a drop of a hat, so I have no problem with this having happened - his position is exactly as tenable as it was last week. Only results will dictate if it remains so. Lose a few more and drop off the pace and the owners won't think twice about replacing him - he knows that, you know that. Loyalty is pretty much a moot conceit in football.

He was in negotiations with them for two days. Doesn't sound like he just wanted to see what they were offering.

Yet he's still here just as he was yesterday when he turned up to work at Hogwood and took training and the day before when he turned up to work at Hogwood and took training.

[Pepe the Horseman]

In between going to see if he could get a better offer somewhere else

[CountryRoyal]

Yeah because Putney is so hard to get to from Reading... There's no way you could do the journey twice in one day, let alone two days in a row!

[Snowball136]

If Clarke wasn't looking to go, he wouldn't have spoken to Fulham in the first place. Then there would have been none of this rubbish. It seems entirely feasible that he threw his toys out of the pram because he couldn't take his backroom staff - none of whom I think we'd miss.

However, clearly the board couldn't afford to lose the entire coaching team a few hours before our next match - therefore, I reckon we'll be lining up a new manager and backroom staff and as soon as they are ready to come, we'll ditch Clarke and "his" backroom staff and good riddance I say!

None of this suggests he was looking to go at all.

Likely cause of events is he was focused on prep for tomorrow. Howe gets a call from Fulham saying we'd like to talk to your manager, we're willing to pay £x if we employ him or even just for the right to talk. Howe goes OK, Steve Fulham would like to talk to you about their position, you are free to talk if you wish. He thinks OK, I'm happy here but that could be an interesting opportunity - so he goes for the talk to weigh up what is best for him (as I think we all would).

If the deal was out of this world (both financially and professionally) he may wellhave gone, it clearly wasn't so he stays with an employer that he is happy working for.

We all know that football clubs will get rid almost at a drop of a hat, so I have no problem with this having happened - his position is exactly as tenable as it was last week. Only results will dictate if it remains so. Lose a few more and drop off the pace and the owners won't think twice about replacing him - he knows that, you know that. Loyalty is pretty much a moot conceit in football.

Agree

Reading around a bit it seems he was unhappy that he was "losing power at RFC" and he felt aggrieved at being dragged in to explain the recent run of dropped points.

Now if you were a manager with a newly-built team currently eighth and suffering some crucial injuries and a board you might consider as less than football-savvy drags you in, and they've already taken some of your power away, you can feel fairly certain that it's only a matter of time before they bite the pay-off bullet and replace you with a fancy name manager.

But then RFC find a way to get rid of you and not just avoid paying compensation but actually getting a pay-off. The two of those totalled together could be, what, 2-4 Million?

Club says, we know you've been unhappy recently (with us) but we don't mind if you talk to Fulham (cos we know but haven't told you that Fulham will gives us some money)

Clarke thinks, "I'd rather get RFC up this year but I'm worried that the board are interfering with transfers, team-selection (or whatever) and come January I'm going to be squeezed. RFC are happy for me to speak to Fulham - when they could just have said Eff-Off, so it's clear to me what's going on, how they feel about me."

Clarke goes to speak to Fulham, and it's going so-so, a small pay-rise.

But Fulham understand that RFC are looking to ship SC out so start to shrink/lower their offer.

SC thinks, "This is hardly worth it. I'll stay. I will get us in to the top six and the POs at worst. If the b@satrds want to get rid of me, they can pay me compo. OTOH, if the team comes right, and we are 2-3-4th December 31st, and I ask for transfer funding (and leak it) then I might still sneak the automatics."

Get to the POs, maybe get promoted and the next offer will be a lot better than Fulham's.

NOT get there, get the sack, there's a nice pay-off.

[sandman]

In between going to see if he could get a better offer somewhere else

Which he is perfectly within his right to do.

[melonhead]

theres no loyalty in football, apart from the fans loyalty to their club.
expecting it from players or managers is silly.
going all "I never liked him anyway" is the bentest thing ive seen since we did it to the last player/manager who wanted to leave

[melonhead]

In between going to see if he could get a better offer somewhere else

Which he is perfectly within his right to do.

its all about rights with you and steve clarke
what about responsibilities!

Eh?!

[WoodleyRoyal]

In between going to see if he could get a better offer somewhere else

Which he is perfectly within his right to do.

disagree sandman, he has a contract to see out. He has no 'right' to look elsewhere.

