The Academy/Development squads watch thread 2024/25

[Maneki Neko]

Shane Long an academy product?

LOL

I think that whatever the truth of that statement we certainly took him as a young raw player with potential, and helped him achieve that and become a premiere league star.
and he certainly played for our academy sides before breaking through

[From Despair To Where?]

I remember watching a couple of Shane Long's early appearances for the academy and thinking he looked like a hurler trying to play football, all pace and power and absolutely no finesse or guile.

I'd say our coaching staff played a big part in him becoming the player he is today

[NewCorkSeth]

I remember watching a couple of Shane Long's early appearances for the academy and thinking he looked like a hurler trying to play football, all pace and power and absolutely no finesse or guile.

I'd say our coaching staff played a big part in him becoming the player he is today

If you think there's no finesse to hurling you've been watching it wrong. I'm not a huge gaa fan but the level of skill and the subtly of it is incredible.

[From Despair To Where?]

I remember watching a couple of Shane Long's early appearances for the academy and thinking he looked like a hurler trying to play football, all pace and power and absolutely no finesse or guile.

I'd say our coaching staff played a big part in him becoming the player he is today

If you think there's no finesse to hurling you've been watching it wrong. I'm not a huge gaa fan but the level of skill and the subtly of it is incredible.

Not saying that at all, my cousin was a county level hurler. There is a level of physicality in Hurling that isn't allowed in football and those were his strongest attributes. He had no soccer coaching before 17 so I wouldn't expect him to be as technically capable, and he wasnt . He's just one of those annoying gits that is good at every sport he takes up.

[Sutekh]

I remember watching a couple of Shane Long's early appearances for the academy and thinking he looked like a hurler trying to play football, all pace and power and absolutely no finesse or guile.

I'd say our coaching staff played a big part in him becoming the player he is today

If you think there's no finesse to hurling you've been watching it wrong. I'm not a huge gaa fan but the level of skill and the subtly of it is incredible.

Not saying that at all, my cousin was a county level hurler. There is a level of physicality in Hurling that isn't allowed in football and those were his strongest attributes. He had no soccer coaching before 17 so I wouldn't expect him to be as technically capable, and he wasnt . He's just one of those annoying gits that is good at every sport he takes up.

Hurling and Gaelic rules football are not shown or supported enough in this country. Much better as second sports after football than rugby. Be saying for ages that aspects of hurling should be included in the development of youngsters to be able to bring them on a little quicker.

[muirinho]

I remember watching a couple of Shane Long's early appearances for the academy and thinking he looked like a hurler trying to play football, all pace and power and absolutely no finesse or guile.

I'd say our coaching staff played a big part in him becoming the player he is today

If you think there's no finesse to hurling you've been watching it wrong. I'm not a huge gaa fan but the level of skill and the subtly of it is incredible.

Not saying that at all, my cousin was a county level hurler. There is a level of physicality in Hurling that isn't allowed in football and those were his strongest attributes. He had no soccer coaching before 17 so I wouldn't expect him to be as technically capable, and he wasnt .

There is both pace and power in hurling, AND finesse and guile. But it's not a surprise it takes a while to learn how to read a different game. I remember reading an interview with Long when he was talking about how the coaches at Reading had to teach him to look for space, and time runs differently than he'd done for hurling. It wasn't that they were coming up with entirely new concepts, unknown in the sport of hurling, just that he needed to adapt his thinking.

He's just one of those annoying gits that is good at every sport he takes up.

Agreed. Apparently he was (is?) also a seriously good badminton player

[From Despair To Where?]

If you think there's no finesse to hurling you've been watching it wrong. I'm not a huge gaa fan but the level of skill and the subtly of it is incredible.

Not saying that at all, my cousin was a county level hurler. There is a level of physicality in Hurling that isn't allowed in football and those were his strongest attributes. He had no soccer coaching before 17 so I wouldn't expect him to be as technically capable, and he wasnt .

There is both pace and power in hurling, AND finesse and guile. But it's not a surprise it takes a while to learn how to read a different game. I remember reading an interview with Long when he was talking about how the coaches at Reading had to teach him to look for space, and time runs differently than he'd done for hurling. It wasn't that they were coming up with entirely new concepts, unknown in the sport of hurling, just that he needed to adapt his thinking.

He's just one of those annoying gits that is good at every sport he takes up.

Agreed. Apparently he was (is?) also a seriously good badminton player

I also remember him having a shocking first touch early on and it's a testament to him that by January he was scoring goals in the Championship. It was a question of taking what he had learned in Hurling and refining it to the demands of football.

