Olise

[Orion1871]

To be honest I’m pretty pessimistic about our current academy lot, I don’t think they’re progressing much and the talent level seems to be the lowest it has been for about 15 years. Lots of players with a good first touch and not much else.

Top clubs get there first , often at a very early age. Ruthlessly discard, Money no longer filters downwards. What's left is the late developers. Who fall to the lower rungs before working they way upwards,

And pinch the good ones for a pretty paltry sum compared to what they could be worth thanks to the EPPP system.

[Snowflake Royal]

To be honest I’m pretty pessimistic about our current academy lot, I don’t think they’re progressing much and the talent level seems to be the lowest it has been for about 15 years. Lots of players with a good first touch and not much else.

Top clubs get there first , often at a very early age. Ruthlessly discard, Money no longer filters downwards. What's left is the late developers. Who fall to the lower rungs before working they way upwards,

I dom't think that's anything new, though, the same dynamics were in play when McIntyre or Obita were wee lads.

I think the big issue is that the modern academy environment focuses too much on trying to make everyone a "creative" player. The England team has loads of depth in attacking midfield and the wide spots. We have only one international-standard centre back, defensive midfielder, and centre forward (Stones, Rice, and Kane).

The result is that we, and a lot of academy teams, have a lot of players who float around in the half-spaces and relatively few who can dictate pace, get in behind, or hold off a challenge. Defending is either all about pressing, or about getting large numbers behind the ball, not so much about individual positioning of defensive players.

Yeah agree with that in general. So many players coming through don't have a role beyond 'looks tidy but ineffective, not really a striker,not really a winger, not really a midfielder or fullback'.

Though our record at producing CBs is quality. So we buck the trend at our relative level. Forwards less strong for us.

[Notts Royal]

We put ourselves into a position with both Olise and Richards where we were under embargo and couldn’t offer contracts (regardless of if they’d have been accepted). It is probably my biggest frustration with the EFL process, as there was opportunity to reduce our debts. However we only have ourselves to blame.

On Olive’s value, Buendia was sold for £37 million at the same time. We missed out through our own ridiculous financial mismanagement and the EFL’s self defeating rules.

I disagree. Both players became 1st team regulars in the backend of the Covid 19-20 season, before the transfer embargo, and before they really made a name for themselves. It was apparent they had real quality at that stage without being consistent. That was the time to offer improved terms, which we failed to do. What was even more galling in the case of Richards was that both the other left back options (Obita & Blackett) were out of contract in that summer, so why we didn’t tie Richards down by that point was beyond me.

The tragedy in the case of Olise was that we didn’t get to see his rapid rise due to Covid.

[Royal_jimmy]

Olise alone pays for 3 to 4 years of the Academy just with his transfer fee. Then if you consider the value of his appearances vs signing someone (inevitably on higher wages) you're probably looking at another 2-3 years.

Basically, just in Olise, Richards, Obita, Rinomhota, Sigurdsson, Pearce, Karacan, Robson-Kanu, Holmes, McCarthy and McIntyre, the Academy has paid for 20 or 30 years worth of its cost.

Sure does! which is why it's so disappointing to lose Olise and Richards for peanuts

[Franchise FC]

Olise alone pays for 3 to 4 years of the Academy just with his transfer fee. Then if you consider the value of his appearances vs signing someone (inevitably on higher wages) you're probably looking at another 2-3 years.

Basically, just in Olise, Richards, Obita, Rinomhota, Sigurdsson, Pearce, Karacan, Robson-Kanu, Holmes, McCarthy and McIntyre, the Academy has paid for 20 or 30 years worth of its cost.

Sure does! which is why it's so disappointing to lose Olise and Richards for peanuts

Which of current crop of the academy do we need to spaff £10k a week on to avoid losing a fortune on a transfer ?
Because it's incredibly easy to do that

Oh, and £8m isn't peanuts

[3points]

We put ourselves into a position with both Olise and Richards where we were under embargo and couldn’t offer contracts (regardless of if they’d have been accepted). It is probably my biggest frustration with the EFL process, as there was opportunity to reduce our debts. However we only have ourselves to blame.

On Olive’s value, Buendia was sold for £37 million at the same time. We missed out through our own ridiculous financial mismanagement and the EFL’s self defeating rules.

I disagree. Both players became 1st team regulars in the backend of the Covid 19-20 season, before the transfer embargo, and before they really made a name for themselves. It was apparent they had real quality at that stage without being consistent. That was the time to offer improved terms, which we failed to do. What was even more galling in the case of Richards was that both the other left back options (Obita & Blackett) were out of contract in that summer, so why we didn’t tie Richards down by that point was beyond me.

The tragedy in the case of Olise was that we didn’t get to see his rapid rise due to Covid.

I have it on good authority that we tried to tie down Richards and made numerous contract offers. But he had no intention of signing

[Vision]

We put ourselves into a position with both Olise and Richards where we were under embargo and couldn’t offer contracts (regardless of if they’d have been accepted). It is probably my biggest frustration with the EFL process, as there was opportunity to reduce our debts. However we only have ourselves to blame.

