For every yob we get rid of, we gain a family of four

[Wycombe Royal]

I don't agree with football being used as a vehicle for political correctness, and as something that appears to want to symbolise modern 2.4 family life.
I think it should be allowed to be what it is.
As long as people aren't breaking any laws (inc Discrimination ones) then whats the harm in getting passionate about your team, and having a bit of banter with the away fans?

I have no issue with most of what goes on at football matches, and kids will generally hear worse stuff in the playground.

What I do hate is the selfish attitude of the minority who want to stand and don't care if they block someone elses view.

Football clubs have are tailoring their stadiums and the "experience" it provides to the biggest market, and unfortunately for some that isn't single young men. Families spend more money and get more bums on seats, you only need to see the attendance increases despite huge price hikes to see that.

If in the furure it changes, then clubs will change with it. It is the same in any business. If you don't align yourself with your market you will struggle to get customers.

I don't agree with people standing in front of kids - the only way to stop people standing is to either ban them all and cause a lot of resentment, or cater for those people by lobbying for standing areas.
Wherever there is conflict, its only going to be solved in a sensible way where both parties are satisfied.
While Standing areas may be a pipe-dream, I think that if they were re-introduced, we wouldn't get such big discussions about yobs and passion because all those yobs would be in together and wouldn't be upsetting others by standing in front of them.

I don't have a problem with the club catering for families, but I wish they wouldn't treat the single young man with such disdain - instead of trying to remove them by banning, or by 'encouraging them away' perhaps they could cater for them as well and preserve a bit of the club's older, and almost certainly more passionate fanbase. As long as no laws are being broken, and people are behaving considerately, then whats the harm in that?

Sadly I guess we're looking for a utopian footballing environment that probably isn't going to happen, and we'll just have to put up with the inevitable conflicts that will come.

Unfortunately where you have a reserved seating policy someone is going to have to move seats to seats which do not have the same perspective as they had originally - that is a huge stumbling block.

[wehateoxford]

because clearly theres a difference between political correctness and racism....

You mean being racist is no longer politically acceptable?

errr no

[TFF]

because clearly theres a difference between political correctness and racism....

You mean being racist is no longer politically acceptable?

errr no

So it's OK then?

[wehateoxford]

i feel a bit trapped here so i should make myself clear

being racist /homophobic or whatever is not ok, you shouldnt discriminate on basis of colour of skin, sex, gender etc

however, those labelled racist or whatever arent necessarily. theres as many nutters on the 'moral' side of this arguement as there are on the racist side

political correctness has gone to far now, and is a vehicle for people to attack any cultural preference they would. they label football fans 'yobs' and 'politcially incorrect' when in truth its them who are politically incorrect for trying to impose there beliefs on a society based on free will

most yobs arent racist etc, but here i feel like im being treated like one (a racist and a yob)

[SpaceCruiser]

I don't agree with people standing in front of kids - the only way to stop people standing is to either ban them all and cause a lot of resentment, or cater for those people by lobbying for standing areas.

Kids should sit near the front.

[wehateoxford]

i think that standupsitdown guys right, just have seperate areas for standing and sitting, a safe area for kids to sit in, not have there view blocked and not hear that horrible language that most of them already know

[Wycombe Royal]

I don't agree with people standing in front of kids - the only way to stop people standing is to either ban them all and cause a lot of resentment, or cater for those people by lobbying for standing areas.

Kids should sit near the front.

Why?

[SpaceCruiser]

I don't agree with people standing in front of kids - the only way to stop people standing is to either ban them all and cause a lot of resentment, or cater for those people by lobbying for standing areas.

Kids should sit near the front.

Why?

Better view, unlikely to have people sitting in front of you standing up.

When I was a kid at Elm Park, I always went to the front of the South Bank.

[Wycombe Royal]

I don't agree with people standing in front of kids - the only way to stop people standing is to either ban them all and cause a lot of resentment, or cater for those people by lobbying for standing areas.

Kids should sit near the front.

Why?

Better view, unlikely to have people sitting in front of you standing up.

When I was a kid at Elm Park, I always went to the front of the South Bank.

It may have escaped your notice but the Madejski is all seater so people standing in front of kids should not be a problem. And the view isn't necessarily better. I prefer the view from the top of the stand and I'm sure some kids think the same.

