World Cup 2026

[Silver Fox]

Is going to include 48 teams

At least it means Scotland might qualify

[George_]

USA nailed on to host it now.

[stealthpapes]

IF it were a pre-qualifying stage with a pretty random draw then I don't really mind that much.

Pushing the boat out - have 15 4 team groups, home and away as the last stage of qualifying. Top team qualifies to join the host, which gives a very good last 16. The group stage would be nicely random, chance for an upset but not too big a chance.

Or don't fiddle with it.

How about that?

[From Despair To Where?]

16 groups of 3, top 2 go through from each group.

I see another Germany-Austria 1982 happening.

I get the idea of opening the tournament up but this is definitely out of the box marked "Mental"

[Sutekh]

I see another Germany-Austria 1982 happening.

Not with the other ridiculous proposal that all games ending in draws will be decided by a penalty shootout

[stealthpapes]

I see another Germany-Austria 1982 happening.

Not with the other ridiculous proposal that all games ending in draws will be decided by a penalty shootout

It'll be more like Sweden Denmark in 04 or Norn Iron vs Germany '16, knowing a 1-0 loss is enough.

[From Despair To Where?]

I see another Germany-Austria 1982 happening.

Not with the other ridiculous proposal that all games ending in draws will be decided by a penalty shootout

Germany won that game in 82. Scored after 10 minutes then 80 minutes of walking round the pitch passing to each other.

[stealthpapes]

UEFA (16 teams); CAF (9); CONMEBOL (6); AFC (8.5); CONCACAF (6.5); OFC (1) is the new proposal.

UEFA (13 teams); CAF (5); CONMEBOL (4.5); AFC (4.5); CONCACAF (3.5); OFC (0.5) is how it works now.

On current standings, that's:

UEFA (16 teams)

Germany
Belgium
France
Portugal
Spain
Switzerland
Wales
England
Croatia
Poland
Italy
Iceland
Netherlands
Republic of Ireland
Turkey
Slovakia

Not too bothered about that. Reckon a tournament with the best 16 teams in Europe would be pretty mint actually.

CONMEBOL (6 teams, it's a 10 country confederation )

Argentina
Brazil
Chile
Colombia
Uruguay
Peru

Again, not too bothered - a seemingly obvious suggestion might be to make a Americas qualifying group. Don't make that suggestion. Ecuador narrowly miss out but there's no shambles there.

CAF (9 teams)

Senegal
Côte d'Ivoire
Egypt
Tunisia
Algeria
Congo DR
Nigeria
Burkina Faso
Ghana

OK ...

AFC (8 teams, 9th in a play-off)

Iran
Korea Republic
Australia
Japan
Saudi Arabia
Uzbekistan
United Arab Emirates
China PR

That sound is a barrel being scraped.

CONCACAF (6 teams)

Costa Rica
Mexico
USA
Panama
Haiti
Honduras

If you joined CONMEBOL and CONCACAF for 12 teams and a playoff, then all but Bolivia from South America would qualify and it would be close for the playoff between Venezuela and Panama.

Play off
Qatar vs Curacao


Any expansion will simply let shit football into the mixture.

[Sutekh]

Any expansion will simply let shit football into the mixture.

You forget that England would somehow already be there...

[stealthpapes]

Any expansion will simply let shit football into the mixture.

You forget that England would somehow already be there...

LOL!

[Emeraldroyal]

Any expansion will simply let shit football into the mixture.

You forget that England would somehow already be there...

LOL!

Feel sorry for England. Doomed to fail with expectation levels (mainly from the media)

I'm in favour of an expanded tournament.
Having spent two weeks in France this summer it was the Icelandic / Welsh / Irish (north and south) Belgian fans that made it. Having said that I'd shit my pants if the Chinese ever got a hooligan element...kung fu and sheer weight of numbers means we're all in for a kicking

[stealthpapes]

Just depress our 25 pounders and fill them up with shrapnel. Worked at Imjin and I'm pretty sure the lesson is transferable.