On Olive’s value, Buendia was sold for £37 million at the same time. We missed out through our own ridiculous financial mismanagement and the EFL’s self defeating rules.

I disagree. Both players became 1st team regulars in the backend of the Covid 19-20 season, before the transfer embargo, and before they really made a name for themselves. It was apparent they had real quality at that stage without being consistent. That was the time to offer improved terms, which we failed to do. What was even more galling in the case of Richards was that both the other left back options (Obita & Blackett) were out of contract in that summer, so why we didn’t tie Richards down by that point was beyond me.

The tragedy in the case of Olise was that we didn’t get to see his rapid rise due to Covid.

I have it on good authority that we tried to tie down Richards and made numerous contract offers. But he had no intention of signing

Both of those players broke through under Gomes , stalled a bit under Bowen, then blossomed under Pauno. Problem was by the time they truly blossomed it was too late and there was no chance of signing them up.

The best chance we'd have had to secure them was when Gomes was playing them regularly. Even if we'd tried , I think Olise and his agent knew he was moving onto better things sooner rather than later. First thing Bowen did when he became manager was drop Richards for Blackett so at that point he was also unlikely to want to commit his future to us.

[Hound]

IIRC on here people were far from convinced about richards until his good spell in Pauno season 1. By then he was last year of contract and I reckon there was prob a window of about 3 weeks when he would have signed with us and we were sure we wanted him

Then his head got turned and be rightfully held out for a better offer

I thought he was pretty poor after Xmas that year so he really was only good for about 3 months. And he’s done naff all since for various reasons

[Mid Sussex Royal]

IIRC on here people were far from convinced about richards until his good spell in Pauno season 1. By then he was last year of contract and I reckon there was prob a window of about 3 weeks when he would have signed with us and we were sure we wanted him

Then his head got turned and be rightfully held out for a better offer

I thought he was pretty poor after Xmas that year so he really was only good for about 3 months. And he’s done naff all since for various reasons

We were also under some kind of embargo in Pauno season one so probably couldn't offer him anything which would have made him stay

[Hound]

IIRC on here people were far from convinced about richards until his good spell in Pauno season 1. By then he was last year of contract and I reckon there was prob a window of about 3 weeks when he would have signed with us and we were sure we wanted him

Then his head got turned and be rightfully held out for a better offer

I thought he was pretty poor after Xmas that year so he really was only good for about 3 months. And he’s done naff all since for various reasons

We were also under some kind of embargo in Pauno season one so probably couldn't offer him anything which would have made him stay

Yeah that as well. Club blamed that didn’t they?

[Notts Royal]

I disagree. Both players became 1st team regulars in the backend of the Covid 19-20 season, before the transfer embargo, and before they really made a name for themselves. It was apparent they had real quality at that stage without being consistent. That was the time to offer improved terms, which we failed to do. What was even more galling in the case of Richards was that both the other left back options (Obita & Blackett) were out of contract in that summer, so why we didn’t tie Richards down by that point was beyond me.

The tragedy in the case of Olise was that we didn’t get to see his rapid rise due to Covid.

I have it on good authority that we tried to tie down Richards and made numerous contract offers. But he had no intention of signing

Both of those players broke through under Gomes , stalled a bit under Bowen, then blossomed under Pauno. Problem was by the time they truly blossomed it was too late and there was no chance of signing them up.

The best chance we'd have had to secure them was when Gomes was playing them regularly. Even if we'd tried , I think Olise and his agent knew he was moving onto better things sooner rather than later. First thing Bowen did when he became manager was drop Richards for Blackett so at that point he was also unlikely to want to commit his future to us.

I’d be interested to know how many games Richards vs Blackett played under Bowen, as I seem to recall he became first choice under Bowen. Could be my bad memory though. But to me he should’ve been tied down for longer during Spring 2020, when he had become first choice but wasn’t blowing people away with his performances

[Snowflake Royal]

I have it on good authority that we tried to tie down Richards and made numerous contract offers. But he had no intention of signing

Both of those players broke through under Gomes , stalled a bit under Bowen, then blossomed under Pauno. Problem was by the time they truly blossomed it was too late and there was no chance of signing them up.

The best chance we'd have had to secure them was when Gomes was playing them regularly. Even if we'd tried , I think Olise and his agent knew he was moving onto better things sooner rather than later. First thing Bowen did when he became manager was drop Richards for Blackett so at that point he was also unlikely to want to commit his future to us.

I’d be interested to know how many games Richards vs Blackett played under Bowen, as I seem to recall he became first choice under Bowen. Could be my bad memory though. But to me he should’ve been tied down for longer during Spring 2020, when he had become first choice but wasn’t blowing people away with his performances

Not put the time in to check by dates, but Richards played 23(5) in the Bowen season and Blackett played 16(4).