[SpaceCruiser]

I prefer the view from the back too, but when you're sitting at the front, you're unlikely to stand up from excitement as others near you won't be doing the same.

[Wycombe Royal]

I prefer the view from the back too, but when you're sitting at the front, you're unlikely to stand up from excitement as others near you won't be doing the same.

I don't think that is the issue - persistent standing is.

[westendgirl]

I don't have a problem with the club catering for families, but I wish they wouldn't treat the single young man with such disdain - instead of trying to remove them by banning, or by 'encouraging them away' perhaps they could cater for them as well and preserve a bit of the club's older, and almost certainly more passionate fanbase. As long as no laws are being broken, and people are behaving considerately, then whats the harm in that?

Sadly I guess we're looking for a utopian footballing environment that probably isn't going to happen, and we'll just have to put up with the inevitable conflicts that will come.

I know there is a perception on here that all our current fan base has only just discovered football but how can you honestly imply that the single young man is part of the club's older fanbase? Or have I misunderstood you? Where I sit there are a lot of passionate football fans (though to be fair not necessarily the chanting sort) who have been Reading fans for decades and quite frankly the women at least equal if not outnumber the men. But that is not the 'traditional' fan is it?

I just wish more people would allow others to come to a football match to enjoy it in their own way and respect the ways others want to enjoy it. That includes not standing in front of those who either don't want to stand or cannot and equally not stopping people from singing and chanting.

I think those who insist they know best and everyone should behave like them have very limited imagination.

Having said that I thought the idea of a family of four for each yob is more about those who really want to come for a fight or do not understand that laws about alcohol at football (which apply throughout the game after all not just at Reading) and are anti-social in their behaviour not just people who happen to be young and want to sing and chant. Surely that misunderstanding of the word yob is too prevalent in everyone else who does not support football without those of us on here joining into the erroneous stereotype?

[Skin]

I'm sorry but I stand quite frequently (at the back) and I don't consider myself a yob.
Fortunantely for me there are like minded fans around me who also stand and no small children behind. I would go as far as saying you should expect to have to stand a lot more if you want a view the whole time nearer the back. There is a bloke who always brings his kid on his lap along our row and he loves standing and being passionate with it, he simply lifts his kid up so he can see too and explains whats happening. The kid loves it. Its called enjoying the occasion and being prepared to get on with the majotriy around you. Equally down the front where most people remain seated you have to expect complaints if you stand all the time.
Surely this is just common sense though? When you elect to sit nearer the back do you really think people are suddenly just going to stop standing so frequently? It will always be the same so whydidn't people seat themselves accordingly?
Now rise.

[Tilehurst Road]

Is it any teenager who goes to the football with a group of mates?

Given the treatment received by a number of us at the front of t'East Stand last season and having been informed briefly about the security measures being put in place for next season and beyond; I'd say so.

[Wycombe Royal]

I'm sorry but I stand quite frequently (at the back) and I don't consider myself a yob.
Fortunantely for me there are like minded fans around me who also stand and no small children behind. I would go as far as saying you should expect to have to stand a lot more if you want a view the whole time nearer the back. There is a bloke who always brings his kid on his lap along our row and he loves standing and being passionate with it, he simply lifts his kid up so he can see too and explains whats happening. The kid loves it. Its called enjoying the occasion and being prepared to get on with the majotriy around you. Equally down the front where most people remain seated you have to expect complaints if you stand all the time.
Surely this is just common sense though? When you elect to sit nearer the back do you really think people are suddenly just going to stop standing so frequently? It will always be the same so whydidn't people seat themselves accordingly?
Now rise.

Fair enough and that is one isolated area and one individual parent. It is not easy to move your seats due to the high numbers of season tickets that are sold and if it is, for example a family of 3 or 4 it will be nearly impossible to move to other decent seats.

If everyone in your area is happy with standing then fine, but if there is just one person who doesn't want to stand then he.she has his right to sit down and not have his/her view obstructed. He/she bought the ticket for a seat in an all seater stadium.

