New embargo incoming

231 posts
User avatar
leon
Hob Nob Legend
Posts: 31156
Joined: 14 Apr 2004 09:18
Location: Hips, Lips, Tits, Power

Re: New embargo incoming

by leon » 23 Jun 2023 22:58

Snowflake Royal Many clubs have been through these situations and survived... the majority did, in fact.

We now are actually starting to see some concrete things wrong from reliable sources rather than people wetting the bed over things taking a bit of time, lack of statements no one should be looking for anyway and some empty twitter rumours.*

There's still no reason for the hystrionics **though. Nice to see people are finally catching up with how shit an owner Dai is though. A few years slow, but hey ho.


*:lol: Priceless

* *:? whatever they are

Hound
Hob Nob Legend
Posts: 25334
Joined: 27 Sep 2016 22:16
Location: Simpleton

Re: New embargo incoming

by Hound » 24 Jun 2023 07:01

Rumours are that Dai was at the club yesterday. Inc signing up Selles

blythspartan
Hob Nob Regular
Posts: 2422
Joined: 05 Jun 2012 20:50

Re: New embargo incoming

by blythspartan » 24 Jun 2023 08:34

Hound Rumours are that Dai was at the club yesterday. Inc signing up Selles


Yeah, I heard this yesterday. A really good friend who knows the old Reading hierarchy but not the new one has been giving me little snippets of information whereas in the past he’s said oxf*rd all. He knows that I post on here. I asked him whether a couple of tweets I had seen about Ashley being interested were true but he declined to comment. It’s probably all bollox tbh but it’s so difficult to know fact from fiction.

Hound
Hob Nob Legend
Posts: 25334
Joined: 27 Sep 2016 22:16
Location: Simpleton

Re: New embargo incoming

by Hound » 24 Jun 2023 10:31

Sounds like possibly paid what’s owed re wages etc as well

Still prob get some sort of sanction mind you

blythspartan
Hob Nob Regular
Posts: 2422
Joined: 05 Jun 2012 20:50

Re: New embargo incoming

by blythspartan » 24 Jun 2023 11:56

Hound Sounds like possibly paid what’s owed re wages etc as well

Still prob get some sort of sanction mind you


Using Wigan as an example surely it can be no more than 3 or 4 points. I don’t think they can deduct points iro HMRC unless we ended up going into admin. I wonder why they didn’t punish us last season for non payment of wages? Maybe we struck up a deal with the EFL for any punishment to be this season.


The Royal Forester
Hob Nob Regular
Posts: 1554
Joined: 25 Dec 2015 13:53

Re: New embargo incoming

by The Royal Forester » 24 Jun 2023 12:42

Wasn't Wigan 3 points for each offence? Could mean 9 points in total for us. On the brighter side I seem to recall Wigan's points were suspended until they offended again. The EFL named Dai as being responible , maybe the punishment will have to paid by himself, not the club. So. who knows what will happen? Even the EFL probably don't know yet.

Snowball
Hob Nob Legend
Posts: 20778
Joined: 02 Jan 2009 18:35

Re: New embargo incoming

by Snowball » 24 Jun 2023 13:48

Is it possible that the loan player pay etc is down to a dispute between Reading and loaning club?

We say player is sick so not picked but they say he wasn’t sick and we had to pay that player’s wages AND PAYE?

Thus we might get done for non payment AND tax

User avatar
tidus_mi2
Hob Nob Addict
Posts: 7450
Joined: 15 Jun 2012 15:24

Re: New embargo incoming

by tidus_mi2 » 24 Jun 2023 13:56

The Royal Forester Wasn't Wigan 3 points for each offence? Could mean 9 points in total for us. On the brighter side I seem to recall Wigan's points were suspended until they offended again. The EFL named Dai as being responible , maybe the punishment will have to paid by himself, not the club. So. who knows what will happen? Even the EFL probably don't know yet.

Wigan had to fail to pay 3 times before they got a suspended 4 point deduction, so the precedent would arguably be the same with us. Also it was 4pts each time, not 3, hence why they are on -8pts right now, they actually haven't received a further punishment for the final late payment as of yet, so either the EFL will let it slide in lieu of their takeover, or they will eventually be on -12pts.

The Royal Forester
Hob Nob Regular
Posts: 1554
Joined: 25 Dec 2015 13:53

Re: New embargo incoming

by The Royal Forester » 24 Jun 2023 14:25

tidus_mi2
The Royal Forester Wasn't Wigan 3 points for each offence? Could mean 9 points in total for us. On the brighter side I seem to recall Wigan's points were suspended until they offended again. The EFL named Dai as being responible , maybe the punishment will have to paid by himself, not the club. So. who knows what will happen? Even the EFL probably don't know yet.

Wigan had to fail to pay 3 times before they got a suspended 4 point deduction, so the precedent would arguably be the same with us. Also it was 4pts each time, not 3, hence why they are on -8pts right now, they actually haven't received a further punishment for the final late payment as of yet, so either the EFL will let it slide in lieu of their takeover, or they will eventually be on -12pts.