[Stranded]

Allocation for 2026 announced:

Africa - 9 (up from 5)
Asia - 8 (up from 4 or 5)
Europe - 16 (up from 13)
North, Central America and Caribbean - 6 (up from 3 or 4)
Oceania - 1 (from 0 or 1)
South America - 6 (up from 4 or 5)

Will have a massive impact on the qualification competitions of some regions. For example, the CONCACAF Hexagonal becomes obsolete as the final 6 will all qualify (plus a 7th getting a play off spot). In South America as well, 6 of 10 will now qualify (plus 1 playoff spot) which could make the current league structure a bit of a procession.

Looks like the Confederations Cup may well be on the way out too. As the last 2 places will likely be decided by a mini tournament hosted by the WC hosts the autumn before the WC.

Play-off will be seeded knock out - with one nation from Africa, Asia, CONCACAF, Oceania and S.America partaking. The 6th team will come from the host federation. Teams will be seeded and format will be:

1st rd

3rd seeds v 6th
4th v 5th

Qualifying round

1st v lowest ranked qualifier
2nd v highest ranked qualifer

Winners of those ties will qualify and probably play a final to win a cup.

So if we take the current positions, then a play off for 2018 would be as follows (seeding in brackets) -

1st round

Morocco v Tahiti
Guatemala V China

Qualifying round

Peru V lowest ranked qualifer
Slovakia V highest ranked qualifer

[tmesis]

I'm in favour of an expanded tournament.
Having spent two weeks in France this summer it was the Icelandic / Welsh / Irish (north and south) Belgian fans that made it. Having said that I'd shit my pants if the Chinese ever got a hooligan element...kung fu and sheer weight of numbers means we're all in for a kicking

I didn't go to any England games, but I stayed in a few places where there was a fair-sized English contingent visiting between games, and they were typically great, mixing well the other fans, and there was a kind of party atmosphere in the bars.


The problems really seem to come when you get thousands of Easyjet weekenders coming over without tickets, who think the way you are supposed to act if you are an English fan is to get drunk and shout abuse at the foreigners. Sorry, I say abuse, but clearly it's just "banter".

The Belgian and Welsh were really good though, I'd agree on that.

[double d]

Allocation for 2026 announced:

Africa - 9 (up from 5)
Asia - 8 (up from 4 or 5)
Europe - 16 (up from 13)
North, Central America and Caribbean - 6 (up from 3 or 4)
Oceania - 1 (from 0 or 1)
South America - 6 (up from 4 or 5)

Will have a massive impact on the qualification competitions of some regions. For example, the CONCACAF Hexagonal becomes obsolete as the final 6 will all qualify (plus a 7th getting a play off spot). In South America as well, 6 of 10 will now qualify (plus 1 playoff spot) which could make the current league structure a bit of a procession.

Looks like the Confederations Cup may well be on the way out too. As the last 2 places will likely be decided by a mini tournament hosted by the WC hosts the autumn before the WC.

Play-off will be seeded knock out - with one nation from Africa, Asia, CONCACAF, Oceania and S.America partaking. The 6th team will come from the host federation. Teams will be seeded and format will be:

1st rd

3rd seeds v 6th
4th v 5th

Qualifying round

1st v lowest ranked qualifier
2nd v highest ranked qualifer

Winners of those ties will qualify and probably play a final to win a cup.

So if we take the current positions, then a play off for 2018 would be as follows (seeding in brackets) -

1st round

Morocco v Tahiti
Guatemala V China

Qualifying round

Peru V lowest ranked qualifer
Slovakia V highest ranked qualifer

I'm really looking forward to that Tahiti vs Burkina Faso 1st round dead rubber match...mm

[Sutekh]

Qualifying is just getting to be a total waste of time now for the likes of Germany, France, Italy, Spain, England etc. Just give them byes straight to the final and avoid the utter boredom of pointless games (and in England's case the media and fan overhype and then overreaction to each performance).

