Which of the loanees would you prioritise?

[SCIAG]

We've got six great loanees who have really strengthened the squad. Given that we're also going to let a lot of players go this summer, which of the loanees would you prioritise getting back?

In order, for me:

1) Lewis Baker - I think he's probably too good for this level. Similar passing range to Guthrie and Norwood but much more incisive. Good set piece threat. Mobile. History shows he's got a goal in him. If Mason Mount can get an England call up then I don't see why Baker can't in a few years. I think he'd either get us promoted or end up leaving for big money. Plus we're really weak in midfield - if Kelly goes then we'd be down to just Rinomhota and Swift.

2) Nélson Oliveira - a big gamble for sure. He's a chronic underperformer with an attitude problem but it seems like he's finally found a manager he respects. Has a real touch of quality about him and suits our style well. Probably a risk worth taking.

3) Matt Miazga - didn't know what we were missing until he showed up. Just as good on the ball as Ilori but with an added physical presence. I don't like what a shit he is but I do like centre backs who can actually win headers. Could get away without signing a centre back if Moore stays, but if Moore goes then we'll need him and I want him either way.

4) Saeid Ezatolahi - has missed so much of the season through injury but looked really good in those few appearances. If Baker is out of our reach then I'd love to get him. Not sure how easily he'd co-exist with Baker though.

5) Emi Martinez - his incredible kicking has added an extra dimension to our play. However, with some excellent young goalkeepers coming through, we don't need to sign a goalkeeper. I know I rate Martinez less highly than many of you but I'd be absolutely fine with Ward or Southwood starting next season, and I don't think the gap between Martinez and Jaakola is as big as some people make out. Except with distribution.

6) Ovie Ejaria - very good close control and does a lot of things quite well, but I'm not sure he offers enough end product, and I'm not sure anyone knows what his best role is - Gomes has used him as a winger, defensive midfielder, and attacking midfielder (did he also get used as an emergency striker?). Has a lot of improving to do, particularly on decision making. Don't get me wrong, I'd be happy if we signed him (as long as it didn't use up the Baker money) - he's sixth more because everyone else is good than because he's bad. Clearly head and shoulders above the likes of Jordon Mutch or Chris Martin for us.

[URZZZZ]

Will probably keep changing my mind but for now I'd say

1. Miazga
2. Baker
3. Oliveira
4. Martinez
5. Eza
6. Ejaria

- Miazga has been nothing short of a revelation since coming in, he's comfortable on the floor, he's comfortable in the air, and most importantly is solid
- Baker took a while to adjust but is Mr Consistent. That's where him and Rino differ with the likes of Kelly and Swift, they're constantly a 7 out of 10 rather than an 8 one week and then a 4 the week after
- Oliveira and Martinez are close. Personally rate Bodvarsson, and then there's Novakovich and Loader coming through, so don't think a striker is as necessary as some make out (of course if Bod's injuries keep occurring, that's another issue). Same as you with Martinez, I find him overrated on here and in most places and don't think he's streets ahead of Jaakkola as some people do
- Eza and Ejaria are also close, but like you say I'm just not sure what Ejaria is particularly good at

But six fantastic loanees this season, credit to Gomes for getting them playing even if he didn't directly sign them himself

[Hound]

Tough question and my mind changes every performance. So much is going to be governed by which of them are actually available and would join. Pretty sure Martinez won’t come. I don’t think Miazga will. Baker likely would on loan. Oli yes. Ejaria and Eza no idea. Not really sure what the story is with Eza tbh

But for the sake of a simple answer, if they were all available, probably

Miazga
Baker
Martinez
Ezatolahi
Oliveira
Ejaria

Oliveira lower down mainly because we have Nova’ on our books. Ejaria is good, but similar to Swift.

Miazga has made a huge difference to the back 4 and works well with Moore. Baker is a class act, very talented lad with a good attitude.

