MATCHWATCH : Shrewsbury Town (a)

[WestYorksRoyal]

Yeah that was my take when he said he lost his man. But I think what he was saying was he post one of his runners. I.e a team mate who should have covered his position.

In terms of "experience", Kelvin got the ball at 2-1 and ran into the corner to tick the clock down. He gained territory and we had possession until it worked it's way back to Yiadom who tried to pump it over the top to a runner. Shrewsbury got the ball, Hutchinson lost his man.

But it's these kids without the express who are the issue? Fcuk off Hutch!

I know burning everything to the ground is not a solution, but I'd happily kick out Yiadom, Hutchinson and Dean today and replace them with Abrefa, Craig and Holmes. It's not our kids letting us down; it's the senior pros offering nothing.

It's both. The senior pros aren't performing and most of our "kids" are out of their depth. They will compete for a single half, or an hour of the game but then they will physically wilt or the know how and experience will kick in for the other team.

This is a man's league and there is only one way out of it when a huge part of the team is made up of youngsters, and the way out of it is not through promotion.

We have had some poor games, but we've had a lot more matches where we have competed and been let down by game management. So I think the kids are good enough and doing their job by competing in the majority of matches, and they're being let down by the "senior" pros and manager who should be helping them through the key moments. I get if we doubled down and had a team full of kids we'd have the same issue and we'd excuse it as "naive". So we need to retain some senior players. But they're not doing their job. See also Knibbs with over 100 games for the 1st goal. Cut out these issues and we win a game where we had a 2 goal lead and were the better team for most of it (I.e., a game you should always win).

I feel like the club, manager and senior players are trying to gaslight everyone into thinking that this squad isn't good enough. It is, and Selles and Hutchinson are just making excuses to cover up that they're not doing their job properly.

[Snowflake Royal]

Did find it grimly amusing after 20 minutes how Mick and Dim were commenting how poor Shrewsbury were and we could win by 3 or 4, Where the fuck have they been for the last year?

Thing is, if Azeez finishes, or Smith gets his header on target, or Ballard finishes, they're right.

Instead we missed about 3 glaring chances in a row, then they brought it back to one goal and we collectively shat the bed.

[Sutekh]

Just to give a tiny bit of balance to the pile on....

The coaching isn’t all bad.

We keep getting in front in games.

It’s the mental frailty that is the real problem. That’s still largely down to the manager of course, but the combination of inexperienced players and (however much you want to dismiss it) the dire situation at the club, are contributory factors that should not be underestimated.

But then there are the utterly ridiculous substitutions and complete stupidity of playing a style that demands a lot from full/wing backs and then sticking young inexperienced central defenders into those roles

You need 2/3 experienced pros in the team as a minimum plus some leaders on the pitch, really don't see much of that happening.

He has to go!

[Royal_jimmy]

What I don't understand is if you hadn't won away in 364 days and after 90 minutes you were winning 2-1, why didn't you do everything in your power to preserve that lead?

Take it into the corner. Draw a foul. Flick it off a player to win a throw. Put your body on the line. Keep possession as without the ball they can't score. Anything.

We couldn't do that though could we. Some blame must lie with Selles but there were 11 professional footballers out there on the pitch and none of them could think independently enough to do any of the above? Why not?!?

This. There was no composure or belief at all. It's as though the players knew they were going to not win and were nervous so they made mistakes including giving the ball away back to Shrewsbury. It's basic game management they couldn't execute.

[Orion1871]

In terms of "experience", Kelvin got the ball at 2-1 and ran into the corner to tick the clock down. He gained territory and we had possession until it worked it's way back to Yiadom who tried to pump it over the top to a runner. Shrewsbury got the ball, Hutchinson lost his man.

But it's these kids without the express who are the issue? Fcuk off Hutch!

I know burning everything to the ground is not a solution, but I'd happily kick out Yiadom, Hutchinson and Dean today and replace them with Abrefa, Craig and Holmes. It's not our kids letting us down; it's the senior pros offering nothing.

It's both. The senior pros aren't performing and most of our "kids" are out of their depth. They will compete for a single half, or an hour of the game but then they will physically wilt or the know how and experience will kick in for the other team.

This is a man's league and there is only one way out of it when a huge part of the team is made up of youngsters, and the way out of it is not through promotion.