There is virtually no point at all in a qualifying tournament in South America, just need a "tournament" between Bolivia/Surinam and Venzuela to see who gets into the play off.

And CONCACAF getting 6 qualifiers ? So that'll just come down to seeing whether Canada are ever good enough to oust one of El Salvador, Honduras or Costa Rica.

And as Australia play in the Asian qualifiers it means New Zealand will now automatically qualify for every tournament.

Think the only qualifiers worth watching now will be those in Africa.

[tmesis]

Qualifying is just getting to be a total waste of time now for the likes of Germany, France, Italy, Spain, England etc. Just give them byes straight to the final and avoid the utter boredom of pointless games (and in England's case the media and fan overhype and then overreaction to each performance).

I really don't get this idea of fans (or even the media these days) overhyping England.

You hear all the time about how fans have wildly unrealistic expectations, but that's only true if "we might not be disappointingly crap this time" is classed as wildly unrealistic these days.

The idea that a large chunk of England supporters think England have a great chance of winning, or that the media are largely predicting success before each tournament, is just a myth.

[harry]

Qualifying is just getting to be a total waste of time now for the likes of Germany, France, Italy, Spain, England etc. Just give them byes straight to the final and avoid the utter boredom of pointless games (and in England's case the media and fan overhype and then overreaction to each performance).

I really don't get this idea of fans (or even the media these days) overhyping England.

You hear all the time about how fans have wildly unrealistic expectations, but that's only true if "we might not be disappointingly crap this time" is classed as wildly unrealistic these days.

The idea that a large chunk of England supporters think England have a great chance of winning, or that the media are largely predicting success before each tournament, is just a myth.

I'd hazard that most actual England supporters who know about football are pretty realistic in expectations. It's the rest of the public with limited knowledge of football who get dragged along by media hype. They will know next to nothing about most opponents and therefore underestimate them.
Most of the media has an interest in hyping up the Premier League.
If it is "the best league in the world" then the players who play there must be "the best in the world".
(Despite only some of them being home grown the assumption then follows that) the national team must be at least competitive at the very top level (or to some "the best in the world" in waiting).
Each major tournament follows the same curve of over-expectation and ends the same way. There have even been a couple where I've noticed some TV commentators trying to downplay things a bit.

[tmesis]

Qualifying is just getting to be a total waste of time now for the likes of Germany, France, Italy, Spain, England etc. Just give them byes straight to the final and avoid the utter boredom of pointless games (and in England's case the media and fan overhype and then overreaction to each performance).

I really don't get this idea of fans (or even the media these days) overhyping England.

You hear all the time about how fans have wildly unrealistic expectations, but that's only true if "we might not be disappointingly crap this time" is classed as wildly unrealistic these days.

The idea that a large chunk of England supporters think England have a great chance of winning, or that the media are largely predicting success before each tournament, is just a myth.

I'd hazard that most actual England supporters who know about football are pretty realistic in expectations. It's the rest of the public with limited knowledge of football who get dragged along by media hype. They will know next to nothing about most opponents and therefore underestimate them.
Most of the media has an interest in hyping up the Premier League.

Each major tournament follows the same curve of over-expectation and ends the same way. There have even been a couple where I've noticed some TV commentators trying to downplay things a bit.

Again, it's just not backed up by facts. If predictions of success from pundits and journalists were so common, you'd be able to find loads. Have a look, and you'll struggle to find a single one.

I used to frequent a site which had a lot of fans from around the world, and they used to all say the same thing. My challenge to them was always the same - go out and actually find someone tipping England to win. I don't think a single one ever did.

For example, these were the tips from BBC and ITV in 2012


http://www.itv.com/sport/football/a...v ... edictions/
Who will win Euro 2012?
Clive Tyldesley, ITV Football commentator - Germany.

Gabriel Clarke, ITV Football reporter - Holland. Their time has come.

Andy Townsend, ITV Football pundit - Germany. Lots of experience, quality all round.

Ned Boulting, ITV Football reporter - Germany, obviously. They're in such a strong position that they're able to leave out almost all of the Dortmund team which did the domestic double.