I think you will find that the final deduction was taken from last seasons total, yes, after the season ended. What was the point of that I do not know. or was that for something different?


Sutekh
Hob Nob Legend
Posts: 20521
Joined: 12 Feb 2014 14:05
Location: Undiscovered pyramid somewhere in Egypt

Re: New embargo incoming

by Sutekh » 24 Jun 2023 16:51

The Royal Forester
tidus_mi2
The Royal Forester Wasn't Wigan 3 points for each offence? Could mean 9 points in total for us. On the brighter side I seem to recall Wigan's points were suspended until they offended again. The EFL named Dai as being responible , maybe the punishment will have to paid by himself, not the club. So. who knows what will happen? Even the EFL probably don't know yet.

Wigan had to fail to pay 3 times before they got a suspended 4 point deduction, so the precedent would arguably be the same with us. Also it was 4pts each time, not 3, hence why they are on -8pts right now, they actually haven't received a further punishment for the final late payment as of yet, so either the EFL will let it slide in lieu of their takeover, or they will eventually be on -12pts.

I think you will find that the final deduction was taken from last seasons total, yes, after the season ended. What was the point of that I do not know. or was that for something different?


Wigan i believe offended 3 times last season and got ONE 3 point deduction. They then did it again almost immediately, but the FL did nothing, then repeated the failure a month ago and got a 4 point deduction to start next season. They then got another 4 point deduction for failing to set up a backup account with appropriate monies within the timescale set by the FL.

Therefore using that as a precedent I would say a 3 point deduction is the most Reading should get for the failing to pay on time (but even that is arguable as the FL did sod all during last season and have only suddenly brought it up now).

User avatar
Lower West
Hob Nob Subscriber
Hob Nob Subscriber
Posts: 4988
Joined: 14 Apr 2004 11:35
Location: Admiring Clem Morfuni at Work

Re: New embargo incoming

by Lower West » 24 Jun 2023 17:31

We've the added liability of the EFL having zero confidence in anything that owner says or agrees to. A business in financial difficulties can remain transparent and open. When the owner plays endless games, protracts negotiations and cannot be relied upon for any words spoken. The bond of trust is irretrievably broken down. No one is prepared to waste their valuable time.

The Green Programme
Member
Posts: 255
Joined: 27 Oct 2018 13:12

Re: New embargo incoming

by The Green Programme » 24 Jun 2023 20:01

Elm Park Kid
WestYorksRoyal
Sutekh Perhaps one thing that should be insisted on is that owners MUST be residenced in the UK for at least 6 months in every year and that owner checks become annual affairs like account audits.

Is there a way football clubs can be treated like cultural assets? We'd need some sort of legislation. For example, you can't just tear down a listed property even if you own it. There should be laws that allows the authorities to create a compulsory sale order or something like that. These clubs have historic value in their communities and it's ridiculous that once a bad owner gets in there is nothing the regulators can do.

Chelsea and Abrahmovic was an extraordinary set of circumstances. Why not extend the power to do it for failing to pay wages etc. Would obviously be the nuclear option, but just knowing the threat was there would bring owners to heel.


There are plans to bring in an independent regulator for football who would have some powers to control the way that football clubs operate and increase safeguards against a bad owner.

But, at the end of the day governments are loathed to directly meddle too much in football. For one, the PL has be a fantastic success story overall, driven primarily by following commercial business practices. Two - FIFA bans governments from interfering too much in national football set ups. And three, it risk creating political time bombs if governments are see as responsible for the welfare of individual football clubs. MPs could lose their seats if they were seen to not interfere enough/in the right way.

The best thing to do in terms of safeguarding clubs would be the German approach of fan ownership. But then the German league has stagnated for decades, one club completely dominating and others being unable to raise the finances needed to compete. And they themselves are looking to move away from their existing model.


Excellent post.

I do think the EFL problem is that Championship Clubs often follow a Chelsea/Man City/Newcastle type model of incredibly wealthy owners pouring money in (sometimes allegedly disguised as lucrative ‘sponsorship’ deals as with Man City who have somehow got away with cheating the PL’sand UEFA’s FFP for years).

This model generally fails under EFL FFP rules and therefore Championship Clubs often take a massive risk.

The Derby v Villa play off final was literally do or die; whoever went up would be fine financially; whoever lost; risked oblivion due to flagrant FFP abuse.

Bournemouth are another Club who would have had to sell everyone and restructure the Club’s finances if they had not gone up last year.

Pauno made it clear when we finished 7th and blew a fantastic opportunity to go up (Joao’s penalty miss v Preston and open goal miss v Barnsley) with a very, very good squad - “we have to be promoted this season”.

We didn’t make it and that led to the other side of the coin revealing itself - it’s not quite Derby…..

Thanks to Dai’s money - but nonetheless it’s been a terrible price to pay.