We have had some poor games, but we've had a lot more matches where we have competed and been let down by game management. So I think the kids are good enough and doing their job by competing in the majority of matches, and they're being let down by the "senior" pros and manager who should be helping them through the key moments. I get if we doubled down and had a team full of kids we'd have the same issue and we'd excuse it as "naive". So we need to retain some senior players. But they're not doing their job. See also Knibbs with over 100 games for the 1st goal. Cut out these issues and we win a game where we had a 2 goal lead and were the better team for most of it (I.e., a game you should always win).

I feel like the club, manager and senior players are trying to gaslight everyone into thinking that this squad isn't good enough. It is, and Selles and Hutchinson are just making excuses to cover up that they're not doing their job properly.

So we're basically making the same point. They compete and then the experience of the other team and the lack of game management experience of our youngsters kicks in.

This is the reality of the well worn phrase fans use when things are going wrong for a team, "put the kids in, they can't do any worse." They can do worse and sadly they are.

The faults of the likes of Dean, Hutchinson, etc are plain to see. I think we're in a situation where our senior pros are plainly past it, and they aren't helping the situation either because of that. We simply don't have enough players in the squad who are in their mid to late 20s who have experience but also the legs to play for 90 minutes and manage games.

[ILoveMoonPig]

Did find it grimly amusing after 20 minutes how Mick and Dim were commenting how poor Shrewsbury were and we could win by 3 or 4, Where the fuck have they been for the last year?

Thing is, if Azeez finishes, or Smith gets his header on target, or Ballard finishes, they're right.

Instead we missed about 3 glaring chances in a row, then they brought it back to one goal and we collectively shat the bed.

And that's not to mention how comical that first Shrewsbury goal was and how many chances we had to avoid it.

[Hound]

Did find it grimly amusing after 20 minutes how Mick and Dim were commenting how poor Shrewsbury were and we could win by 3 or 4, Where the fuck have they been for the last year?

Thing is, if Azeez finishes, or Smith gets his header on target, or Ballard finishes, they're right.

Instead we missed about 3 glaring chances in a row, then they brought it back to one goal and we collectively shat the bed.

And that's not to mention how comical that first Shrewsbury goal was and how many chances we had to avoid it.

Been the story of the seaosn hasn’t it - miss chances and then crumble. It’s mentality at both ends. A confident Azeez smashes home that goal.

Again on their first goal - poor play from Knibbs but he should be winning a foul there - he clearly gets smashed in the back - dive properly and give the ref an earful, not just look all sad and mournful and half fall over. Mentality again

[Hound]

Related to the post above, has anyone noticed how many fouls we give away compared to the opposition?

I’ve found 2 league games all season (Exeter, Burton) where the opposition conceded more. In a number of games we’ve committed twice as many

Not 100% what to read into that but it’s something. Again prob poor game management

[leon]

Thing is, if Azeez finishes, or Smith gets his header on target, or Ballard finishes, they're right.

Instead we missed about 3 glaring chances in a row, then they brought it back to one goal and we collectively shat the bed.

And that's not to mention how comical that first Shrewsbury goal was and how many chances we had to avoid it.

Been the story of the seaosn hasn’t it - miss chances and then crumble. It’s mentality at both ends. A confident Azeez smashes home that goal.

Again on their first goal - poor play from Knibbs but he should be winning a foul there - he clearly gets smashed in the back - dive properly and give the ref an earful, not just look all sad and mournful and half fall over. Mentality again

Or be a man, stay on your feet and get rid of the ball. Pathetic.

[South Coast Royal]

What I got from the Hutch interview is that he feels the younger players keep on repeating errors even when told about them and there comes a time with all players where you have to question not just their footballing ability but also whether they do what they are told.
Mind you, Hutch and the senior players are far, far from faultless but he was being asked about younger players, arm round etc.

BTW Ian, other posters and I have regularly made the point that these aren't kids picked up from the local park kick about who have never played organised football, some have played international football even.
From a very young age (too young some might say) they have played football where they have been leading 2-1 and seen a game out.
You don't have to be an old pro to understand about protecting what you have got.

My brother and I between us have watched Reading for over 120 years and I have to say that this is about the weakest mentally and physically that we have ever seen.
Even in the dark old days we had triers.
This lot have far better technical ability than many of their predecessors but they sure are a gutless lot who appear (I'm sure it's not the case and hope so) not to worry about losing football matches.