[Notts Royal]

If we base it on who we can realistically get, then my preference would be the spine of:

Miazga
Baker
Oliveira

Sell Swift to raise some funds - Gunter & Kelly we might get a decent fee for too as they both have a good reputation outside of the club

Baker & Miazga might be tempted by first team football to soften the blow of decreased wages.

Also, signing Miazga might tempt Moore to stay.

All depends on a budget really. If we are very tight, the club might be tempted to cash in on Moore so we can afford some of the loanees.

[Snowflake Royal]

Oliveira -> Miazga -> Martinez -> Baker -> Ezatolahi -> Ejaria.

Realistically I think that means Oli, Baker and Ezatolahi maybe joined by Ejaria.

[CountryRoyal]

If we could have equal chance of signing them all.

Martinez
Mizaga
Baker
Oli
Ejaria

Not to take Ejaria for granted, to be honest I don't remember seeing a set of such influential good loanees. It's quite staggering considering our less than illustrious recent history with loanees.

[leon]

Oliveira -> Miazga -> Martinez -> Baker -> Ezatolahi -> Ejaria.

Realistically I think that means Oli, Baker and Ezatolahi maybe joined by Ejaria.

This except Martínez won’t stay and Ejaria before Ezatolahi.

So not this, but something about similar.

If we get three of them we’ll be flying. They’ve all been absolutely immense. Just shows how shit the squad were for these guys to waltz in.

Actually we know, we had to watch them,

[URZZZZ]

I think the thing with Miazga is we have 1 other CB really who can do a job which is Moore. Other than that, we have McShane and O'Shea who are two years after their shelf life, and a bunch of youngsters who no-one can really say if they're adequate (U23 isn't always the best barometer to judge ability)

Oliveira on the other hand has Bodvarsson, Baldock, Novakovich (not tested in this league however) who whilst they're not as good as Oli, they're better options than the "other CB's"

Obviously there are a lot of people who mention Southwood etc but I generally have no idea if they'll be good enough

[Notts Royal]

I think the thing with Miazga is we have 1 other CB really who can do a job which is Moore. Other than that, we have McShane and O'Shea who are two years after their shelf life, and a bunch of youngsters who no-one can really say if they're adequate (U23 isn't always the best barometer to judge ability)

Oliveira on the other hand has Bodvarsson, Baldock, Novakovich (not tested in this league however) who whilst they're not as good as Oli, they're better options than the "other CB's"

Obviously there are a lot of people who mention Southwood etc but I generally have no idea if they'll be good enough

Weren’t we all crying out for a striker earlier in the season though? Granted we had injuries, but not sure many fans had the confidence Baldock, Bodvarsson & co were potent enough

[NewCorkSeth]

I would like all 6 of them in an ideal world. I'll list them in how I think we should prioritise them in that ideal world first.

1 - Martinez: Simply put hes a class above most Championship keepers. He is also the hardest to get back imo.

2 - Miazga: A month ago it would have been Oliveira in this spot. Miazga has been very good. He brings out the best in Moore and is almost an ideal partner for him. If we got him back we have a settled defence which is so important. We also need a shithouse. I reckon hes the second most difficult for us to get.

3 - Oliveira: He's a proper striker. Theres not much else to say in his pros column. We have needed a proper striker for a long time. The reason I have dropped him below Miazga is I think his selfishness will sometimes hinder us. I think we have a good chance of getting him.

4 - Ezatolahi: An odd one I know considering he only played 4 times but he looked incredible for me. His was so comfortable on and off the ball. If we start next season with him and Rinomhota as our CMs we might actually have solved our midfield issues. I saw Sporting are looking to sign him so the comparisons with Carrico continue.

5 - Baker: It only goes to show how strong our loans have been that one of our best performers in recent weeks is only in at 5 for me. He has improved virtually every week. Hes not only a good player but hes passionate and dedicated. I want him back badly.

6 - Ejaria: Poor Ejaria. Hes been mostly very good but seems to be at the bottom of all our lists. Hes got all the makings of a top player. His balance can be iffy at times but hes really done well. He even seems to be adding his own unique contribution in defense.