James Appell, ITV Football writer - Germany. They're so good they probably won't even need penalties.

Luke McLaughlin, ITV Sport Editor - Italy. Their defence was very solid in qualifying. Backing
anyone in Group B is risky – the group is so tough that Germany or Holland could be knocked out before the last eight.

Ollie Irish, ITV Football Editor - Germany. Went close in 2010, will surely grab the cigar this time around.

Harry Hesp, ITV Sport producer - Holland. Provided they all get along.
Will Unwin, ITV Football writer - Spain. They're a squad of winners. The likes of Xavi, Iniesta and Silva can destroy sides.

How will England do?
Clive Tyldesley - Quarter-finals.

Gabriel Clarke - Quarter finals, when injuries and suspensions will finally catch up with them.

Andy Townsend, ITV Football pundit - Quarter-finals.

Ned Boulting - Slightly better than Greece. A bit like their respective economies.

James Appell - Out in the group stages after a desperate defeat to Ukraine in Donetsk.

Luke McLaughlin - It’s likely that Hodgson’s men will travel to face Ukraine in their final group match with both teams needing a result to progress. On which basis, I fear injury-hit England will be knocked out by the co-hosts.

Ollie Irish - Three and out. Bottom of Group D with one draw and two defeats. The squad is nowhere near good enough.

Harry Hesp - Bottom of Group D.

Will Unwin - Hodgson's men will bow out valiantly in the last eight.


http://www.itv.com/sport/football/a...u ... nt-winner/
...and full sweep of the studio pundits tipping Germany to win in this clip.

http://www.itv.com/sport/football/updat ... -d-battle/
Gareth Southgate's view on England. If you want to find some kind of tip for engllandn there, be my guest.

http://www.itv.com/sport/football/u...h ... out-stage/
and Jamie carragher's view




OK, let's see what the BBC pundits had to say

ALAN HANSEN, MATCH OF THE DAY
1. Spain 2. Germany 3. Netherlands. 4. Portugal
How will England do?
"The golden age for this generation of England players was from 2006 to 2010 and they probably aren't as good now as they were, which is why people don't expect them to do well.
"Before then, when you looked at English teams on paper it was frightening how many great players they had, but they under-achieved.
"This time they are not sub-standard but they do not have so many great players.
"They could still do well but I think they will do well to reach the quarter-finals."

ALAN SHEARER, MATCH OF THE DAY
1. Spain 2. Germany 3. Netherlands 4. England
How will England do?
"I have picked England to reach the semi-finals because I am English, I am patriotic and I want them to do well - in fact I am desperate for them to do well.
"We are not good enough to win it yet, though. It has not been ideal preparation leading up to the tournament, we have got our main striker out for the first two games and I think it will be very tough to get out of the group."

GARY LINEKER, MATCH OF THE DAY
1. Spain 2. Germany 3. Netherlands 4. Italy
How will England do?
"A match in the knockout round awaits England but who knows how far they can go beyond that."

MARK LAWRENSON, MATCH OF THE DAY
1. Germany 2. France 3. Spain 4. Netherlands
How will England do?
"This is the first tournament I can remember where I have been covering England and everyone is playing down their chances - normally, everyone is building them up.
"I think that's a bonus and I actually think it might mean they have a better than expected tournament.
"Being without Wayne Rooney for the first two games might mean we actually get more of a club-type team spirit, rather than an international one.
"That is exactly what England need because, sometimes when we watch them, it doesn't look like their team spirit is particularly good. That could be key for them this time if they can get it right."

LEE DIXON, MATCH OF THE DAY
1. Germany 2. Spain 3. Netherlands 4. France
How will England do?
"France will win our group and so England will play Spain in the quarter-finals and lose.
"Let's hope I'm wrong and we win the group and beat Italy and go on to win it!"

