That was fun, NOT - still at least we know there is a plan B, wait until we score then bring on a striker - that worked well

PS How does Joey get in the team ahead of Bacuna - he was dire this evening.

Every team has periods of being complete crap so its slightly too early to panic. That said, so far the people questioning the unbalanced signings this transfer window are being proved right. The team looks a mess. We've had well over a year to master the style of passing/possession football Stam wants and its much like the old Swansea team under Brendan Rodgers. The difference is they were playing with movement, pace, momentum and had people to score goals that opposing teams hated. We don't play with any of those attributes, thats the concerning thing. We actually look to be getting worse from the streams i've seen, can't even imagine how bad it is in person. I'd give Stam until christmas but he's had a significant amount of money to improve the team, albeit not in the right areas, and we look completely useless.

JvB was solid tonight, GMac was less than hopeless. Did you actually go to the game?

'Solid' being the operative word - which probably led to the chants about a 'fat bar steward'

Yes, I was there...... for 85 minutes

There were no such chants from where I was standing. Still I note you dodged commenting on GMac who was again totally anonymous.

I keep reading about a "Plan B'
CAN SOMEONE TELL ME WHAT FKING PLAN A IS??? Because I'm dammed sure I don't get it

Even the Milwall fans were chanting "Boring boring Reading"
It was just as tedious as Saturday with the same tactics.

I have to say I am totally bemused at the moment and not even bothered about the Norwich game. I thought I was a die hard but even I am fed up with the pathetic rubbish on display.

I was at the game. Even if we had won tonight I was going to come on here and have a good moan. Tonight's game typified everything that is wrong with our team at the moment. We don't look like a proper football team. The possession is pointless. Whenever we get into attacking areas there is no one in the box. There is no one to play it to. We don't know how to attack teams. And to lose the game from a winning position with just 10 minutes left. We are toothless, we are pointless, we are timid, we are soft, we are just pathetic at the moment.

I don't think Stam is helping either. He creates inconsistency by changing the team so often.
When we stumble across a formula for playing football that looked really good against Villa and Birmingham why not try and continue with that. Why change it up so often? One minute we look like world beaters. The next, we're useless. I think we could have done with Kelly on the pitch tonight.

Let's get this straight, Stam choked at Wembley last season. I've dwelt a lot on what happened that day and I cannot get away from the fact that we didn't set ourselves up in any way to get a result that day. There was barely any forward motion, no penetration whatsoever and a lot of listless backwards and sideways passing whilst waiting for Huddersfield to come and press, take the ball and threaten. Far from learning from that day, Stam seems to think that is how we should be playing. Gone is any of the incisiveness we showed last season, gone is the zip, enthusiasm, attacking mentality and passion we showed; and all of that can be attributed to Stam.

His substitutions are f*cking bizarre, his tactics are negative, his demeanour is totally transformed from that of the passionate, inspirational leader we saw last term. In short, I think HE'S been left rattled by the playoff defeat more than any of the players and he's projecting it onto them. We have a good squad (minus a striker, and don't get me started on that again). Stam needs to pull himself together and pronto.

First away game for donkeys years.

Slightly surprised at the change in approach early on, but the lack of vertical attacking intent remains and we don't seem to have an identity from game to game.

I'd also say that what I find strange at them moment is that we have good players, but we are not a good team.

Reading have usually been the opposite, the team was always much better than the individual players, on the whole...

Big test of management ahead

You put it more eloquently, but this as well

I thought the support was fantastic away to Millwall tonight. We had some good numbers there. It was good to see so many youngsters. Lots of Teens and early twenties in the crowd kitted up in their designer gear and making lots of noise. There were plenty of blokes who had finished work in London and got down for the game after work still suited up. We had a few of the old'uns as well putting it in for us. The backing of the team was absolutely first class. Having support like that makes me proud to be a Reading fan. Keep it up lads.

Are we missing Steven Reid's coaching input?

Absolutely spot on mate.

One of the saddest days in the history of the club. If we'd have had a go and lost, it would have been disappointing but that's how football goes. The fact we played one of the most negative game plans in the history of playoff finals will always leave a bitter taste in my mouth. We got exactly what we deserved.

We may well be.

One of the saddest days in the history of the club. If we'd have had a go and lost, it would have been disappointing but that's how football goes. The fact we played one of the most negative game plans in the history of playoff finals will always leave a bitter taste in my mouth. We got exactly what we deserved.

I can see the story in May. Last year Reading were a spot kick away from the prem. They now face life in div 1 an uncertain future bankrupt points deductions and oblivion.

this is bollox

McCleary looks a shadow of his former self. Just entirely ineffectual. Don't want to see him starting again anytime soon, but the same can be said for a lot of the team.

VDB was ok I thought. A lot of misplaced passes but I felt got better as the game went on, certainly seemed to be driving us on a bit and was the only one who would take a one touch pass and then instantly make a run.

New chant for Norwich game:

Jaap Stam had a dream to build a football team,
Illori at the back.
No one in attack.
Jip jap Jaap Stam

Stil, over 60% possesion. Isnt that what really counts?