Of the 6 I think we only really have a chance of getting Oliveira, Baker and Ejaria now if the Ezatolahi to Sporting rumours are true.

[From Despair To Where?]

I'd be delghted if any of them returned but I'd have to order them thus:

Miazga - seems to be forming a good partnership with Moore and adds a bit of steel and grit to the team

Baker - Quietly becoming an indespensable part of our midfield.

Martinez - Would love to see him back but I don't see it happening.

Oliviera - Would be a great signing but would eat up our transfer budget We have Novakovich coming back and Barrow and Meite have combined well in his absense.

Ejaria - Would be a great option if we sell Swift

Ezatolahi - Out of contract at Rostov so one I can definitely see happening. I still don't think we've seen enough of him to make a proper informed judgement but if Baker is destined for bigger things then he's a pretty decent alternative option.





Going off topic for one moment and being slightly mischeivous, having a quick look on TransferMarket, there are a couple of Rio Ave players out of contract this summer. Would Jose consider trying to coax any former players over?

Nelson Monte CB. 23 years old valued at £1.75m and was a regular starter until he got an ankle injury. There is 1 Youtube video of him in action. He looks reasonably quick, decent in the air and comfortable on the ball although we all know how misleading Youtube videos can be. Other than that, I know nothing about him.

Fabio Coentrao LB/DM. Former Champions League winner with Real Madrid and over 50 caps for Portugal. Still only 31. Ordinarily I'd say no chance but if Rio Ave can afford him then so could we but they are his home town team. (This isn't an entirely serious suggestion btw).

[Snowflake Royal]

Oliveira -> Miazga -> Martinez -> Baker -> Ezatolahi -> Ejaria.

Realistically I think that means Oli, Baker and Ezatolahi maybe joined by Ejaria.

Just to expand and explain on this a little.

Oliveira - Yes, he's in a position where we have some genuine competition with Bodvarsson, Meite, Baldock and maybe Novakovitch, Loader and McNulty. But as much as I like Bodvarsson, he's suffered a lot of injury problems and his first touch, strength and hold up aren't close to Oliveira who just plays with a swagger, really wants it, and is really improvisational in his play, which catches defences out On top of that, good goalscoring line leaders are very hard to find and tend to be very expensive. When you find one, you'd be mad to let them slip through your fingers. Absolutely crucial to giving us a goal threat and outlet.

Miazga - sort your defence out and your goalkeeper has less to do. He's big, he's not slow, he's powerful and he can pass. He also plays in a position where we have few options we can be confident about. Blackett is really the only other CB option to pair with Moore than we've seen in more than one game and is vaguely competent. O'Shea and McShane are past it. McIntyre, Osho and Holmes can certainly contribute, but expecting one or two to pay 20 - 40 games? Eek, that's some trepidation. But he's one of the less realistic options

Martinez - when you have a keeper this good, you want to keep them. Jaakkola is out of contract and doesn't suit the passing game at all. Walker is still a bit of an unknown quality, Southward and co... maybe, but it's a bit of a gamble to show that much faith. Mannone - no thanks. But, realistically we've got no chance.

Baker - A slow start but he's really made that deep playmaker role his own. Again, we've got lots of bodies in midfield, but not many of them are really reliable options. And really you need three good midfielders for the two screening positions, plus back up. We have Rinomhota and maybe Kelly - who seems out of favour and likely to leave. It's a weak spot, if you're shit in midfield you'll struggle in defence and attack. As we have for years.

Ezatolahi - less desperate now Baker and Rinomhota are proving their worth, and obviously we only saw a handful of games. But you need more than just the first XI midfielders to succeed and he'd give us the ability to play more defensively against good teams and give us the options to have a quality midfielder on the bench or in reserve the whole time.

Ejaria - He's the one I'm the least convinced by, but he has the potential to be really good and be an alternative to / replace Swift... he's got quick feet and he drives forward well, but he's a bit unreliable in ball retention. He does chase back well though. He's competing with Swift, Loader, Aluko etc... so a bit mixed, I see him as the attacking midfielder rather than a winger or normal midfielder by the way, but I also think the position is the least important compared to all the other loanees.