CHRIS WADDLE, BBC RADIO 5 LIVE
1. Germany 2. Netherlands 3. Spain 4. Italy
How will England do?
"The problem I see is scoring goals because, apart from set-pieces, I don't really see an awful lot, especially without Wayne Rooney for our first two games.
"We can't make good players great and going into this tournament, I have got to say there are several teams better than England, whether we like it or not.
"England will do well to get out of their group. If we don't, then let's not look at the Brazil World Cup as being the be-all or end-all either. Let's build a team for France 2016. That's when Roy Hodgson should be judged and that's when I'm going to judge him."

JAN MOLBY, BBC RADIO 5 LIVE
1. Spain 2. Germany 3. France 4. Poland
How will England do?
"There isn't a lot of expectation for England heading into this tournament and I think if they get out the group by finishing above France or Sweden then I think they will have done well."

ROBBIE SAVAGE, BBC RADIO 5 LIVE
1. Netherlands 2. Spain 3. Germany 4. France
How will England do?
"Hodgson is a man of vast experience at international level. Tactically, England won't concede much. They might not play beautiful, attractive football but they will be hard to beat and will retain the ball and counter-attack.
"He will have them well set up and well drilled, and that might be enough to get them out of their group.
"I actually think Hodgson will do fantastically well and I hope he does, to shut people up."

JOHN MOTSON, MATCH OF THE DAY
1. Germany 2. France 3. Spain 4. Netherlands
How will England do?
"England will do well to get out of a very difficult group.
"Getting to the quarter-finals is probably as much as anyone is expecting and everyone will be delighted if they manage that. Going any further would just be a bonus."

GUY MOWBRAY, MATCH OF THE DAY
1. Germany 2. Spain 3. France 4. Netherlands
How will England do?
"England? The best we can hope for is winning it, because you can always hope.
"But let's get out of our group first, be it in first or second place, and that will do.
"Then see what happens because it is knockout football and anything can happen in a one-off game. Greece proved that when they won it in 2004 and many teams have proved it down the years."

DAVID JAMES, MATCH OF THE DAY
1. Germany 2. Spain 3. Netherlands 4. France
How will England do?
"England's group is tough to get out of, France and Sweden are decent and Ukraine, having played them a couple of years ago in World Cup qualifiers, on home turf will be tough too.
"Home turf as we know ourselves always pushes you that little bit further. England will struggle to make the last eight."

STEVE WILSON, MATCH OF THE DAY
1. Germany 2. Spain 3. Portugal 4. France
How will England do?
"I have England down to lose a quarter final against Spain in Donetsk, but that is with a slightly optimistic hat on. It could be that they are out at the group stage.
"A place in the semi-final would be a big surprise. I fancy France to beat England in the first game, England to beat Sweden in the second, and that will probably leave Roy Hodgson's side needing to beat Ukraine in the final match; easier said than done on Ukrainian soil.
"If England do a lose a quarter-final I think we should recognise that as a sort of success. If they go out at the group stage it would be disappointing but not that surprising."

JONATHAN PEARCE, MATCH OF THE DAY
1. Germany 2. France 3. Netherlands 4. Spain
How will England do?
"I'd expect Hodgson to get England organised in every department but if we qualify for the quarter-finals that will be a result because we are in a very tough group. Traditionally we don't do very well at the European Championship either."

DANNY MILLS, BBC RADIO 5 LIVE
1. Germany 2. Spain 3. Netherlands 4. France
How will England do?
"England will do well to get out of their group. Realistically, they are going to do well to get two draws from their first two games against France and Sweden, especially without Wayne Rooney.
"Then, even if they beat the hosts, Ukraine, in their final game, making the quarter-finals could depend on other results."

PAT NEVIN, BBC RADIO 5 LIVE
1. Spain 2. Netherlands 3. Germany 4. France
How will England do?
"The good thing for England is that they have got a very decent group to get out of if they play to capabilities.
"They will be organised and structured because that's what Hodgson is very good at and I think there is enough good players there. A lot of negativity around them but they have actually got the basis of a very good side."