You can't play a game as fast flowing as Hurling without without having a lot of skill and finesse, my original comment was meant as a reflection on a individual hurler making the transition to a sport that was relatively new to him and in comparison to his peers, rather than a reflection on hurling as a whole.

[NewCorkSeth]

Not saying that at all, my cousin was a county level hurler. There is a level of physicality in Hurling that isn't allowed in football and those were his strongest attributes. He had no soccer coaching before 17 so I wouldn't expect him to be as technically capable, and he wasnt .

There is both pace and power in hurling, AND finesse and guile. But it's not a surprise it takes a while to learn how to read a different game. I remember reading an interview with Long when he was talking about how the coaches at Reading had to teach him to look for space, and time runs differently than he'd done for hurling. It wasn't that they were coming up with entirely new concepts, unknown in the sport of hurling, just that he needed to adapt his thinking.

He's just one of those annoying gits that is good at every sport he takes up.

Agreed. Apparently he was (is?) also a seriously good badminton player

I also remember him having a shocking first touch early on and it's a testament to him that by January he was scoring goals in the Championship. It was a question of taking what he had learned in Hurling and refining it to the demands of football.

You can't play a game as fast flowing as Hurling without without having a lot of skill and finesse, my original comment was meant as a reflection on a individual hurler making the transition to a sport that was relatively new to him and in comparison to his peers, rather than a reflection on hurling as a whole.

Ah my apologies I misunderstood! Shane is a gifted athlete that much is certain and IMO Ireland has many athletes of his ilk stuck (well they love the sport) playing in the GAA. As a whole i feel the GAA is holding back Irish sport on a worldwide scale. Yes the sports are very good for creating athletes through its demanding physical nature but it is an amateur sport played "only" in Ireland. I played rugby with several Gaelic footballers who very easily could be fantastic at any sport they put their mind to but from my observations there is a certain level of pressure put on them by senior GAA members to not take up other sports. One chap in particular was very good at rugby but was withdrawn from a few cup fixtures to ensure he wouldnt get injured for a county minors game.

Doyle also was helped a huge amount by his GAA history. My memories of watching Doyle for Reading include his refusal to simply fall over when tackled. Something that could be considered a skill these days.

It seems like we would have more Denis Irwins if the GAA wasnt so controlling.

IIRC Shane was signed by Eammon Dolans brother who then sold him to Reading?

[muirinho]

Ah my apologies I misunderstood! Shane is a gifted athlete that much is certain and IMO Ireland has many athletes of his ilk stuck (well they love the sport) playing in the GAA. As a whole i feel the GAA is holding back Irish sport on a worldwide scale. Yes the sports are very good for creating athletes through its demanding physical nature but it is an amateur sport played "only" in Ireland. I played rugby with several Gaelic footballers who very easily could be fantastic at any sport they put their mind to but from my observations there is a certain level of pressure put on them by senior GAA members to not take up other sports. One chap in particular was very good at rugby but was withdrawn from a few cup fixtures to ensure he wouldnt get injured for a county minors game.

[offtopic]
Hmm, you could easily say the same about cricket - English kids shouldn't waste their time with such a niche game. Or something like that. We seem to have strayed somewhat off-topic, but I'd suggest the determination to succeed in any sport is one of the most important factors in success. So having to overcome both internal and external pressures to play soccer to begin with may actually be a bonus. I also think early specialisation can be harmful - it's better to keep playing a variety of sports as long as possible. And you're going to get just as much pressure, if not more, to stop playing other sports, for a kid that's in a football academy at 12 as there is for a county U18 GAA player.

Whether the GAA existed or not, there isn't the money for massive investment in sport in Ireland. One of the reasons GAA is so ubiquitous is because it's amateur - all the money is in grass-roots. And you need serious investment in most sports to get success on a world stage.
[/offtopic]

Back on topic - apologies to From Despair To Where? for misinterpreting the "guile and finesse" comment

[tidus_mi2]

Did Kuhl sign the offered contract? He was in pre-season training today which would be odd for someone whose contract is expiring in 2 days.

[NewCorkSeth]

Did Kuhl sign the offered contract? He was in pre-season training today which would be odd for someone whose contract is expiring in 2 days.

All i could see in the Pre-Season training video was his hair so i hope that means hes sticking around.