[NewCorkSeth]

Oliveira -> Miazga -> Martinez -> Baker -> Ezatolahi -> Ejaria.

Realistically I think that means Oli, Baker and Ezatolahi maybe joined by Ejaria.

Just to expand and explain on this a little.

Oliveira - Yes, he's in a position where we have some genuine competition with Bodvarsson, Meite, Baldock and maybe Novakovitch, Loader and McNulty. But as much as I like Bodvarsson, he's suffered a lot of injury problems and his first touch, strength and hold up aren't close to Oliveira who just plays with a swagger, really wants it, and is really improvisational in his play, which catches defences out On top of that, good goalscoring line leaders are very hard to find and tend to be very expensive. When you find one, you'd be mad to let them slip through your fingers. Absolutely crucial to giving us a goal threat and outlet.

Miazga - sort your defence out and your goalkeeper has less to do. He's big, he's not slow, he's powerful and he can pass. He also plays in a position where we have few options we can be confident about. Blackett is really the only other CB option to pair with Moore than we've seen in more than one game and is vaguely competent. O'Shea and McShane are past it. McIntyre, Osho and Holmes can certainly contribute, but expecting one or two to pay 20 - 40 games? Eek, that's some trepidation. But he's one of the less realistic options

Martinez - when you have a keeper this good, you want to keep them. Jaakkola is out of contract and doesn't suit the passing game at all. Walker is still a bit of an unknown quality, Southward and co... maybe, but it's a bit of a gamble to show that much faith. Mannone - no thanks. But, realistically we've got no chance.

Baker - A slow start but he's really made that deep playmaker role his own. Again, we've got lots of bodies in midfield, but not many of them are really reliable options. And really you need three good midfielders for the two screening positions, plus back up. We have Rinomhota and maybe Kelly - who seems out of favour and likely to leave. It's a weak spot, if you're shit in midfield you'll struggle in defence and attack. As we have for years.

Ezatolahi - less desperate now Baker and Rinomhota are proving their worth, and obviously we only saw a handful of games. But you need more than just the first XI midfielders to succeed and he'd give us the ability to play more defensively against good teams and give us the options to have a quality midfielder on the bench or in reserve the whole time.

Ejaria - He's the one I'm the least convinced by, but he has the potential to be really good and be an alternative to / replace Swift... he's got quick feet and he drives forward well, but he's a bit unreliable in ball retention. He does chase back well though. He's competing with Swift, Loader, Aluko etc... so a bit mixed, I see him as the attacking midfielder rather than a winger or normal midfielder by the way, but I also think the position is the least important compared to all the other loanees.

I remember you giving out balls to me for capitalising Van Den Berg yet you continually misspell Novakovich. Tut Tut Ian.

[Snowflake Royal]

Oliveira -> Miazga -> Martinez -> Baker -> Ezatolahi -> Ejaria.

Realistically I think that means Oli, Baker and Ezatolahi maybe joined by Ejaria.

Just to expand and explain on this a little.

Oliveira - Yes, he's in a position where we have some genuine competition with Bodvarsson, Meite, Baldock and maybe Novakovitch, Loader and McNulty. But as much as I like Bodvarsson, he's suffered a lot of injury problems and his first touch, strength and hold up aren't close to Oliveira who just plays with a swagger, really wants it, and is really improvisational in his play, which catches defences out On top of that, good goalscoring line leaders are very hard to find and tend to be very expensive. When you find one, you'd be mad to let them slip through your fingers. Absolutely crucial to giving us a goal threat and outlet.