MARK BRIGHT, MATCH OF THE DAY
1. Germany 2. Spain 3. Netherlands 4. France
How will England do?
"If you look at the world rankings, England are the fifth-best team in Europe.
"So, whether there is hype around them or not, England will go into the tournament as one of the fancied nations, who should be aiming for a semi-final place.
"In reality, it will be difficult for us to get out of our group, although I'd like to think we will make the quarter-finals.
"England should be better than looking to defend and nicking goals on the break but it might work.
"And, having seen a lot of Fulham under Roy Hodgson when he was in charge at Craven Cottage, I know that if he gets his team working in the right way, he will stick with those combinations no matter whether he has to leave 'star' players out or not.
"So, if Danny Welbeck does well in the first couple of games, Hodgson will stick with him rather than bringing Wayne Rooney back in after his suspension."

So that's only one person in 16 even thinking England will make the semi finals, and even that was a heart over head call. I've no doubt people were saying England were massively over-hyped then as well.



It's actually really hard to find any journalist tipping England to do well for years, and I really can't think of any fans, regular or otherwise, thinking England are a great team either.

The myth of English fans and media thinking we're world-beaters is so strong though, that people don't need to actually see any examples of it happening to "know" it's true.

[harry]

I really don't get this idea of fans (or even the media these days) overhyping England.

You hear all the time about how fans have wildly unrealistic expectations, but that's only true if "we might not be disappointingly crap this time" is classed as wildly unrealistic these days.

The idea that a large chunk of England supporters think England have a great chance of winning, or that the media are largely predicting success before each tournament, is just a myth.

I'd hazard that most actual England supporters who know about football are pretty realistic in expectations. It's the rest of the public with limited knowledge of football who get dragged along by media hype. They will know next to nothing about most opponents and therefore underestimate them.
Most of the media has an interest in hyping up the Premier League.

Each major tournament follows the same curve of over-expectation and ends the same way. There have even been a couple where I've noticed some TV commentators trying to downplay things a bit.

Again, it's just not backed up by facts. If predictions of success from pundits and journalists were so common, you'd be able to find loads. Have a look, and you'll struggle to find a single one.

I used to frequent a site which had a lot of fans from around the world, and they used to all say the same thing. My challenge to them was always the same - go out and actually find someone tipping England to win. I don't think a single one ever did.

For example, these were the tips from BBC and ITV in 2012


http://www.itv.com/sport/football/a...v ... edictions/
Who will win Euro 2012?
Clive Tyldesley, ITV Football commentator - Germany.

Gabriel Clarke, ITV Football reporter - Holland. Their time has come.

Andy Townsend, ITV Football pundit - Germany. Lots of experience, quality all round.

Ned Boulting, ITV Football reporter - Germany, obviously. They're in such a strong position that they're able to leave out almost all of the Dortmund team which did the domestic double.

James Appell, ITV Football writer - Germany. They're so good they probably won't even need penalties.

Luke McLaughlin, ITV Sport Editor - Italy. Their defence was very solid in qualifying. Backing
anyone in Group B is risky – the group is so tough that Germany or Holland could be knocked out before the last eight.

Ollie Irish, ITV Football Editor - Germany. Went close in 2010, will surely grab the cigar this time around.

Harry Hesp, ITV Sport producer - Holland. Provided they all get along.
Will Unwin, ITV Football writer - Spain. They're a squad of winners. The likes of Xavi, Iniesta and Silva can destroy sides.

How will England do?
Clive Tyldesley - Quarter-finals.

Gabriel Clarke - Quarter finals, when injuries and suspensions will finally catch up with them.

Andy Townsend, ITV Football pundit - Quarter-finals.

Ned Boulting - Slightly better than Greece. A bit like their respective economies.

James Appell - Out in the group stages after a desperate defeat to Ukraine in Donetsk.

Luke McLaughlin - It’s likely that Hodgson’s men will travel to face Ukraine in their final group match with both teams needing a result to progress. On which basis, I fear injury-hit England will be knocked out by the co-hosts.