IIRC at the end of Bowen's season, we didn't really rate Richards particularly highly, but Obita's legs were shot and Blackett wanted out and wasn't very popular so he was our only real bet.

[Notts Royal]

Both of those players broke through under Gomes , stalled a bit under Bowen, then blossomed under Pauno. Problem was by the time they truly blossomed it was too late and there was no chance of signing them up.

The best chance we'd have had to secure them was when Gomes was playing them regularly. Even if we'd tried , I think Olise and his agent knew he was moving onto better things sooner rather than later. First thing Bowen did when he became manager was drop Richards for Blackett so at that point he was also unlikely to want to commit his future to us.

I’d be interested to know how many games Richards vs Blackett played under Bowen, as I seem to recall he became first choice under Bowen. Could be my bad memory though. But to me he should’ve been tied down for longer during Spring 2020, when he had become first choice but wasn’t blowing people away with his performances

Not put the time in to check by dates, but Richards played 23(5) in the Bowen season and Blackett played 16(4).

IIRC at the end of Bowen's season, we didn't really rate Richards particularly highly, but Obita's legs were shot and Blackett wanted out and wasn't very popular so he was our only real bet.

Thanks for the stats. Maybe it was just me then rating Richards on a personal level. I thought he was decent enough then but we didn’t envisage his rapid rise the following season

[URZZZZ]

I disagree. Both players became 1st team regulars in the backend of the Covid 19-20 season, before the transfer embargo, and before they really made a name for themselves. It was apparent they had real quality at that stage without being consistent. That was the time to offer improved terms, which we failed to do. What was even more galling in the case of Richards was that both the other left back options (Obita & Blackett) were out of contract in that summer, so why we didn’t tie Richards down by that point was beyond me.

The tragedy in the case of Olise was that we didn’t get to see his rapid rise due to Covid.

I have it on good authority that we tried to tie down Richards and made numerous contract offers. But he had no intention of signing

First thing Bowen did when he became manager was drop Richards for Blackett so at that point he was also unlikely to want to commit his future to us.

Not strictly true. Bowen was appointed mid October and Blackett’s first start under him didn’t come around until mid December (in which we subsequently kept 5 clean sheets in a row, or something to that accord)

Instead, Bowen had a strange obsession with cramming Obita into the side who had gone from an OK Championship defender pre-injury to someone who was clearly past it. Which, I guess still makes your overall point valid

Think we have to consider that Richards was in and out of the team under four successive managers and even under Paunovic, was dropped/subbed a fair amount towards the end. Aside from a strong six months (which obviously sparked Bayern’s interest somehow) he never quite did enough to cement a place in the XI week in week out

[Clyde1998]

Seems Chelsea have agreed personal terms with him, leaving only the scheduling of payments to Crystal Palace remaining: https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/ar ... 44m6mpe8eo

Olise has a release clause, but the exact figure is unknown and reports have a very large range (between £40-70m).

[Orion1871]

Olise alone pays for 3 to 4 years of the Academy just with his transfer fee. Then if you consider the value of his appearances vs signing someone (inevitably on higher wages) you're probably looking at another 2-3 years.

Basically, just in Olise, Richards, Obita, Rinomhota, Sigurdsson, Pearce, Karacan, Robson-Kanu, Holmes, McCarthy and McIntyre, the Academy has paid for 20 or 30 years worth of its cost.

Sure does! which is why it's so disappointing to lose Olise and Richards for peanuts

Which of current crop of the academy do we need to spaff £10k a week on to avoid losing a fortune on a transfer ?
Because it's incredibly easy to do that

Oh, and £8m isn't peanuts

It is for a player whose value was at least double that £8m.

[Franchise FC]

Far be it for me to criticise Chelsea’s transfer policy, but with quite possibly the signing of the season 2023/24 playing in exactly the position that Olise plays, this doesn’t seem to make a lot of sense

Unless Palmer is off to Real Madrid or Barcelona, of course

[Franchise FC]

Sure does! which is why it's so disappointing to lose Olise and Richards for peanuts

Which of current crop of the academy do we need to spaff £10k a week on to avoid losing a fortune on a transfer ?
Because it's incredibly easy to do that

Oh, and £8m isn't peanuts

It is for a player whose value was at least double that £8m.

Is this the first time you’ve logged in since April ?

[Hound]

Seems Chelsea have agreed personal terms with him, leaving only the scheduling of payments to Crystal Palace remaining: https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/ar ... 44m6mpe8eo

Olise has a release clause, but the exact figure is unknown and reports have a very large range (between £40-70m).

60m seems the most common figure

I do wonder if this potential transfer is some of the hold up of our sale. If rumours are true that we have a sell on fee, that might be why Dai is potentially holding on or wanting more for the club again

[Stranded]

Far be it for me to criticise Chelsea’s transfer policy, but with quite possibly the signing of the season 2023/24 playing in exactly the position that Olise plays, this doesn’t seem to make a lot of sense

Unless Palmer is off to Real Madrid or Barcelona, of course

Chelsea don't have a transfer policy.