Miazga - sort your defence out and your goalkeeper has less to do. He's big, he's not slow, he's powerful and he can pass. He also plays in a position where we have few options we can be confident about. Blackett is really the only other CB option to pair with Moore than we've seen in more than one game and is vaguely competent. O'Shea and McShane are past it. McIntyre, Osho and Holmes can certainly contribute, but expecting one or two to pay 20 - 40 games? Eek, that's some trepidation. But he's one of the less realistic options

Martinez - when you have a keeper this good, you want to keep them. Jaakkola is out of contract and doesn't suit the passing game at all. Walker is still a bit of an unknown quality, Southward and co... maybe, but it's a bit of a gamble to show that much faith. Mannone - no thanks. But, realistically we've got no chance.

Baker - A slow start but he's really made that deep playmaker role his own. Again, we've got lots of bodies in midfield, but not many of them are really reliable options. And really you need three good midfielders for the two screening positions, plus back up. We have Rinomhota and maybe Kelly - who seems out of favour and likely to leave. It's a weak spot, if you're shit in midfield you'll struggle in defence and attack. As we have for years.

Ezatolahi - less desperate now Baker and Rinomhota are proving their worth, and obviously we only saw a handful of games. But you need more than just the first XI midfielders to succeed and he'd give us the ability to play more defensively against good teams and give us the options to have a quality midfielder on the bench or in reserve the whole time.

Ejaria - He's the one I'm the least convinced by, but he has the potential to be really good and be an alternative to / replace Swift... he's got quick feet and he drives forward well, but he's a bit unreliable in ball retention. He does chase back well though. He's competing with Swift, Loader, Aluko etc... so a bit mixed, I see him as the attacking midfielder rather than a winger or normal midfielder by the way, but I also think the position is the least important compared to all the other loanees.

I remember you giving out balls to me for capitalising Van Den Berg yet you continually misspell Novakovich. Tut Tut Ian.

You know, I was pretty much getting it right all the time and then started doubting myself when I saw someone else at a t and just started copying them. I should have greater faith in me it seems.

Double checked it on the OS, won't get it wrong again bar stupid autocorrect / typos. Or just call him Nova.

[NewCorkSeth]

Just to expand and explain on this a little.

Oliveira - Yes, he's in a position where we have some genuine competition with Bodvarsson, Meite, Baldock and maybe Novakovitch, Loader and McNulty. But as much as I like Bodvarsson, he's suffered a lot of injury problems and his first touch, strength and hold up aren't close to Oliveira who just plays with a swagger, really wants it, and is really improvisational in his play, which catches defences out On top of that, good goalscoring line leaders are very hard to find and tend to be very expensive. When you find one, you'd be mad to let them slip through your fingers. Absolutely crucial to giving us a goal threat and outlet.

Miazga - sort your defence out and your goalkeeper has less to do. He's big, he's not slow, he's powerful and he can pass. He also plays in a position where we have few options we can be confident about. Blackett is really the only other CB option to pair with Moore than we've seen in more than one game and is vaguely competent. O'Shea and McShane are past it. McIntyre, Osho and Holmes can certainly contribute, but expecting one or two to pay 20 - 40 games? Eek, that's some trepidation. But he's one of the less realistic options

Martinez - when you have a keeper this good, you want to keep them. Jaakkola is out of contract and doesn't suit the passing game at all. Walker is still a bit of an unknown quality, Southward and co... maybe, but it's a bit of a gamble to show that much faith. Mannone - no thanks. But, realistically we've got no chance.

Baker - A slow start but he's really made that deep playmaker role his own. Again, we've got lots of bodies in midfield, but not many of them are really reliable options. And really you need three good midfielders for the two screening positions, plus back up. We have Rinomhota and maybe Kelly - who seems out of favour and likely to leave. It's a weak spot, if you're shit in midfield you'll struggle in defence and attack. As we have for years.

Ezatolahi - less desperate now Baker and Rinomhota are proving their worth, and obviously we only saw a handful of games. But you need more than just the first XI midfielders to succeed and he'd give us the ability to play more defensively against good teams and give us the options to have a quality midfielder on the bench or in reserve the whole time.