Ollie Irish - Three and out. Bottom of Group D with one draw and two defeats. The squad is nowhere near good enough.

Harry Hesp - Bottom of Group D.

Will Unwin - Hodgson's men will bow out valiantly in the last eight.


http://www.itv.com/sport/football/a...u ... nt-winner/
...and full sweep of the studio pundits tipping Germany to win in this clip.

http://www.itv.com/sport/football/updat ... -d-battle/
Gareth Southgate's view on England. If you want to find some kind of tip for engllandn there, be my guest.

http://www.itv.com/sport/football/u...h ... out-stage/
and Jamie carragher's view




OK, let's see what the BBC pundits had to say

ALAN HANSEN, MATCH OF THE DAY
1. Spain 2. Germany 3. Netherlands. 4. Portugal
How will England do?
"The golden age for this generation of England players was from 2006 to 2010 and they probably aren't as good now as they were, which is why people don't expect them to do well.
"Before then, when you looked at English teams on paper it was frightening how many great players they had, but they under-achieved.
"This time they are not sub-standard but they do not have so many great players.
"They could still do well but I think they will do well to reach the quarter-finals."

ALAN SHEARER, MATCH OF THE DAY
1. Spain 2. Germany 3. Netherlands 4. England
How will England do?
"I have picked England to reach the semi-finals because I am English, I am patriotic and I want them to do well - in fact I am desperate for them to do well.
"We are not good enough to win it yet, though. It has not been ideal preparation leading up to the tournament, we have got our main striker out for the first two games and I think it will be very tough to get out of the group."

GARY LINEKER, MATCH OF THE DAY
1. Spain 2. Germany 3. Netherlands 4. Italy
How will England do?
"A match in the knockout round awaits England but who knows how far they can go beyond that."

MARK LAWRENSON, MATCH OF THE DAY
1. Germany 2. France 3. Spain 4. Netherlands
How will England do?
"This is the first tournament I can remember where I have been covering England and everyone is playing down their chances - normally, everyone is building them up.
"I think that's a bonus and I actually think it might mean they have a better than expected tournament.
"Being without Wayne Rooney for the first two games might mean we actually get more of a club-type team spirit, rather than an international one.
"That is exactly what England need because, sometimes when we watch them, it doesn't look like their team spirit is particularly good. That could be key for them this time if they can get it right."

LEE DIXON, MATCH OF THE DAY
1. Germany 2. Spain 3. Netherlands 4. France
How will England do?
"France will win our group and so England will play Spain in the quarter-finals and lose.
"Let's hope I'm wrong and we win the group and beat Italy and go on to win it!"

CHRIS WADDLE, BBC RADIO 5 LIVE
1. Germany 2. Netherlands 3. Spain 4. Italy
How will England do?
"The problem I see is scoring goals because, apart from set-pieces, I don't really see an awful lot, especially without Wayne Rooney for our first two games.
"We can't make good players great and going into this tournament, I have got to say there are several teams better than England, whether we like it or not.
"England will do well to get out of their group. If we don't, then let's not look at the Brazil World Cup as being the be-all or end-all either. Let's build a team for France 2016. That's when Roy Hodgson should be judged and that's when I'm going to judge him."

JAN MOLBY, BBC RADIO 5 LIVE
1. Spain 2. Germany 3. France 4. Poland
How will England do?
"There isn't a lot of expectation for England heading into this tournament and I think if they get out the group by finishing above France or Sweden then I think they will have done well."

ROBBIE SAVAGE, BBC RADIO 5 LIVE
1. Netherlands 2. Spain 3. Germany 4. France
How will England do?
"Hodgson is a man of vast experience at international level. Tactically, England won't concede much. They might not play beautiful, attractive football but they will be hard to beat and will retain the ball and counter-attack.
"He will have them well set up and well drilled, and that might be enough to get them out of their group.
"I actually think Hodgson will do fantastically well and I hope he does, to shut people up."