He can look elsewhere if he wants, of course. But to say he is 'well within his rights to' is just plain wrong.

[CountryRoyal]

theres no loyalty in football, apart from the fans loyalty to their club.
expecting it from players or managers is silly.
going all "I never liked him anyway" is the bentest thing ive seen since we did it to the last player/manager who wanted to leave

Tell that to Manchester City fans, Chelsea fans and the 5,000 "reading" fans that go back to supporting a prem side after each relegation from the top flight.

[Mr Angry]

What Clarke has said is that when any club he half fancies asks to speak to him, he will want to have that conversation, and if they offer him whatever it is he wants (be that salary, transfer funds, whatever) then he will leave us and join them.

To me, that's a terrible way for a manager to act (we have seen it with other Managers in the past, such as Poyet) as it means that everything he does is now simply for the short term, and a number of the players who might not be getting the game time they want, or aren't playing in the position that they want to be playing in, will think "this guy will be gone soon, so why should I give 100%??"

The feeling has to be that the next time a middle/top half Championship club sack their Manager, he will be off; thats no way to build a long term strategy to take the club forward.

[WoodleyRoyal]

What Clarke has said is that when any club he half fancies asks to speak to him, he will want to have that conversation, and if they offer him whatever it is he wants (be that salary, transfer funds, whatever) then he will leave us and join them.

To me, that's a terrible way for a manager to act (we have seen it with other Managers in the past, such as Poyet) as it means that everything he does is now simply for the short term, and a number of the players who might not be getting the game time they want, or aren't playing in the position that they want to be playing in, will think "this guy will be gone soon, so why should I give 100%??"

The feeling has to be that the next time a middle/top half Championship club sack their Manager, he will be off; thats no way to build a long term strategy to take the club forward.

but according to sandman he is well within his rights to do that

[CountryRoyal]

What Clarke has said is that when any club he half fancies asks to speak to him, he will want to have that conversation, and if they offer him whatever it is he wants (be that salary, transfer funds, whatever) then he will leave us and join them.

To me, that's a terrible way for a manager to act (we have seen it with other Managers in the past, such as Poyet) as it means that everything he does is now simply for the short term, and a number of the players who might not be getting the game time they want, or aren't playing in the position that they want to be playing in, will think "this guy will be gone soon, so why should I give 100%??"

The feeling has to be that the next time a middle/top half Championship club sack their Manager, he will be off; thats no way to build a long term strategy to take the club forward.

Not fookin short enough

[loyalroyaldaz]

If this were a player i would tell him to oxf*rd off and get out of the club now. Dont see why it should be any different for the Manager.

[sandman]

In between going to see if he could get a better offer somewhere else

Which he is perfectly within his right to do.

disagree sandman, he has a contract to see out. He has no 'right' to look elsewhere.

Disagree. He was open with his employers about his reasons, he informed his employers that he wanted to speak to the other party, his employers willingly shared details of his contract with the interested party and allowed him to talk to the interested party.

Howe said in his interview afterwards that everyone acted in the correct manner.

[wingnut]

The club have already shown they are with me. I had a good chat with the board last night. I’m not going to say everything is fine as they are a bit disappointed with the way things turned out this week, but it’s no problem now

Hmm
Dead man walking methinks.

[wingnut]

If Clarke wasn't looking to go, he wouldn't have spoken to Fulham in the first place. Then there would have been none of this rubbish. It seems entirely feasible that he threw his toys out of the pram because he couldn't take his backroom staff - none of whom I think we'd miss.

However, clearly the board couldn't afford to lose the entire coaching team a few hours before our next match - therefore, I reckon we'll be lining up a new manager and backroom staff and as soon as they are ready to come, we'll ditch Clarke and "his" backroom staff and good riddance I say!

None of this suggests he was looking to go at all.

Likely cause of events is he was focused on prep for tomorrow. Howe gets a call from Fulham saying we'd like to talk to your manager, we're willing to pay £x if we employ him or even just for the right to talk. Howe goes OK, Steve Fulham would like to talk to you about their position, you are free to talk if you wish. He thinks OK, I'm happy here but that could be an interesting opportunity - so he goes for the talk to weigh up what is best for him (as I think we all would).

If the deal was out of this world (both financially and professionally) he may wellhave gone, it clearly wasn't so he stays with an employer that he is happy working for.