Is it any wonder that Dutch football is in decline with tactics like Stam's, (DeBoer at Palace was given the boot quickly). The football served up is all pretty and neat but is not what is needed in the Championship. We have no passion for the game. Where is the SPIRIT, TENACITY, FLAIR?

Is it pretty and neat though? Throughout a game there might be one or two really intricate passages of play (that envariably end up on the edge of the box before turning back and then losing it), but by and large the play is ponderous and slow, indecisive, inaccurate and wholly frustrating.

I think Stam did such a good job last year he has earned the right to sort this mess out. But it is a mess, largely of his own making

i think we can all see the issues so no point repeating them all, but he needs to accept he has been wrong and change things around

We can still be a good side. The players are all good players. The tactics, in game managemenT and prep have been rubbish.

Would just like to say in Stam's defence here that Bacuna picked up a minor knee injury last week which is why he was not involved v Hull and only on the bench last night. Expecting him to return to the team on Saturday (unless he's crocked again).

Which is the other thing - why do Reading players continually get injuries. i know you get knocks in games, that's to be expected, but it just seems there are an inordinate amount that get picked up in training or from seemingly very minor things on the pitch. Perhaps the club need to review their training and physio practices.

Still with Pards. Sack Stam and bring Alan back. Or Mark McGhee......

Performance sounded better than the hideous cr@p served up v Hull but still couldn't hold on to a result against yet another indifferent team.

But then Stam seems to be making a rod for his own back currently - and then there's that hideous away league record Reading have for midweek games since August 2012 (P27, W2, D8, L17) so think they were always going to be lucky to get anything.

That is an unbelievably shocking stat - 2 wins out of 27 !!!

Well that was more than a little disappointing. First off we weren't great going forward, again. However, there seemed to be a plan to keep very tight, frustrate the home team and slowly ramp up the speed of play, pressure as the game went on. We were playing with more purpose in the 2nd half and moving the ball quicker but without any real threat.

However, we took the lead via the sort of goal Edwards was bought in to score and with 15mins to go and 1-0 up that should have been that (and last season would have been) but for some reason, we defended a fairly straightforward corner poorly and Millwall were back in the game. When the winner came, it wasn't through any real cranking up of pressure just sloppy defensive play....again.

1-0 up away with that little time to go, there should only have been 1 result.

Am still a fan of Stam and he deserves the chance to correct this but you get the feeling the window is closing. Norwich is now a must win as you look at October and think ouch. We need the confidence of a decent win to take into Leeds and Sheff Utd (A). You would have to say we are not far away from any chance of promotion already going.

Stam wants to play his way and it can be effective, however, 8 of the players who started that game yesterday were his signings as were 4 on the bench (and Kelly came through under Stam) so if this team cannot play this way effectively then it goes without saying that you either have to start questioning the tactics or if we have recruited the right players since Stam arrived.

So. Not good. I know a lot of people toss Stam out about on here because it's funny or their trying to get a rise but for the people who actually mean it, it's getting hard to defend against.

Team shape was negative. Why 3 CBs against a shite team? It wasn't necessary. Why, again, a deep lying forward SO deep lying he spent the majority of our attacking phases trying to get back up front? JVDB again? Whats the loyalty for Stam? He slows down our attacks by dawdling on the ball and mostly passes to opposition players..

Floating front 3 doesn't work if your front 3 can't shoot.. Millwall defended well against us but tbh a team of unfit nobbers could probably defend against us atm. We were predictable and ponderous.

No Swift, no Kelly, no Kermorgant, no Bacuna, no Barrow, no Obita and no Evans is the only reason I am remaining positive about this season.

Mannone - I have to re-watch the highlights but he was caught out of position I think for both goals. Poor guy.
Gunter - not a great game.. can't be too harsh or the 'Gunter is great' brigade will come out swinging but he was pretty ineffectual.
McShane - as the captain he should have done better. We were in dire need of someone to give us a boot up the are.
Moore - few unnecessary fouls and quite tame efforts at times.
Ilori - much better in than JVDB was last match.
Blackett - it feels like we attack up the left hand side most and I don't know why when it's Blackett and Beerens...
Edwards - don't let the goal fool you. He was shite.
JVDB - don't let the effort fool you. He is shite.
McCleary - needs to pull the finger out.
Beerens - a luxury player. Plays best when we are 2 goals up. Plays poorly when we need to score.
Aluko - thus far the complete waste of money people said he would be. Exactly as frustrating as Fulham fans warned he would be. Heavy touches and can't shoot.

Subs were so late it's pointless rating them. Although you could argue the starters were so poor it's not worth rating them either.

Topflight you are spot on. Most successful teams have a settled side whereas Stam very rarely plays the same 11 from one game to the next. Rather than keeping everyone jeed up, this is very unsettling for a squad because players cannot feel confident of playing 2 games in a row even if they were man of the match in the first game. He has had over 60 games with the squad plus training so he should know his starting eleven. As one example surely he can see that following lengthy injury spells GMac has lost the turn of pace necessary to play the pacey winger role let alone be a natural centre forward.