Maybe they need a stronger manager and not just one who falls out with everybody and who, in around 30 or so English league football matches here and at Southampton, has won (?) 4, and appears lost in his muddled thinking.
He needs to have time to sort out his garden.

[Clyde1998]

Before the game, that table projector I use gave us a 61% of relegation (based on xGF and xGA this season). Had we won, we'd've reduced that to 52%. Defeat means we're now at a 66% chance of relegation. Would be a lot worse if our net xG wasn't significantly better than everyone around us (excluding points deductions, we'd be 15th on net xG; 18th on result based xG - assuming any match with an xG of 1/3 between the sides is a draw).

The current final table projection is (and our result against them):

1. Portsmouth (93.8pts) - Lost 3-2 (H)
2. Peterborough (87.3pts) - Lost 1-0 (H)
3. Oxford (84.0pts)
4. Bolton (81.6pts) - Won 2-1 (H)
5. Derby (79.7pts)
6. Stevenage (72.7pts) - Won 2-0 (H)
7. Barnsley (70.6pts)
8. Lincoln (69.1pts)
9. Blackpool (68.2pts) - Lost 4-1 (A)
10. Charlton (67.4pts) - Lost 4-0 (A)
11. Wycombe (65.4pts)
12. Bristol Rovers (64.4pts) - Drew 1-1 (H)
13. Leyton Orient (60.1pts) - Lost 2-1 (A)
14. Burton (54.3pts) - Drew 0-0 (H)
15. Exeter (54.0pts) - Lost 2-1 (A)
16. Northampton (53.5pts) - Lost 3-1 (A)
17. Port Vale (52.7pts) - Lost 1-0 (A)
18. Carlisle (48.8pts)
19. Cambridge (48.5pts) - Lost 1-0 (A)
20. Wigan (48.4pts)
21. Fleetwood (46.8pts) - Lost 2-1 (H)
22. Shrewsbury (44.5pts) - Lost 3-2 (A)
23. Reading (40.5pts)
24. Cheltenham (35.4pts) - Won 1-0 (H)

We've gained more points against sides in (and expected to be in) the play-offs than against everyone else in the division combined. Worse is we've lost all our games to sides around the relegation cut-off, most of which were to late goals. If we had any sort of game management skills, we'd be likely to stay up.

[South Coast Royal]

The trouble is those wins came some time ago and we are just spiralling uncontrollably towards relegation losing to the worst teams-we need control, we need a manager.

[Clyde1998]

Thing is, if Azeez finishes, or Smith gets his header on target, or Ballard finishes, they're right.

Instead we missed about 3 glaring chances in a row, then they brought it back to one goal and we collectively shat the bed.

And that's not to mention how comical that first Shrewsbury goal was and how many chances we had to avoid it.

Been the story of the seaosn hasn’t it - miss chances and then crumble. It’s mentality at both ends. A confident Azeez smashes home that goal.

Again on their first goal - poor play from Knibbs but he should be winning a foul there - he clearly gets smashed in the back - dive properly and give the ref an earful, not just look all sad and mournful and half fall over. Mentality again

Azeez had to take it first time, although if his touch wasn't so heavy in that situation you'd've expected him to score. Ironically, for his disallowed goal early in the game, he did take it first time and it was a good finish.

Knibbs should've just been clearing the ball for their first - not trying to shepherd the ball out of play in that area of the pitch. That said, it probably should've been given as a foul for being smashed in the back. As others have pointed out, we had plenty of chances to kill the game before this though.

[Snowflake Royal]

And that's not to mention how comical that first Shrewsbury goal was and how many chances we had to avoid it.

Been the story of the seaosn hasn’t it - miss chances and then crumble. It’s mentality at both ends. A confident Azeez smashes home that goal.

Again on their first goal - poor play from Knibbs but he should be winning a foul there - he clearly gets smashed in the back - dive properly and give the ref an earful, not just look all sad and mournful and half fall over. Mentality again

Azeez had to take it first time, although if his touch wasn't so heavy in that situation you'd've expected him to score. Ironically, for his disallowed goal early in the game, he did take it first time and it was a good finish.

Knibbs should've just been clearing the ball for their first - not trying to shepherd the ball out of play in that area of the pitch. That said, it probably should've been given as a foul for being smashed in the back. As others have pointed out, we had plenty of chances to kill the game before this though.