Ejaria - He's the one I'm the least convinced by, but he has the potential to be really good and be an alternative to / replace Swift... he's got quick feet and he drives forward well, but he's a bit unreliable in ball retention. He does chase back well though. He's competing with Swift, Loader, Aluko etc... so a bit mixed, I see him as the attacking midfielder rather than a winger or normal midfielder by the way, but I also think the position is the least important compared to all the other loanees.

I remember you giving out balls to me for capitalising Van Den Berg yet you continually misspell Novakovich. Tut Tut Ian.

You know, I was pretty much getting it right all the time and then started doubting myself when I saw someone else at a t and just started copying them. I should have greater faith in me it seems.

Double checked it on the OS, won't get it wrong again bar stupid autocorrect / typos. Or just call him Nova.

You should expect several autocorrect failures. On my phone I was continually getting Jaakkola as Jaakola.

[Snowflake Royal]

I remember you giving out balls to me for capitalising Van Den Berg yet you continually misspell Novakovich. Tut Tut Ian.

You know, I was pretty much getting it right all the time and then started doubting myself when I saw someone else at a t and just started copying them. I should have greater faith in me it seems.

Double checked it on the OS, won't get it wrong again bar stupid autocorrect / typos. Or just call him Nova.

You should expect several autocorrect failures. On my phone I was continually getting Jaakkola as Jaakola.

My favourite is regularly almost talking about how good Sharia is when I'm not a fan of Islamic law.

[CountryRoyal]

I remember you giving out balls to me for capitalising Van Den Berg yet you continually misspell Novakovich. Tut Tut Ian.

You know, I was pretty much getting it right all the time and then started doubting myself when I saw someone else at a t and just started copying them. I should have greater faith in me it seems.

Double checked it on the OS, won't get it wrong again bar stupid autocorrect / typos. Or just call him Nova.

You should expect several autocorrect failures. On my phone I was continually getting Jaakkola as Jaakola.

Yeah for ages my phone autocorrected Gunter to “useless fcuking soft pcunt”.

It’s really annoying.

[Snowflake Royal]

You know, I was pretty much getting it right all the time and then started doubting myself when I saw someone else at a t and just started copying them. I should have greater faith in me it seems.

Double checked it on the OS, won't get it wrong again bar stupid autocorrect / typos. Or just call him Nova.

You should expect several autocorrect failures. On my phone I was continually getting Jaakkola as Jaakola.

Yeah for ages my phone autocorrected Gunter to “useless fcuking soft pcunt”.

It’s really annoying.

[FCReading1988]

Hopefully we can try for them all and if we end up with 2 or 3 that would be a pretty good outcome. My priority would be:

Miazga > Baker > Oliveira > Eza > Ejaria (Martinez not a realistic option unfortunately)

I guess the other question (if players were available and wanted to sign for us) is whether we could afford / would be prepared to pay the fees for them. Be interesting to get peoples thoughts in terms of the players values in the market. Could be way off but this is how i'd see it:

Miazga - 4-5m
Baker - 6-8m (maybe more if Swift is being valued at 7m!?)
Oliveira - 5-7m
Eza - 2-3m (think his contract runs out at Rostov at the end of this season so could be slightly cheaper)
Ejaria - 3-4m

[Chameleon]

Martinez > Miazga > Baker > Eza > Oliviera > Eja

Ideally we'd keep all of them, they've all been great, and it feels really harsh to put Eja bottom.

Martinez and Miazga are players who we should be moving heaven and earth to keep. The connection Miazga and Moore have is pretty incredible, and it'd be harsh on Moore to make him have to get used to yet another partner.

As for Martinez, I think that we stand a chance, he's 26 and yet has only played 50 odd senior games, 16 of which were for us (the club who he's started for the 2nd most amount of times is Wolves, with 13), bench warming is frustrating, and hopefully we can offer him first team football to entice him to stay.

Baker is just a great player, we're close enough to Chelsea for them to monitor him regularly, reckon that there's a decent chance we get him back for another season. If we somehow get promoted next year then possibly even a third season, but can't see us buying him.