The worst mistakes for me have been not cashing in on our youngsters during this period and not offloading Moore, Puscas, Baldock, Meite and others when we could have done so; for fees that would have created a much healthier financial result allowed the Club to build again with a much reduced wage bill and probably no breach of FFP.

To have let Loader and Richards and Osho (to name but three) run their contracts down or leave for next to nothing was such poor management.

It makes me very angry to see such poor decisions - especially when I stop and consider our current predicament.

SCIAG
Hob Nob Addict
Posts: 6482
Joined: 17 Jun 2008 17:43
Location: Liburd for England

Re: New embargo incoming

by SCIAG » 25 Jun 2023 14:02

There was no opportunity to cash in on Puscas before now, or Baldock at all. We also didn't have the chance to cash in on Richards or Osho. They both rejected sensible extensions and we didn't receive offers for them.

Loader and Moore, yes. We had good offers for them that we should have accepted.

But really the bigger issue was that we spent such large sums of money (transfers and wages) on players who didn't really improve us: Ilori, Aluko, Bacuna, Baldock and Puscas being the big ones, but also complete wastes of time like Popa, Araruna, or Meyler. That's mostly but not entirely hindsight.

Sell players while they're valuable, recruit smartly.


Clyde1998
Hob Nob Regular
Posts: 2907
Joined: 04 Mar 2010 16:27

Re: New embargo incoming

by Clyde1998 » 25 Jun 2023 14:40

SCIAG There was no opportunity to cash in on Puscas before now, or Baldock at all. We also didn't have the chance to cash in on Richards or Osho. They both rejected sensible extensions and we didn't receive offers for them.

Loader and Moore, yes. We had good offers for them that we should have accepted.

But really the bigger issue was that we spent such large sums of money (transfers and wages) on players who didn't really improve us: Ilori, Aluko, Bacuna, Baldock and Puscas being the big ones, but also complete wastes of time like Popa, Araruna, or Meyler. That's mostly but not entirely hindsight.

Sell players while they're valuable, recruit smartly.

At least we got fees for Bacuna, Ilori and now Puscas; I think we made a (transfer fee) profit on Bacuna.

Another issue was the squad being far too big - in the 2018-19 season we played 39 players in the league, with the vast majority being on first team wages.

The problem in the last couple of years is we haven't been able to get players in on contracts long enough to have any resell value and the lack of ability to replace any player we did end up selling. Anyone who had any sort of transfer value could be picked up for free at the end of the season, making it pointless for any club to purchase our players for a fee.

Royal_jimmy
Hob Nob Addict
Posts: 5212
Joined: 10 Aug 2011 10:44
Location: Planet Earth

Re: New embargo incoming

by Royal_jimmy » 25 Jun 2023 22:36

Hound Rumours are that Dai was at the club yesterday. Inc signing up Selles


Shame none of us where there to tell him what we really think of the guy

Royal_jimmy
Hob Nob Addict
Posts: 5212
Joined: 10 Aug 2011 10:44
Location: Planet Earth

Re: New embargo incoming

by Royal_jimmy » 25 Jun 2023 22:39

SCIAG There was no opportunity to cash in on Puscas before now, or Baldock at all. We also didn't have the chance to cash in on Richards or Osho. They both rejected sensible extensions and we didn't receive offers for them.

Loader and Moore, yes. We had good offers for them that we should have accepted.

But really the bigger issue was that we spent such large sums of money (transfers and wages) on players who didn't really improve us: Ilori, Aluko, Bacuna, Baldock and Puscas being the big ones, but also complete wastes of time like Popa, Araruna, or Meyler. That's mostly but not entirely hindsight.

Sell players while they're valuable, recruit smartly.


We were nuts to turn £8m down for a centre back in Liam Moore. Centre backs are easier to replace than creative midfielders and strikers, Loader had potential but we'd have been better getting £1-2m and a 25% sell on fee when it was clear he wouldn't sign a new deal.

User avatar
On Strings
Member
Posts: 280
Joined: 25 May 2022 16:56

Re: New embargo incoming

by On Strings » 26 Jun 2023 14:20

...


User avatar
Pepe the Horseman
Hob Nob Super-Addict
Posts: 18413
Joined: 23 Jun 2011 10:24
Location: Putting right what once went wrong

Re: New embargo incoming

by Pepe the Horseman » 26 Jun 2023 14:25

:roll:

User avatar
morganb
Hob Nob Regular
Posts: 2657
Joined: 31 Jul 2017 12:30

Re: New embargo incoming

by morganb » 26 Jun 2023 14:31

The above has been debunked on Twitter as fake.

People have been searching here:

https://www.thegazette.co.uk/company/00053703

Nothing like the above shows up

User avatar
On Strings
Member
Posts: 280
Joined: 25 May 2022 16:56

Re: New embargo incoming

by On Strings » 26 Jun 2023 14:41



Zero credit rating.

231 posts

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: ankeny, SouthDownsRoyal and 174 guests

It is currently 18 Dec 2024 14:06