JOHN MOTSON, MATCH OF THE DAY
1. Germany 2. France 3. Spain 4. Netherlands
How will England do?
"England will do well to get out of a very difficult group.
"Getting to the quarter-finals is probably as much as anyone is expecting and everyone will be delighted if they manage that. Going any further would just be a bonus."

GUY MOWBRAY, MATCH OF THE DAY
1. Germany 2. Spain 3. France 4. Netherlands
How will England do?
"England? The best we can hope for is winning it, because you can always hope.
"But let's get out of our group first, be it in first or second place, and that will do.
"Then see what happens because it is knockout football and anything can happen in a one-off game. Greece proved that when they won it in 2004 and many teams have proved it down the years."

DAVID JAMES, MATCH OF THE DAY
1. Germany 2. Spain 3. Netherlands 4. France
How will England do?
"England's group is tough to get out of, France and Sweden are decent and Ukraine, having played them a couple of years ago in World Cup qualifiers, on home turf will be tough too.
"Home turf as we know ourselves always pushes you that little bit further. England will struggle to make the last eight."

STEVE WILSON, MATCH OF THE DAY
1. Germany 2. Spain 3. Portugal 4. France
How will England do?
"I have England down to lose a quarter final against Spain in Donetsk, but that is with a slightly optimistic hat on. It could be that they are out at the group stage.
"A place in the semi-final would be a big surprise. I fancy France to beat England in the first game, England to beat Sweden in the second, and that will probably leave Roy Hodgson's side needing to beat Ukraine in the final match; easier said than done on Ukrainian soil.
"If England do a lose a quarter-final I think we should recognise that as a sort of success. If they go out at the group stage it would be disappointing but not that surprising."

JONATHAN PEARCE, MATCH OF THE DAY
1. Germany 2. France 3. Netherlands 4. Spain
How will England do?
"I'd expect Hodgson to get England organised in every department but if we qualify for the quarter-finals that will be a result because we are in a very tough group. Traditionally we don't do very well at the European Championship either."

DANNY MILLS, BBC RADIO 5 LIVE
1. Germany 2. Spain 3. Netherlands 4. France
How will England do?
"England will do well to get out of their group. Realistically, they are going to do well to get two draws from their first two games against France and Sweden, especially without Wayne Rooney.
"Then, even if they beat the hosts, Ukraine, in their final game, making the quarter-finals could depend on other results."

PAT NEVIN, BBC RADIO 5 LIVE
1. Spain 2. Netherlands 3. Germany 4. France
How will England do?
"The good thing for England is that they have got a very decent group to get out of if they play to capabilities.
"They will be organised and structured because that's what Hodgson is very good at and I think there is enough good players there. A lot of negativity around them but they have actually got the basis of a very good side."

MARK BRIGHT, MATCH OF THE DAY
1. Germany 2. Spain 3. Netherlands 4. France
How will England do?
"If you look at the world rankings, England are the fifth-best team in Europe.
"So, whether there is hype around them or not, England will go into the tournament as one of the fancied nations, who should be aiming for a semi-final place.
"In reality, it will be difficult for us to get out of our group, although I'd like to think we will make the quarter-finals.
"England should be better than looking to defend and nicking goals on the break but it might work.
"And, having seen a lot of Fulham under Roy Hodgson when he was in charge at Craven Cottage, I know that if he gets his team working in the right way, he will stick with those combinations no matter whether he has to leave 'star' players out or not.
"So, if Danny Welbeck does well in the first couple of games, Hodgson will stick with him rather than bringing Wayne Rooney back in after his suspension."

So that's only one person in 16 even thinking England will make the semi finals, and even that was a heart over head call. I've no doubt people were saying England were massively over-hyped then as well.



It's actually really hard to find any journalist tipping England to do well for years, and I really can't think of any fans, regular or otherwise, thinking England are a great team either.

The myth of English fans and media thinking we're world-beaters is so strong though, that people don't need to actually see any examples of it happening to "know" it's true.

Wow! That's a lot of effort to not disprove anything I typed even when only quoting selective parts of it.