We all know that football clubs will get rid almost at a drop of a hat, so I have no problem with this having happened - his position is exactly as tenable as it was last week. Only results will dictate if it remains so. Lose a few more and drop off the pace and the owners won't think twice about replacing him - he knows that, you know that. Loyalty is pretty much a moot conceit in football.

Agree

Reading around a bit it seems he was unhappy that he was "losing power at RFC" and he felt aggrieved at being dragged in to explain the recent run of dropped points.

Now if you were a manager with a newly-built team currently eighth and suffering some crucial injuries and a board you might consider as less than football-savvy drags you in, and they've already taken some of your power away, you can feel fairly certain that it's only a matter of time before they bite the pay-off bullet and replace you with a fancy name manager.

But then RFC find a way to get rid of you and not just avoid paying compensation but actually getting a pay-off. The two of those totalled together could be, what, 2-4 Million?

Club says, we know you've been unhappy recently (with us) but we don't mind if you talk to Fulham (cos we know but haven't told you that Fulham will gives us some money)

Clarke thinks, "I'd rather get RFC up this year but I'm worried that the board are interfering with transfers, team-selection (or whatever) and come January I'm going to be squeezed. RFC are happy for me to speak to Fulham - when they could just have said Eff-Off, so it's clear to me what's going on, how they feel about me."

Clarke goes to speak to Fulham, and it's going so-so, a small pay-rise.

But Fulham understand that RFC are looking to ship SC out so start to shrink/lower their offer.

SC thinks, "This is hardly worth it. I'll stay. I will get us in to the top six and the POs at worst. If the b@satrds want to get rid of me, they can pay me compo. OTOH, if the team comes right, and we are 2-3-4th December 31st, and I ask for transfer funding (and leak it) then I might still sneak the automatics."

Get to the POs, maybe get promoted and the next offer will be a lot better than Fulham's.

NOT get there, get the sack, there's a nice pay-off.

What a load of bollocks. There's absolutely no evidence the board are interfering with any aspect of the playing side.

[Armadillo Roadkill]

Here's two scenarios:

One:

My boss: "So, Mr. Roadkill, or may I call you Armadillo? So, Mr. Roadkill it is. I have a long term project I want you to commit to. I will give you as much backing as I can. I don't expect miracles, this is a long term project and I need to know you're committed."

Me: "You have my word. If another similar job comes along just a little while into the project that you're investing so much into and trusting me with, I won't entertain it."

Two:

My boss: "Now look here Roadkill, this is a dog-eat-dog business. One slip up and you're out. And no you can't go into the transfer or loan markets with my money, who do you think I am? Now get down that training pitch and get the results I want or you can do one."

Me: "OK, at least I know where I stand. I'll do my best, but obviously I've got crumpled tracksuits and a stash of Special Brew to pay for, so if I better offer comes along, you'll understand if I take it."

Which scenario do you think was the one played out when he joined, and was probably repeated again in the summer?

[Coppelled_Streets]

The club have already shown they are with me. I had a good chat with the board last night. I’m not going to say everything is fine as they are a bit disappointed with the way things turned out this week, but it’s no problem now

Hmm
Dead man walking methinks.

Yep! He needs a quick turn around in results otherwise he'll have another sacking on his CV. I wonder how many players he may have lost the backing of over this as well. Selling them his 'vision' (McShane for example, all the effort he made personally to convince him to come here), and then looking to bolt 4 months into the season for a club no bigger than ours, and in a lower league position. It wont sit will with the board or the fans; I'd be very surprised of it sits well with 'his' players.

[Gunny Fishcake]

"Everybody behaved very well. The club were great to me, they gave me the go-ahead to speak to Fulham. I had a good conversation with them and decided that what I had here was better for me at this stage."

Me, me, me ......what about us or the team ?

He's a dead man walking , get a replacement asap

[TBM]

Fulham were offering hm £80k a year more money

Why wouldn't he talk to them

Because that's probably not that big a pay rise for him ? And for the chance of what may be a relatively small amount of money you diminish yourself in the eyes of your employers, your players and the club supporters ?
He's free to make that decision, I'm free to be disappointed that his commitment to the job he has here is now in doubt.
If he had gone I don't think it would have been hard to replace him with a better manager. If he does stay he's now made his job a lot harder, in the short term at least, when questions were already being asked about his capability.
It seems a poor piece of judgement on his part.

He's decided that we are a better option than Fulham

Why are people upset about that, means we are on to a good thing