Thing is the ref was never going to give a foul. He let a double hand push go in the first 5 minutes, followed by a literal rugby tackle.

And those sorts of attempts to sheppard out are always physical battles, in doing it you set yourself up to resist, so if you buckle it's just because you're weak. And the oxf*rd idiot put himself between the ball and the line anyway, so even if he stayed up its him that kept the ball in play.

[Fezza]

Would a team of;

Button
Yiadom, Holmes, TMac, NGW
Azeez, Hutch, Wing, Knibbs
Smith, Ehibhatiomhan

...not offer more experience and far more chance of getting our of the division? Yes some of those are injured at the moment but they could have helped us up until this point. I'm all for playing the kids, but one or two at a time, not 7!

[Snowflake Royal]

Would a team of;

Button
Yiadom, Holmes, TMac, NGW
Azeez, Hutch, Wing, Knibbs
Smith, Ehibhatiomhan

...not offer more experience and far more chance of getting our of the division? Yes some of those are injured at the moment but they could have helped us up until this point. I'm all for playing the kids, but one or two at a time, not 7!

No pace in centre defence, which is a big problem.

Hutchinson was at fault for a goal. Knibbs was at fault for a goal and missed a great chance last week. Azeez's confidence is as shot as anyone's.

We'll probably start ok, then get picked off on the break and fall apart.

[Royals and Racers]

The only result i had on another cr@p away match was the train was late leaving Shrewsbury and missed the connection at Birmingham NS and had to wait 1 hour for the next train and therefore have claimed compensation (100% of single fare) between Shrewsbury and Reading.
As an aside i don’t know how Cross Country trains get away with the gross overcrowding on their Saturday trains.

[Fezza]

Would a team of;

Button
Yiadom, Holmes, TMac, NGW
Azeez, Hutch, Wing, Knibbs
Smith, Ehibhatiomhan

...not offer more experience and far more chance of getting our of the division? Yes some of those are injured at the moment but they could have helped us up until this point. I'm all for playing the kids, but one or two at a time, not 7!

No pace in centre defence, which is a big problem.

Hutchinson was at fault for a goal. Knibbs was at fault for a goal and missed a great chance last week. Azeez's confidence is as shot as anyone's.

We'll probably start ok, then get picked off on the break and fall apart.

Abbey for TMac and move TMac in for Hutch?

[Snowflake Royal]

Would a team of;

Button
Yiadom, Holmes, TMac, NGW
Azeez, Hutch, Wing, Knibbs
Smith, Ehibhatiomhan

...not offer more experience and far more chance of getting our of the division? Yes some of those are injured at the moment but they could have helped us up until this point. I'm all for playing the kids, but one or two at a time, not 7!

No pace in centre defence, which is a big problem.

Hutchinson was at fault for a goal. Knibbs was at fault for a goal and missed a great chance last week. Azeez's confidence is as shot as anyone's.

We'll probably start ok, then get picked off on the break and fall apart.

Abbey for TMac and move TMac in for Hutch?

If they weren’t both left footed I'd 100% play Abbey and McIntyre at CB when both fit.

But I don't see any point talking about McIntyre. He's weeks away from fitness.

I see two options right now.

1) Pick a full first team for the next league game and play them against Arsenal U23s in the Trophy, drilling them all tracking, playing to the whistle and passing and moving in midfield. Hope you can get them a cup win to boost confidence.

2) Play a full reserve side against Arsenal, untainted by the league performances and tell them if they play well and win, they’re the new first team. Then hope, and ease back some of the senior players as appropriate one or two at a time over weeks. If they lose, you've been drilling your first team away from games for two weeks

My 'first team' right now would focus on who is calmest and most positive.

So, let's say option 1:

.....................Button
Yiadom, Dorsett, Abbey, NGW
...............Wing........Craig
Vickers........Savage.........Ballard
.....................Smith

Option 2:

.....................Pereira
Abrefa, Holmes, Bindon, Carson
.............Rushesha, Craig
.Vickers.........Elliott..........Camara
...............Ehibhatiomhan

[Lower West]

What I got from the Hutch interview is that he feels the younger players keep on repeating errors even when told about them and there comes a time with all players where you have to question not just their footballing ability but also whether they do what they are told.

Why so many technically gifted young players. End up playing for non professional teams. Maturity comes with age and experience. Return to the lower professional leagues later in their careers.