[Skin]

I'm sorry but I stand quite frequently (at the back) and I don't consider myself a yob.
Fortunantely for me there are like minded fans around me who also stand and no small children behind. I would go as far as saying you should expect to have to stand a lot more if you want a view the whole time nearer the back. There is a bloke who always brings his kid on his lap along our row and he loves standing and being passionate with it, he simply lifts his kid up so he can see too and explains whats happening. The kid loves it. Its called enjoying the occasion and being prepared to get on with the majotriy around you. Equally down the front where most people remain seated you have to expect complaints if you stand all the time.
Surely this is just common sense though? When you elect to sit nearer the back do you really think people are suddenly just going to stop standing so frequently? It will always be the same so whydidn't people seat themselves accordingly?
Now rise.

Fair enough and that is one isolated area and one individual parent. It is not easy to move your seats due to the high numbers of season tickets that are sold and if it is, for example a family of 3 or 4 it will be nearly impossible to move to other decent seats.

If everyone in your area is happy with standing then fine, but if there is just one person who doesn't want to stand then he.she has his right to sit down and not have his/her view obstructed. He/she bought the ticket for a seat in an all seater stadium.

I agree to an extent but I'm sure regular ST families would have noticed whats happening as attendences increased in the last few years and could have done something about it if they were really that bothered by it. I'm sure you agree that you shouldn't have to but there were plenty of spare seats this time last year before the 'plastic rush' at Christmas when loads of families got seats together (Y26 a good examle of this).
I'm just saying if its a minority spoiling it where you sit fair enough, they need to respect people around them, but if it's a majority then your in for long season, I'd just get on with it and be grateful that I'm there watching the Prem at all.

[wehateoxford]

I know there is a perception on here that all our current fan base has only just discovered football but how can you honestly imply that the single young man is part of the club's older fanbase? Or have I misunderstood you? Where I sit there are a lot of passionate football fans (though to be fair not necessarily the chanting sort) who have been Reading fans for decades and quite frankly the women at least equal if not outnumber the men. But that is not the 'traditional' fan is it?

I just wish more people would allow others to come to a football match to enjoy it in their own way and respect the ways others want to enjoy it. That includes not standing in front of those who either don't want to stand or cannot and equally not stopping people from singing and chanting.

I

i think you hit the nail on the head here but theres too many areas of imbalance, like the middle of stands where everyones getting annoyed with each other.

Also, im only twenty but have been watching reading since i was about 7, i know to many people on here i'd get a dodding for not knowing who was top goal scorer in the 96 season. but i still feel like a proper traditional reading fan, because ever since i've been to reading theres been young men around twenty sat there. I also feel my support is no less valid because im younger, i could only have been supporting reading for a max of say 16 years with any understanding of what supporting football is, and i've supported reading for 13 of them.

[Dirk Gently]

Indeed - it takes all sorts. And the "you're not a real supporter if you don't stand up and chant" brigade are as bad as teh "sit down and don't make any noise" brigade.

It takes all sorts, and there are many people, like me, who did our standing up and chanting for the club in the 70's and 80's on the terraces at Elm Park, Wimbledon, the Manor Ground, Griffin Park and many other grounds. Because we don't now support in the same way we did when we were younger doesn't make us any less valid and active supporters.

[wehateoxford]

definatley, there's a old irish guy (not you is it?) who sits pretty much next to me, one of the maddest reading fans i know, prone to standing but not shouting... got real heart

[westendgirl]

Also, im only twenty but have been watching reading since i was about 7, i know to many people on here i'd get a dodding for not knowing who was top goal scorer in the 96 season. but i still feel like a proper traditional reading fan, because ever since i've been to reading theres been young men around twenty sat there. I also feel my support is no less valid because im younger, i could only have been supporting reading for a max of say 16 years with any understanding of what supporting football is, and i've supported reading for 13 of them.

I would agree that you cannot say your support is less valid because you are young, but it does seem that some think it is less valid if you do not conform to whatever stereotype they want to choose and the obvious one is the young single man.

As a matter of interest do you think you will still be a Reading supporter when you are no longer young and single - when there are other calls on your time and money? If yes, do you think you will still enjoy football in the way you do now? When you are in your 70s and cannot stand for long without backache and your voice is no longer strong enough to chant are you less of a supporter? Or could it just be that these people who have really been there throughout the years have shown the real dedication of a football supporter. And no I am not 70+ but I do know several who are.

I just wish people would use a little imagination to put themselves in others shoes and cut them some slack. As I said before this applies equally to the shut up brigade as to the stand up brigade.