[Royal Ginger]

http://www.readingfc.co.uk/news/article/2016-17/15-youngsters-sign-new-pro-deals-with-reading-3164112.aspx

New deals for 15 including Jules, Legg, Long, Griffin, Kelly, Kuhl, Dickie and Hyam.

[P!ssed Off]

No word on Sam Smith.

Offered a contract with the rest.
Has he been pinched? Would be a loss.

[John Smith]

No word on Sam Smith.

Offered a contract with the rest.
Has he been pinched? Would be a loss.

Thank god he gave up on music, that's all I can say

[Sutekh]

No word on Sam Smith.

Offered a contract with the rest.
Has he been pinched? Would be a loss.

Thank god he gave up on music, that's all I can say

Or, worse, perhaps he's given up at football to completely concentrate on his "singing".

[SCIAG]

Daniel Akinwumni also not mentioned, which would be a shame - he looked very good at right back for the U18s last season.

The new bunch of first years have been unveiled. There are 14! But that's justified because this is the team that was destroying everything before them last season.

Particularly notable are England youth internationals Ethan Coleman, Harry Philby, and Dan Loader, and Tom Holmes, who has several U18 games under his belt. Loader and Philby are forwards, Coleman is like a more attacking version of Norwood, and Holmes is a centre back who can play in midfield.

[maffff]

From a quick google we've made the following player sales from the academy (all prices below are £m)

Long - 4.49
Gylfi - 6.8
Antonio - 0.750
McCarthy - 3
Hector - 4.5
Tshibola - 5

Plus (presumably nominal) fees for Hamer to Charlton (maybe 100k?) and

Long, Gylfi and Antonio are regulars in the Premier League, McCarthy is on the books although second/third chocie and may need to drop down soon, Hector unknown how he'll get on (probably a loan to a lower Prem team this year?) and Tish to a higher Championship side.

I know Long/Antonio it's a little remiss to call them academy graduates, but the club does.

Add to that Hamer who is on the books at the PL winners (although loans last season to Nottingham Forest and Bristol City didn't exactly work out..) made 8 appearances in 2015/16 for them in the PL and none since.

A negligible fee for James Henry to Millwall, who is a Championship regular the players we've produced and sold haven't for a fee done too badly at all overall.

With the six above that's £25m there. Not that we've seen it reinvested into the side.

A cat 1 academy costs £2.5-£5m. So that's 5/10 years self funded. Hope we get a few more step up soon. The new batch sound promising and (although I'm yet to see it myself) Barrett appears encouraging.

[Ian Royal]

It's worth keeping in mind the distinction between immediately reinvesting in a transfer fee for a new player, which I agree we haven't done and the money going into the pot to be used to cover wages, other expenses and future transfer fees, which I believe we have done.

It's not like £ms have been removed from the club to SJM / Anton / the Thais. And we're certainly not just sitting on the cash.

[SCIAG]

I don't think the club call Antonio an academy graduate, and there's absolutely no justification for calling him one, he was too old for the academy when we signed him (unlike Long who was still eligible for another year). If you count Antonio then you have to count Morrison, Federici, Cummings...

Although the fees listed above are largely speculation due to all the secrecy, it's worth mentioning the sell-ons we got for Gylfi, Long, and Cox (and Antonio, but see above) which between them were well into seven figures. Henry's fee was about £350k iirc which isn't exactly Ronaldo money but is roughly what we paid for Le Fondre a year later.

If you want to do this seriously then you'd also need to look at the benefits of having Pearce, Karacan, HRK, etc. in the first team, the money we saved on signings and wages, etc. I don't think there's any question that the academy is a good idea.

[maffff]

I don't think the club call Antonio an academy graduate, and there's absolutely no justification for calling him one, he was too old for the academy when we signed him (unlike Long who was still eligible for another year). If you count Antonio then you have to count Morrison, Federici, Cummings...

Although the fees listed above are largely speculation due to all the secrecy, it's worth mentioning the sell-ons we got for Gylfi, Long, and Cox (and Antonio, but see above) which between them were well into seven figures. Henry's fee was about £350k iirc which isn't exactly Ronaldo money but is roughly what we paid for Le Fondre a year later.

If you want to do this seriously then you'd also need to look at the benefits of having Pearce, Karacan, HRK, etc. in the first team, the money we saved on signings and wages, etc. I don't think there's any question that the academy is a good idea.

Yep, you're right on Antonio - got a little ahead of myself there (although he played like he should be in the academy for most of his tenure with us!).

It's definitely showed value to date, credit to Dolan and the team. Hopefully it keeps producing.